QueenZone discussion #1194175

tay120 wrote: WHen someone once pointed out that Freddie was instructing him on his guitar playing during the making of "One Vision" he also got really defensive.

For instance, he made a big deal about how, during the line "shiver down my spine" in "Bohemian Rhapsody" he apparently added some special noise with his guitar.  In fact, it turns out that this "special sound" was made by a percussion instrument called a bell tree and not by his guitar at all!

By the way, remember the credit thing during Miracle/Innuendo sessions. So, no way of thinking of him as you put it.

Sir GH wrote:You won't believe how many people have used that one single video as "proof" that Freddie controlled the band's songwriting throughout their entire career.  The song was a band collaboration, so they were helping each other out.......

Ken8 wrote: also see the quote from John IIRC suggesting that they went with whoever had a strong idea, and Freddie had most of the strong ideas.

...also note their lack of success in coming up with anything that amounts to anything much since his demise....

tay120 wrote: In fact, it turns out that this "special sound" was made by a percussion instrument called a bell tree and not by his guitar at all!

tay120 wrote: Is it just me or does Brian May seem overly obsessed with songwriting credits. For instance, he made a big deal about how he played for like 2 seconds at the beginning of one of the songs in "Chinese Democracy" and then didn't get credited. WHen someone once pointed out that Freddie was instructing him on his guitar playing during the making of "One Vision" he also got really defensive. Other times, it appears that he invents contributions that don't even exist. For instance, he made a big deal about how, during the line "shiver down my spine" in "Bohemian Rhapsody" he apparently added some special noise with his guitar. In fact, it turns out that this "special sound" was made by a percussion instrument called a bell tree and not by his guitar at all!

Sebastian wrote: If so... why is now IWIA credited to 'May' only, and The Miracle and Invisible Man are still 'Queen'?

Sir GH wrote:

Ken8 wrote: also see the quote from John IIRC suggesting that they went with whoever had a strong idea, and Freddie had most of the strong ideas.

Of course... nobody's denying that Freddie was a major creative force in the band.  But it certainly wasn't always his desires that were met.

...also note their lack of success in coming up with anything that amounts to anything much since his demise....

Fair enough.  But also note the Mr. Bad Guy album... it was Freddie without Queen, and it showed, often painfully.  They were a band of 4 very different individuals who were very good each in their own right, but an excellent, world-class combination when put together.  It's just publicly misunderstood that Freddie was at the helm of everything with the final word when that certainly wasn't the case.

Ken8 wrote: As much as I love "Queen" I can also see the loss of Mercury as THE worst thing that could've happened.  As much as I hate to say it, creatively the band would've overcome the loss of any other member with more success and credibility.

bhm0129ad wrote:   Perhaps it is all just to do with money. The decision to share the credits was possibly a way of sharing the royalties equally, thus ending Queen's notorious arguments about who earns what.   After Freddie died and John quit PERHAPS Brian is sick of 'his' money going to a dead man's estate (run by a woman who has pissed on Freddie's memory and wishes in many ways) and to a Bassman who clearly has no positive feelings towards his 'brothers' of twenty years.   I am only speculating of course.   On the other hand, as has been said, Brian has every right to say if HE wrote this or that song, as does Roger or any other artist for that matter.  

bhm0129ad wrote: Perhaps it is all just to do with money. The decision to share the credits was possibly a way of sharing the royalties equally, thus ending Queen's notorious arguments about who earns what. After Freddie died and John quit PERHAPS Brian is sick of 'his' money going to a dead man's estate (run by a woman who has pissed on Freddie's memory and wishes in many ways) and to a Bassman who clearly has no positive feelings towards his 'brothers' of twenty years. I am only speculating of course. On the other hand, as has been said, Brian has every right to say if HE wrote this or that song, as does Roger or any other artist for that matter.

Holly2003 wrote: The reason why song writing credits is important -- and why changing them much afterwards is a dubious practice -- is because Fred isn't around any more to dispute what's goin on. They agreed, at one point, to share songwriting credits as 'Queen' instead of individually, and that's the way it should stay. Brian was happy enough to do that when the decision was made so what's changed in the meantime? Claiming songs now leaves him open to all sorts of bad interpretations. It's one thing for Brian to say that he wrote IWIA, for example -- I don't think anyone would have a problem with that -- it's another thing entirely to 'officially' change songwriting credits on album covers. 

  Ken8 wrote:  

      Sir GH wrote:      

                                                                                                                              Ken8 wrote:                                                               also see the quote from John IIRC suggesting that they went with whoever had a strong idea, and Freddie had most of the strong ideas.                                                              

Of course... nobody's denying that Freddie was a major creative force in the band.  But it certainly wasn't always his desires that were met.

...also note their lack of success in coming up with anything that amounts to anything much since his demise....

Fair enough.  But also note the Mr. Bad Guy album... it was Freddie without Queen, and it showed, often painfully.  They were a band of 4 very different individuals who were very good each in their own right, but an excellent, world-class combination when put together.  It's just publicly misunderstood that Freddie was at the helm of everything with the final word when that certainly wasn't the case.

Yes, and funnily enough Fred was usually the first to say so.  There's been a lot said since his demise though despite their inability to prove themselves without him. I like how "Mr Bad Guy" is trotted out as some sort of disaster.  And how the success of "Barcelona" and "Great Pretender" are conveniently overlooked, along with just about any posthumous Freddie release, Queen or solo. As much as I love "Queen" I can also see the loss of Mercury as THE worst thing that could've happened.  As much as I hate to say it, creatively the band would've overcome the loss of any other member with more success and credibility.

bhm0129ad wrote: After Freddie died and John quit PERHAPS Brian is sick of 'his' money going to a dead man's estate (run by a woman who has pissed on Freddie's memory and wishes in many ways) and to a Bassman who clearly has no positive feelings towards his 'brothers' of twenty years. I am only speculating of course.

Holly2003 wrote: The reason why song writing credits is important -- and why changing them much afterwards is a dubious practice -- is because Fred isn't around any more to dispute what's goin on. They agreed, at one point, to share songwriting credits as 'Queen' instead of individually, and that's the way it should stay.

Oberon wrote: My point being that Fred was a great singer songwriter and musician, but I really don't think he'd be the legend he is if he hadn't met 3 guys and made a band called Queen. It just wouldn't have happened for him. I really believe that, and that's why I really think you can't dispel the input of John, Roger and particularly Brian.

mike hunt wrote: a bad light to who?....we all know Queen went to shit after freddie died, but know cares about all this other stuff like writing credits and all that.  Only a few die hard fans care about that. People who need to get a life.

Ken8 wrote:

  mike hunt wrote: a bad light to who?....we all know Queen went to shit after freddie died, but know cares about all this other stuff like writing credits and all that.  Only a few die hard fans care about that. People who need to get a life.

Give me a break.  It's called respect for a much missed member of the band.  It's called principle. Grown up stuff.

Ken8 wrote:

bhm0129ad wrote: After Freddie died and John quit PERHAPS Brian is sick of 'his' money going to a dead man's estate (run by a woman who has pissed on Freddie's memory and wishes in many ways) and to a Bassman who clearly has no positive feelings towards his 'brothers' of twenty years. I am only speculating of course.

I hope so, because your suggestion makes Brian out to be a COMPLETE asshole.  There's been far too much rewriting of history as it is lately.

bhm0129ad wrote:

Ken8 wrote:

bhm0129ad wrote: After Freddie died and John quit PERHAPS Brian is sick of 'his' money going to a dead man's estate (run by a woman who has pissed on Freddie's memory and wishes in many ways) and to a Bassman who clearly has no positive feelings towards his 'brothers' of twenty years. I am only speculating of course.

I hope so, because your suggestion makes Brian out to be a COMPLETE asshole.  There's been far too much rewriting of history as it is lately.

If you must know, I am more of a fan of  Brian than Freddie so YOU may think my comments make him look like an asshole, but I (as the poster of the remark) certainly did not see or mean it that way. I was merely pointing ouit what is called a POSSIBILITY - one amongst many others being posted here. I think the OP makes brian out to look like an asshole too but there you go.

Ken8 wrote: ...and Mike, again as much as I hate to say it, the reality is had Brian May passed away in 1991, there wouldn't have been a sell out "Brian May Tribute Concert" at Wembley seen by billions around the world, no matter how great a tragedy it would've been.

Ken8 wrote:

Zebonka12 wrote: But isn't that decision up to Roger and whoever it is that speaks for Freddie these days?

Not that I have even the foggiest clue whether there'd be a legal barrier stopping Brian from doing such a thing.  Surely it'd be up to someone else? Besides which, Innuendo is a poor example.  "I Want It All" was basically a finished song.  "Innuendo" was completed as a group - true, there are other examples which are more Freddie-based and are still credited to the group, but I thought I'd just point that out.

Zebonka12 wrote: I don't follow this thread at all.  Acknowledging Brian's importance to the band is not a slight on Freddie's significance...

Ken8 wrote:

bhm0129ad wrote:

Ken8 wrote:

bhm0129ad wrote: After Freddie died and John quit PERHAPS Brian is sick of 'his' money going to a dead man's estate (run by a woman who has pissed on Freddie's memory and wishes in many ways) and to a Bassman who clearly has no positive feelings towards his 'brothers' of twenty years. I am only speculating of course.

I hope so, because your suggestion makes Brian out to be a COMPLETE asshole.  There's been far too much rewriting of history as it is lately.

If you must know, I am more of a fan of  Brian than Freddie so YOU may think my comments make him look like an asshole, but I (as the poster of the remark) certainly did not see or mean it that way. I was merely pointing ouit what is called a POSSIBILITY - one amongst many others being posted here. I think the OP makes brian out to look like an asshole too but there you go.

Sheesh.  You're more a fan of Brian?  No shit? You said it was speculation on your part, and I said I hope so.  Get it? And sorry but if there was any truth in what you call a POSSIBILITY, then it makes Brian out to be an asshole.  And that's why I said I hope it was speculation. Yeah, you're a real great fan of Brian May.  I wouldn't even entertain the POSSIBILITY that May would change writing credits for the reason you've speculated. Get it yet?

bhm0129ad wrote: You would not entertain such thoughts cos you are blind enough to think that just because they are great musicians that that makes them infallible .. GET IT?  "Ooh, Brian, Roger , John and Freddie simply MUST have been absolutely wonderful and amazing and PERFECT human beings who could NEVER EVER have a any negative thoughts whatsoever.." GET REAL. I 'GOT' what you said in the first place numpty. 

Zebonka12 wrote: My way of thinking is that if there's no money in it, that he probably just had a bizarre, very-human moment where he felt like a bit of recognition.  That's purely speculative of course. 

Ken8 wrote:

bhm0129ad wrote: You would not entertain such thoughts cos you are blind enough to think that just because they are great musicians that that makes them infallible .. GET IT?  "Ooh, Brian, Roger , John and Freddie simply MUST have been absolutely wonderful and amazing and PERFECT human beings who could NEVER EVER have a any negative thoughts whatsoever.." GET REAL. I 'GOT' what you said in the first place numpty. 

LOL!!! Talk about being totally clueless! It may be said that May & Taylor have made some dubious decisions of late. The difference is I don't believe that May would sink to the level YOU think he could. ....and you're his big fan apparently. It's just too funny for words What an idiot.  Brian May must be proud to have fans like you.

mike hunt wrote: real mature guys

Angeline wrote: bhm0129ad ------ 'pissed on Freddie's memory' 'his money going to a dead man's estate' PLEASE - you should write to Brian and ask to be his spokesperson.  Then post his response, I'd find it very interesting. I can only imagine what Freddie would say. hehe

tay120 wrote: Is it just me or does Brian May seem overly obsessed with songwriting credits. For instance, he made a big deal about how he played for like 2 seconds at the beginning of one of the songs in "Chinese Democracy" and then didn't get credited. WHen someone once pointed out that Freddie was instructing him on his guitar playing during the making of "One Vision" he also got really defensive. Other times, it appears that he invents contributions that don't even exist. For instance, he made a big deal about how, during the line "shiver down my spine" in "Bohemian Rhapsody" he apparently added some special noise with his guitar. In fact, it turns out that this "special sound" was made by a percussion instrument called a bell tree and not by his guitar at all!

Angeline wrote: bhm0129ad ------ 'pissed on Freddie's memory' 'his money going to a dead man's estate' PLEASE - you should write to Brian and ask to be his spokesperson.  Then post his response, I'd find it very interesting. I can only imagine what Freddie would say. hehe

bhm0129ad wrote:I may be a fan, but I am capable of seeing Brian as a human being with all the negative traits that come with it. The list of 'possibilities' as to why he changed the credits are ENDLESS and I offered merely ONE suggestion. For YOU to jump on my back for it is your pathetic little problem.  As you would rudely say... 'get it'?