| Saint Jiub 15.11.2007 23:11 |
Most mp3'ers have been weeded out of Queenzone. There have have only been 4 topics with mp3 download links in the last week or so (the original Edinburgh 76 mp3 thread, the Edinburgh 76 Flac hoax, Cologne 79, and Chicago 82), but every one of these 4 topics has had mp3 links discontinued due to "complaints" to Rapidshare or Megaupload. However, the one song flac link in the Chicago 82 thread was not discontinued. in fact, I doubt that any flac links in the last week or so have been deleted (unless the material was official). Coincidence? I think not. Obviously a few militant flac hardliners have conspired to censor mp3 links. Queenzone has a long tradition of avoiding censorship. The views of all Queenzoners, even if the views are unpopular (except in cases of extreme abuse or spamming), have not been censored. The ideas, views and DOWNLOADS of a minority should not be censored on Queenzone. Unfortunately, a few flac'ers have violated that tradition. Perhaps these flac'ers were not aware they were on Queenzone, but thought they were posting on that censorship haven known as Queen On-Line. |
| pittrek 16.11.2007 02:11 |
Sorry but this sound really paranoid. Check the forum for lossless downloads placed on servers like rapidshare or mediafire. You will find out that 90% of the files were deleted. Does it mean that the mp3 lovers are guilty of doing this ? |
| YourValentine 16.11.2007 02:35 |
"You will find out that 90% of the files were deleted. Does it mean that the mp3 lovers are guilty of doing this ?" Mike's links were deleted for "violating the terms of use" - other links just expired. |
| Nummer2 16.11.2007 03:38 |
IF it's true, that Mike's links were denounced deliberately, THEN it obviously is a private war between 2 people on this board. There's no such thing as a "war between FLAC supporters and MP3 lovers", that's ridiculous. Some people are trying to lift the file sharing standards up to a contemporary standard. And as long as there are different opinions on what standards are necessary, there's a debate about it. And, as always, some people seem to overshoot the mark. Keep calm and stay friends. |
| YourValentine 16.11.2007 04:07 |
Nummer 2, I could not be calmer. This is the situation: Richard allows all formats to be shared here. It's his website. People just should respect the rules of this forum, how hard is that to understand? If collectors want a pure collector site like trader's den with similar rules, they are free to open one. I would surely join. I would most certainly not open one myself because I do not want to take the risk of running such a website, I am most grateful to Richard that he runs this website. I cannot believe how users can troll a forum trying to enforce their own rules on a forum they do not own. Actually, I do not even feel like sharing anything at the moment when I have to expect that Bob pops up in my thread to teach me I have to find out about the lineage before I can post something (see Miami thread). Or 928 talks down to me because I chose a certain bitrate for encoding a DVD because he is an alleged professional and I am just an amateur. I do understand that Bob was mad about Mike sharing his Cologne show in mp3 format but Mike deleted the link, so why do they have to denounce his other shares on file hosting websites? If we all would act like this - what would happen to this website or other fan websites, for that matter? This website is the most tolerant I ever knew but the users must be just as tolerant. |
| Queenrockyou 16.11.2007 04:41 |
It's crazy. Obviously this is something private between two persons. Don't put every Flac user at the same level, it becomes quite frustrating. I'm more than sure that 99% of the Flac users only use this for quality and are as respectable people as you or me or anyone. It upsets me to see that you consider me as a terrorist. I'm not gonna put a bomb in your house or something, nor I'm gonna "skyjacking" Queenzone's plane. Bullshit. Put a term to these attacks. I understand you being angry, but Flac is not at all censorship, it is not terrorism, and that's it. It makes me think about an attitude which is quite bad, being afraid or uncomfortable with a newcomer that wants to share something we are used to do since a long time ago, and not trying to incorporate its thoughts and all that, not trying to evolve with him. I used mp3 before. I now prefer Flac, I learned to use it (and it's not difficult, believe me !), and now I prefer that format, now that it is freely available and easy to use. I would be happy to see Queenzone evolve into something better (as far as quality is concerned), and would be quite frustrated to see it stagnate and being far from what technology (I don't mean top and exclusive technology, but one can be used everyday) can offer. that's it. But I will NEVER go into those terrorism actions you described. Obviously, it is one person's matter. It could be Bob himself, but I don't think he is that stupid (no matter what your point of view is, it seems that he is an intelligent enough person to avoid this behaviour, he seems quite mature), maybe someone describing himself as a fan of Bob and having a taste for extremism or something, or a new trouble maker (we have some on Queenzone sometimes, I'm sure you know about that) who saws that Flac-Mp3 ideas were confronted, sometimes with bad words or so, and found it a perfect thing for making everything go wrong, I think more about this last thing but anyway I don't care. I don't know and I don't care. But that doesn't allow you to describe me, as a Flac user, as a terrorist. Such words will probably be misunderstood by a lot of queenzoners here, and I don't know why you give a bad image of me (once again as a Flac user) that easily. Mp3 files were deleted, for my part I don't care because I don't use, but I feel somewhat frustrated because I don't like censorship. Well, have a good night on it, think about it, and start tomorrow thinking before talking. Is there a jail on Queenzone where I could be thrown for some tims because I use Flac ? I hope not. Ok, this is not my website, that doesn't mean that I can't say that I wish this website to evolve. If it can't evolve, then no problem, I have tried my best to. But I won't go denouncing someone, just for that. But anyway I think you don't want anymore to hear about Flac users. Flac became synonymous to problems here. Really don't understand why. Olivier, France. |
| Nummer2 16.11.2007 04:49 |
YV, you are perfectly right. But if some people (including me) are disappointed with the rules or the situation – in this case, the file sharing standards at QZ – it's just natural, that they try to deliver their arguments to the the site owner in hope that at some point he understands their arguments and changes something. Of course that's annoying, but if it wasn't, it wouldn't work ;-) But after all it's all just about a file format, a simple hobby, not about life or death. So using terms like "FLAC Nazi", "war" or denouncing or sabotaging other people's shares is way overdone. Lately there was a lot of talk about the FLAC/MP3 issue, so I think, if Richard is interested in improving his site (by accepting the wishes of its users), he will change something, e.g. by dividing the announce forum in two sections, even if it takes its time. And if he doesn't care (what's absolutely okay, he has done more than enough for us), someone else will present a solution, maybe by installing a new website. By the way, the "Keep calm" wasn't addressed to you, it was meant generally. |
| Serry... 16.11.2007 05:07 |
Nummer2 wrote: So using terms like "FLAC Nazi", "war" or denouncing or sabotaging other people's shares is way overdone.Since it was me who's invented that term ("FLAC nazi"), I have the question: how would you call the people who'd come to the hotel where you are living and tell you - when you should watch TV, use the toilet, read the newspapers (and by the way they'll tell you which papers are allowed to be read in their opinion), go to the restaraunt and have sex with parlormaid? No, they're not the hotel owners, they're the same hotel guests as you are. Find another word for them if you don't like "nazis". Maybe "Public Morals Administrative Division" will be good. I know who you are, pal, I've seen you in other forums on QZ for over last 1000 years, but how about 80% of other the FLAC supporters? They're downloading their FLACs and nothing more, well except "thank you" and "I have nothing to offer back, but maybe on one sunny day... Who knows what could happens!", and they're trying to make rules over here. Is it okay? I've never seen the veterans making their own rules here even! Download and be happy, but please don't teach me how and what should I download. EDIT: I'm ready to sorry for "nazis" if it hurts FLAC supporters too much, but it won't change my opinion about the whole case. I've had enough of those "life-teachers" in the Soviet Union, no more, please! |
| YourValentine 16.11.2007 05:43 |
Nummer2 wrote: But if some people (including me) are disappointed with the rules or the situation – in this case, the file sharing standards at QZ – it's just natural, that they try to deliver their arguments to the the site owner in hope that at some point he understands their arguments and changes something. Of course that's annoying, but if it wasn't, it wouldn't work ;-) |
| Nummer2 16.11.2007 06:12 |
@ Serry: Call them "nuisance" ;-) @ YourValentine: You are right again. But I like to add something: The "weed out" talk is as bad as the "Nazi" words. The stopping of MP3 sharing is wishful thinking, there are too many places on the net where MP3 files can be shared, and it's absolute nonsense to think it can be prohibited. Even if so, it wouldn't prevent people from converting FLAC files to MP3 prior to burning them to cd (maybe to avoid to have to use a Nero plugin). No, the bigger problem is the attraction of careless people to the community, who just grab some files and then leave without any contribution. Ever wondered why so many shares end early? In my opinion it would be helpful to have a few basic rules (share ratio, moderation of the sharing section), but I can absolutely understand that the forum owner doesn't want to invest money and time. It's his own decision and I have to respect that. I guess, someone else has to create a sharing community for Queen live shows – as a friendly addition to QZ. |
| YourValentine 16.11.2007 06:51 |
"No, the bigger problem is the attraction of careless people to the community, who just grab some files and then leave without any contribution. Ever wondered why so many shares end early?" That's a totally different issue. There is no enforced sharing ratio on the tracker. Lately, we have a better distribution of torrented files and faster download speed. Still, very many users just grab and run. BitTorrents live from the great and dedicated sharers we have on this forum like Ginger, Sithmarauder, bokkepoot et al and some people you never see posting but who re-open torrents all the time and feed the late comers in a very unselfish and unrewarded manner. On Dime and other torrenting sites torrents die too, although there is an enforced sharing ratio. |
| Queenrockyou 16.11.2007 07:01 |
quite agree, Your Valentine, this is a different issue. It's not quite the same for rapidshare and mediafire but it's true that torrents are shared here, and we can't force someone to share something to be a queenzoner. That's the main attract of this site, permitting new curious people to come and discover Queen in a totally different way, and then decide if they like or not, if they want to collect and so on... so it is a different thing indeed. REgards, Olivier, France. |
| Nummer2 16.11.2007 07:11 |
Of course it's a combination of several issues that makes top quality file sharing difficult or impossible at QZ. There are many working examples in the internet where Richard could copy from, but it's obvious, that Queenzone isn't supposed to be a true sharing community. It's an extended fan board without much restrictions and I understand, that this won't be changed. But back to my last post: Do you (YV) think, it could work – a true file sharing website, run by Richard or someone else, and Queenzone as "sisters", not rivals? Linked? You know QZ better than any other here, don't you? |
| josedequeso 16.11.2007 08:13 |
The Cologne 79 and your other "share" (mp3 disguised as flac) were completely acceptable to be deleted because they were a flagrant "fuck you," so we had to do it ourselves because the mods were certainly not going to do it. And yes, I did complain on those 2 "shares" but I did not on the other two you mentioned. The denouncing of the Chicago 82 "share" I believe was not warranted but you could have easily saved everyone's time by just posting the lossless version. Seems pretty foolish to me. And another thing, stop acting like you are a martyr and we (flac supporters) unjustly persecuted you. Get over yourself. I do believe I challenged you a month ago about "censorship" but you never responded and just insisted on calling me a nazi, do you care to justify your position now or would you rather shout out rhetoric that can not be backed up with facts? |
| Sithmarauder 16.11.2007 13:12 |
Nummer2 wrote: @ Serry: Call them "nuisance" ;-) No, the bigger problem is the attraction of careless people to the community, who just grab some files and then leave without any contribution. Ever wondered why so many shares end early? In my opinion it would be helpful to have a few basic rules (share ratio, moderation of the sharing section), but I can absolutely understand that the forum owner doesn't want to invest money and time. It's his own decision and I have to respect that.You hit the nail right on the head Nummer, too often have I watched people get there D/L to 100% then stop seeding immediately knowing that there are other peers that need seeding. There should be a ratio standard (per show) set for all to follow. When you do a search for a song on Limewire, your search result is based on the number of songs you are sharing. The more songs you share, the more results you get. The user can even set their own parameters. For instance they can set Limewire to share with only peers who are currently sharing 50 or more songs. I get more irritated at the lack of seeders than I do at MP3 sharing, though I do understand the trading community's concerns and I am a FLAC supporter. |
| brENsKi 16.11.2007 13:14 |
Nummer2 wrote: Lately there was a lot of talk about the FLAC/MP3 issue, so I think, if Richard is interested in improving his site (by accepting the wishes of its users), he will change something, e.g. by dividing the announce forum in two sections, even if it takes its time. .that's a great idea...with one huge caveat...the "announce" sections maybe need to be renamed.... "queen files - mp3" and "queen files - flac" this would make it clear to everyone that neither section is available for idiots to "pop by" and "aanounce" how great they thought something was, or how they haven't heard from so-and-so for ages |
| The Real Wizard 17.11.2007 00:22 |
YourValentine wrote: Actually, I do not even feel like sharing anything at the moment when I have to expect that Bob pops up in my thread to teach me I have to find out about the lineage before I can post something (see Miami thread). Or 928 talks down to me because I chose a certain bitrate for encoding a DVD because he is an alleged professional and I am just an amateur.Queen collectors must be the only collectors who take it personally when someone is trying to track down the lineage of a recording, or when someone stresses quality standards. Lineage and quality standards are requirements in every other major trading community, but here it is an insult to some. It's truly unreal. Just take a moment, and look at these websites: link link They are beautifully crafted in every way. Virtually every recording has full lineage and they are lossless, because those fans care. Please, don't make me out to be some kind of enemy because I care. I challenge anyone to give me a good reason why the Queen trading community shouldn't be something similar, and why it would somehow be a negative thing. |
| 928 17.11.2007 04:03 |
YourValentine wrote: Or 928 talks down to me because I chose a certain bitrate for encoding a DVD because he is an alleged professional and I am just an amateur.I have only done that when you argue a case of "how its done". Most people who i have barked at have seen it as a hard line education.Which it has been because pussyfootin' around saying the same things politly DID NOT WORK(4 years ago). Hmmmm..and as the quality standards here at QZ have improved from 3 years ago for both audio and video ,with only the odd piece of crap now getting through ,i think we the quality standard people have done a bloody good job. Myself and others do nothing for Queen or this forum eh???(apart from teach you how to get the best from YOUR BAND so YOU can appreciate what THEY have done at its best). If you choose to be "woe is me" about it...thats your perrogative. |
| YourValentine 17.11.2007 05:23 |
You are just rude, no need to try and rationalize it. Put your money where your mouth is. |
| Saint Jiub 17.11.2007 08:42 |
Has 928 ever shared anything on Queenzone? Barb - I think you are being too hard on 928 ;) Of course he has contributed greatly to this site ;) He has been a leader for years at creating a hostile environment at Queenzone ;) Of course, 928 does not care about the music. All he cares about is "crossing t's and dotting i's", piling on the insults, and looking down his nose at others. If he really cared about the music, he would be uploading on Queenzone to counteract potential polluting of the trading pool by those who intentionally or unintentionally convert mp3 to Flac then share or trade it. Indeed, he should put his money where his filthy mouth is if he truly cares about the music. |
| Queenrockyou 17.11.2007 09:04 |
I don't know if it is because of the stress provocated by the mp3/flac "war" here nowadays but i find Barb and Gy Bitch a little rude, maybe because of others being a little rude too, I don't know, but it's time to put an end to all that bad words and so on, no ? It's now time to have concrete decisions made, something making Queenzone progress or not towards quality, I hope the first one because quality is what we all expect (well, I think). But something needs to be made urgently. I came on queenzone to enjoy music, and to express my thoughts about this and that, but here it's becoming groovy, a lot more groovy, a sort of instable climat on our heads. The qualty defenders seem to feel somewhat a different kind of people, despite the many examples found elsewhere (Bob talked about Led Zep, Nirvana and others I think). On the other hand, the other queenzoners feel attacked by this "new movement" which is defending quality (not really aiming to attack the Queen fans !). So now, stop this war, progress or not, but state this clearly. I think Richard should come here on this topic and express clearly what he thinks in person, as everybody would clearly know what Queenzone will become or not. I'm fed up to see everyone talking nastily, or having bad behaviour etc... Really. thanks a lot Richard to calm everything down and state your opinions directly. Regards, Olivier, France. |
| Saint Jiub 17.11.2007 09:13 |
josedequeso wrote: The Cologne 79 and your other "share" (mp3 disguised as flac) were completely acceptable to be deleted because they were a flagrant "fuck you," so we had to do it ourselves because the mods were certainly not going to do it. And yes, I did complain on those 2 "shares" but I did not on the other two you mentioned. The denouncing of the Chicago 82 "share" I believe was not warranted but you could have easily saved everyone's time by just posting the lossless version. Seems pretty foolish to me. And another thing, stop acting like you are a martyr and we (flac supporters) unjustly persecuted you. Get over yourself. I do believe I challenged you a month ago about "censorship" but you never responded and just insisted on calling me a nazi, do you care to justify your position now or would you rather shout out rhetoric that can not be backed up with facts?I am not sure why I am responding to you, as your concept of debating seems to be telling someone to fuck off. Did I call you a flac nazi, or did I use the term generically to refer to those who attermpt to censor mp3? Sorry, I can only give you a 50% rating as a flac nazi, as you do not to attempt censor every mp3 link on QZ by hypocritically complaining about copyright issues on only mp3 downloads while ignoring copyright issues on flac downloads. If you wish to achieve 100% flac nazi-ism, you must try much harder. Perhaps 928 will be willing to train you if you so desire. |
| Saint Jiub 17.11.2007 09:27 |
Ruth - You rudely told me in another topic that I should delete my mp3 shares of Chicago 82 after I shared Chicago 82 in flac. There are at least 5 people downloading from the mp3 torrent at the moment when they could have chosen the flac torrent. It is rude that you insist that people download flac if they only want mp3. If you are so worried about quality, make sure you use a spectral analyzer to check if your flac download is truly lossless. |
| Queenrockyou 17.11.2007 10:01 |
Gym Bitch, Sorry and ashamed you found me rude, I don't remember being rude on Queenzone, when I read some of my posts I find myself quite as a pacifist, even if I'm convinced with my ideas of quality and so on. If you found me rude, then I don't understand and please accept my apologies because I absolutely didn't want to be rude with you, I don't really think I was. I just thought it was logical to have only the Flac shared, yes, that's true and I won't come back on what I said, it is my true opinion. If you decide to share something in lossless format, it is because you know what quality is and respect this, without permitting people to use lossy files. When you have a big luxuous car etc.., using shitty fuel is quite illogical. That's my opinion, shared now by others (well I followed the move, I didn't launch this, don't misunderstand me). Maybe not the whole queenzoners people, so that's probably why you offer also mp3. That's your poit of view, fine, I exposed mine and you exposed yours, that's Ok, I have no problem with this. I just thought that it was more logical if you share lossless (showing you care about the quality) that you deleted your mp3 files, and now I would have found this logical to have only Flac offered here, followng the same thinking. But I just said something, I haven't committed any murder or so, never insulted you etc... That's all I said, i don't think I am rude saying that, and once again I appreciate the fact that you share this gig on queenzone, truely. And to answer your question, yes, I use spectral analyzer. Don't know what this have to do with this discussion, but yes I use one. Please accept my apologies if you thought i was rude, but I was never trying to be rude with you or anyone else here, this is not my favorite hobby and I am one of the firsts to say that it is not what I am searching here. Olivier, France. |
| The Real Wizard 17.11.2007 10:20 |
Gym Bitch wrote: There are at least 5 people downloading from the mp3 torrent at the moment when they could have chosen the flac torrent.Just because a minority of people want mp3 doesn't make it inherently correct for all reasons. It most likely means they don't know what the difference between lossy and lossless files is. |
| The Real Wizard 17.11.2007 10:27 |
Gym Bitch wrote: Indeed, he should put his money where his filthy mouth is if he truly cares about the music.Maybe he'll share if the mp3 shares stop... |
| Saint Jiub 17.11.2007 11:41 |
That is just an excuse not to share. If he added lossless recordings to the trading pool by sharing, he would further dilute or flood out the small amount of mp3 sourced flac or wav recordings that is in the trading pool. Remember, the vast majority of mp3 downloads never make it to the lossless trading pool. |
| The Real Wizard 17.11.2007 12:03 |
Gym Bitch wrote: That is just an excuse not to share.Tell that to tapers who are hoarding their own recordings for that reason. Maybe 928 is a taper himself... ever thought of that? Go to The Traders' Den and have a chat with Freezer. Ask him to share his master of Zeppelin's Baton Rouge 75 in mp3, and see how far you'll get. If he added lossless recordings to the trading pool by sharing, he would further dilute or flood out the small amount of mp3 sourced flac or wav recordings that is in the trading pool.Yes, but if you and people like you stopped sharing mp3, there would be nothing to dilute. Remember, the vast majority of mp3 downloads never make it to the lossless trading pool.That's definitely not true. The trading pool of Queen is full of mp3-sourced recordings. Myself, I have two full spindles of mp3-sourced CDRs I've received in trade over the years. |
| Serry... 17.11.2007 12:33 |
"Myself, I have two full spindles of mp3-sourced CDRs I've received in trade over the years." And that is the only true reason why mp3s should be removed from QZ actually. Not because of the quality, but because some traders have been fucked by other bad traders with mp3-sourced CDRs. And because of that "minority" (please don't tell me that 90% of Queen fans are hardcore traders) mp3s should be removed. Yeah, why not? Someone would send you e-mail with the rude words inside and we'll ban e-mail and the Internet! "Did I call you a flac nazi, or did I use the term generically to refer to those who attermpt to censor mp3?" It was me. If someone will blame you for that word - send all of them to me! They're not afraid to ban mp3s and leave some part of Queen fans without music of their fave band, but they're afraid of word "nazi". |
| The Real Wizard 17.11.2007 12:37 |
Serry<br><font size=1>The FLACer</font> wrote: And because of that "minority" (please don't tell me that 90% of Queen fans are hardcore traders) mp3s should be removed.There are many, many reasons. Not just that. All the reasoning been spelled out in black and white in the many recent topics here. Of course, 90% of fans aren't traders. But most traders (regardless of what percentage of the overall fanbase they are) prefer to preserve the quality of their recordings, not destroy them. The majority have spoken up in the Cologne 79 topic, leaving the minority with little to argue for. Yet they're still trying! I suppose I can admire their stamina and audacity. |
| Serry... 17.11.2007 12:43 |
"Of course, 90% of fans aren't traders." That's why this place has the QueenZone title, not the QueenTradersZone. And that's why Richard has allowed mp3s here, and that's why there are no any "further actions" which you wrote about one week ago. Share and download whatever you want, on one day mp3s will leave this world like RealAudio did, but it will happens not because of you or any the traders' orders. You have to deal with that and be patient. |
| on my way up 17.11.2007 12:57 |
Serry<br><font size=1>The FLACer</font> wrote: "Of course, 90% of fans aren't traders." That's why this place has the QueenZone title, not the QueenTradersZone. And that's why Richard has allowed mp3s here, and that's why there are no any "further actions" which you wrote about one week ago. Share and download whatever you want, on one day mp3s will leave this world like RealAudio did, but it will happens not because of you or any the traders' orders. You have to deal with that and be patient.But once you start collecting unofficial recordings you have to play by the rules of collectors. That's the case for every major band. take a look at the rules of all fan/share sites: only lossless material with info about where the recording has been. Queen, my favourite band has fans who claim to be die-hards but still they're too lazy to learn more about this subject. That's something I cannot understand. All people have to do is visit queenlive.ca and read the glossary page!!!! That's only 1 page and they will know much more and (hopefully)understand where the people who defend quality standards come from. And if you have a question about something, just ask and others will help you. If I'm a bad person because I do not understand why people still want mp3, so be it. |
| Serry... 17.11.2007 13:12 |
"But once you start collecting unofficial recordings you have to play by the rules of collectors." Rules are very simple - don't trade mp3-sourced recordings and don't sell bootlegs. That's it. Nothing more. No any "we'll learn you how to love quality, arsehole!". "That's the case for every major band. take a look at the rules of all fan/share sites: only lossless material with info about where the recording has been." Guys, are you the kids or what? "John has that big toy car, I don't, muuuuuuuum!" - why should I look how other fan-sites do?! I'm talking about mp3s on QZ, I don't care about other sites and their rules in this case. If you can't deal with the QZ rules that's not enough reason to change the whole board. I don't like some things on QZ, but I'm the boss on my own site only. "All people have to do is visit queenlive.ca and read the glossary page!!!! " Do you know who's web master of that site? I do. |
| on my way up 17.11.2007 13:56 |
Serry<br><font size=1>The FLACer</font> wrote: "But once you start collecting unofficial recordings you have to play by the rules of collectors." Rules are very simple - don't trade mp3-sourced recordings and don't sell bootlegs. That's it. Nothing more. No any "we'll learn you how to love quality, arsehole!". "That's the case for every major band. take a look at the rules of all fan/share sites: only lossless material with info about where the recording has been." Guys, are you the kids or what? "John has that big toy car, I don't, muuuuuuuum!" - why should I look how other fan-sites do?! I'm talking about mp3s on QZ, I don't care about other sites and their rules in this case. If you can't deal with the QZ rules that's not enough reason to change the whole board. I don't like some things on QZ, but I'm the boss on my own site only. "All people have to do is visit queenlive.ca and read the glossary page!!!! " Do you know who's web master of that site? I do.Rules are very simple - don't trade mp3-sourced recordings and don't sell bootlegs. That's it. Nothing more. No any "we'll learn you how to love quality, arsehole!". There's not a big difference between trading and sharing recordings on a site like Queenzone. Once you download recordings you're a collector. We live in the 21st century. It's easy to share all that wonderful music on the internet. Why not do it? Guys, are you the kids or what? "John has that big toy car, I don't, muuuuuuuum!" - why should I look how other fan-sites do?! I'm talking about mp3s on QZ, I don't care about other sites and their rules in this case. If you can't deal with the QZ rules that's not enough reason to change the whole board. I don't like some things on QZ, but I'm the boss on my own site only. So you think that only Queenfans have Queen recordings! There are people who collect music and have stuff from several bands(and rare stuff for that matter). Once they know Queenfans treat their recordings like shit(which is what we do with MP3 sharing, no lineage, no other info whatsoever...)they don't want to share anymore. There are several examples of this. The lack of rules on this site is not a positive thing, it's a negative thing. Rules are very simple - don't trade mp3-sourced recordings and don't sell bootlegs. That's it. Nothing more. No any "we'll learn you how to love quality, arsehole!". Please, go to the traders' den and share an mp3 recording there. Or do you think those people are not collectors? Only people who trade can be collectors in your view. We live in the 21st century! Do you know who's web master of that site? I do. I do too. He does a great job! It's a fantastic site. It's my bible for Queen recordings(take a look at the best recordings place). I hope you agree with me. And I don't think there's something in the section I refer to that isn't true. Otherwise, please tell me. |
| Serry... 17.11.2007 16:13 |
"There's not a big difference between trading and sharing recordings on a site like Queenzone. Once you download recordings you're a collector. We live in the 21st century. It's easy to share all that wonderful music on the internet. Why not do it?" There is the difference. I can download show for the listening, for sending one track over e-mail (with all those limitations on attached files), whatever else, I'm not gonna trade that. And yes we are in the 21st century - just open many websites and you'll find "here's the file in .format and here is the same file in .zip, in .rar" - download what you want, save time and money. And in the 21st century Bob tells me that I should use the post mail if I wanna have some shows (just read recent threads). "The lack of rules on this site is not a positive thing, it's a negative thing." Make your own and put any rules you want to. Make petition to put such rules. Do something else except blaming other QZers for the rules which weren't made by them. "Please, go to the traders' den and share an mp3 recording there. Or do you think those people are not collectors?" Have you read what I wrote about "the collectors' rules"? "Don't trade mp3-sourced recordings". This is what I wrote. Re-read before replying. And again these references to "other sites"... This (QZ) is not sharing community, not traders' forum! "He does a great job! It's a fantastic site. It's my bible for Queen recordings(take a look at the best recordings place)." My bible about Queen live shows is Queenconcerts by Martin who has nothing against of mp3s, so what? Bob made great site and fantastic research (we must put statue to him for his research about Live Killers), but still - how does it make QZ mp3less? What's the connection? "And I don't think there's something in the section I refer to that isn't true. Otherwise, please tell me." The most important thing you can't understand in this "war": mp3-supporters are NOT against of FLACs, it's FLAC supporters who are against of mp3. See the difference? I can't see any mp3-lovers complaining about shows in FLAC. If you like quality - download it in FLAC, if you can deal with something like Manchester '73 in mp3 - why not? It's my own choice and my own problems, I force no-one to download mp3s, but FLAC supporters wanna delete that thread, ban this user for mp3, is it okay? Yours and my English is away from being perfect - should we be banned? Just for the quality's sake, who cares if our native language is not English?! Learn it and then come back. Do you wanna have such rules on QZ? Why not? Quality, man, quality of English language! |
| on my way up 17.11.2007 16:55 |
Serry<br><font size=1>The FLACer</font> wrote: "There's not a big difference between trading and sharing recordings on a site like Queenzone. Once you download recordings you're a collector. We live in the 21st century. It's easy to share all that wonderful music on the internet. Why not do it?" There is the difference. I can download show for the listening, for sending one track over e-mail (with all those limitations on attached files), whatever else, I'm not gonna trade that. And yes we are in the 21st century - just open many websites and you'll find "here's the file in .format and here is the same file in .zip, in .rar" - download what you want, save time and money. And in the 21st century Bob tells me that I should use the post mail if I wanna have some shows (just read recent threads). "The lack of rules on this site is not a positive thing, it's a negative thing." Make your own and put any rules you want to. Make petition to put such rules. Do something else except blaming other QZers for the rules which weren't made by them. "Please, go to the traders' den and share an mp3 recording there. Or do you think those people are not collectors?" Have you read what I wrote about "the collectors' rules"? "Don't trade mp3-sourced recordings". This is what I wrote. Re-read before replying. And again these references to "other sites"... This (QZ) is not sharing community, not traders' forum! "He does a great job! It's a fantastic site. It's my bible for Queen recordings(take a look at the best recordings place)." My bible about Queen live shows is Queenconcerts by Martin who has nothing against of mp3s, so what? Bob made great site and fantastic research (we must put statue to him for his research about Live Killers), but still - how does it make QZ mp3less? What's the connection? "And I don't think there's something in the section I refer to that isn't true. Otherwise, please tell me." The most important thing you can't understand in this "war": mp3-supporters are NOT against of FLACs, it's FLAC supporters who are against of mp3. See the difference? I can't see any mp3-lovers complaining about shows in FLAC. If you like quality - download it in FLAC, if you can deal with something like Manchester '73 in mp3 - why not? It's my own choice and my own problems, I force no-one to download mp3s, but FLAC supporters wanna delete that thread, ban this user for mp3, is it okay? Yours and my English is away from being perfect - should we be banned? Just for the quality's sake, who cares if our native language is not English?! Learn it and then come back. Do you wanna have such rules on QZ? Why not? Quality, man, quality of English language!There is the difference. I can download show for the listening, for sending one track over e-mail (with all those limitations on attached files), whatever else, I'm not gonna trade that. And yes we are in the 21st century - just open many websites and you'll find "here's the file in .format and here is the same file in .zip, in .rar" - download what you want, save time and money. And in the 21st century Bob tells me that I should use the post mail if I wanna have some shows (just read recent threads). You can do all the same things with tracks in FLAC format and you won't loose quality. So why does it has to be mp3. Because it is worse? Not a good reason if you ask me. And the other websites you refer to: because they are not intelligent, we shouldn't be either? Do something else except blaming other QZers for the rules which weren't made by them. I blame Queenfans for defending mp3 as being better than lossless formats. That's just a lie. Have you read what I wrote about "the collectors' rules"? "Don't trade mp3-sourced recordings". This is what I wrote. Re-read before replyi |
| Serry... 17.11.2007 17:13 |
It's hard to discuss when you don't want to hear what I say, therefore... "But when people download MP3 they just collect not so good quality stuff." What's your business about it? Do they force you to collect mp3? Do they force you to listen what they have downloaded? Why don't you tell us about smoking then? It's bad too. Let's ban smokers outta QZ too. We'll show them what's good for them! I haven't seen so many smokers on Nirvana fan sites as on QZ! P.S. About language: on English-speaking board you can't speak on perfect English, so you should be banned. What will be in the future otherwise? U instead of you and ze instead of the? If you speak on perfect English everyone can understand you on the board, it'll be good for you! Can't you see that? We care about your interests, son! |
| Queenrockyou 18.11.2007 02:53 |
- I smoke (a lot) - My taylor iz rich |
| on my way up 18.11.2007 04:10 |
Serry<br><font size=1>The FLACer</font> wrote: It's hard to discuss when you don't want to hear what I say, therefore... "But when people download MP3 they just collect not so good quality stuff." What's your business about it? Do they force you to collect mp3? Do they force you to listen what they have downloaded? Why don't you tell us about smoking then? It's bad too. Let's ban smokers outta QZ too. We'll show them what's good for them! I haven't seen so many smokers on Nirvana fan sites as on QZ! P.S. About language: on English-speaking board you can't speak on perfect English, so you should be banned. What will be in the future otherwise? U instead of you and ze instead of the? If you speak on perfect English everyone can understand you on the board, it'll be good for you! Can't you see that? We care about your interests, son!I will not add more to the discussion but these are 2 observations of mine: 1) You make all kinds of mistakes against logic just to make your point. (What has smoking to do with this board? Or with sharing music in general? Totally ridiculous!) 2) You make it personal by saying my english is bad. To be honest with you: that makes me a bit angry. I will not discuss things with people who hit below the belt. It's obvious you want to push me and others in a corner and not a very nice corner for that matter. If defending something bad is more important to you than friendly behaviour towards a fellow Queen fan, so be it. But I've had enough of it. I hope you understand my bad english! |
| Serry... 18.11.2007 07:36 |
"I will not add more to the discussion but these are 2 observations of mine" You haven't add anything new to this discussion except the many times repeated fact about quality. Though this discussion is not about the quality. But all your words still are about the quality. "You make all kinds of mistakes against logic just to make your point. (What has smoking to do with this board? Or with sharing music in general? Totally ridiculous!)" What has your trading business that I don't care about to do with format of files on my PC? Could you please once answer that simple question I've asked you three times? Smoking has nothing to do with this board - you're right and that's why quality of files on my PC has nothing to do with this board or any QZers. "You make it personal by saying my english is bad. To be honest with you: that makes me a bit angry." I haven't said that. You're putting your own fears in my mouth. I wrote "yours and MY English is away from being perfect" which is not "bad and terrible". If you think that your English is perfect, I'm sorry for my words. "I will not discuss things with people who hit below the belt." It only proves that you can't answer my simple questions - they're out of logic, they're funny, they're wrong, i.e. you just can't answer them. Old and very well-known way how not to answer on the questions. |
| on my way up 18.11.2007 07:58 |
Serry<br><font size=1>The FLACer</font> wrote: "I will not add more to the discussion but these are 2 observations of mine" You haven't add anything new to this discussion except the many times repeated fact about quality. Though this discussion is not about the quality. But all your words still are about the quality. "You make all kinds of mistakes against logic just to make your point. (What has smoking to do with this board? Or with sharing music in general? Totally ridiculous!)" What has your trading business that I don't care about to do with format of files on my PC? Could you please once answer that simple question I've asked you three times? Smoking has nothing to do with this board - you're right and that's why quality of files on my PC has nothing to do with this board or any QZers. "You make it personal by saying my english is bad. To be honest with you: that makes me a bit angry." I haven't said that. You're putting your own fears in my mouth. I wrote "yours and MY English is away from being perfect" which is not "bad and terrible". If you think that your English is perfect, I'm sorry for my words. "I will not discuss things with people who hit below the belt." It only proves that you can't answer my simple questions - they're out of logic, they're funny, they're wrong, i.e. you just can't answer them. Old and very well-known way how not to answer on the questions.I can easily answer your question: there's nothing wrong with mp3 on your pc. There's something wrong with mp3 on this board. People with bad intentions can download it and distribute these recordings as if they are lossless. That has happened many times. And the discussion is not only about MP3 but also about people giving no info about their recordings whatsoever. For people like me(and I think many collectors do because it's nicer to hear a show in better quality than worse), who seek the best version possible of a show it is hard because there are numerous versions doing the rounds. Lossy and lossless ones. The problem is bigger than just lossy sharing. It's about the entire attitude. We have many shows with this lineage: AUD > ? > CD-R(x). We know nothing about that recording with that lineage and that's a pitty! It's easy, if you want mp3 on your pc. You can downoad the flac files and convert for own use. This has been discussed many times before. Collectors don't have a problem with that. Collectors only have a problem with the sharing of lossy files on this(and other)site because it pollutes the trading pool. Simple as that. Now, what part is it that you don't WANT to understand? |
| Saint Jiub 18.11.2007 09:48 |
I do not understand why you can not use a spectral analyzer. I do not understand how you can attempt to impose your demands on Richard's website when mp3 sharing is clearly allowed here. I do not understand how you can call for the ban of a legal product (mp3) that is used by millions worldwide. |
| The Real Wizard 18.11.2007 10:09 |
Serry<br><font size=1>The FLACer</font> wrote: You haven't add anything new to this discussion except the many times repeated fact about quality. Though this discussion is not about the quality. But all your words still are about the quality.It *is* all about the quality. You just refuse to see it. Gym Bitch wrote: I do not understand why you can not use a spectral analyzer.We do use it. The point is, because this forum and the hub have allowed mp3 sharing, plenty of CDRs in the tradepool are mp3-sourced, which in turn has created a general distrust of Queen collectors, within and outside Queen collecting circles. Everyone with quality standards demands we use a spectral analyzer to prove that our recordings are lossless. However, in other communities, such as the Zeppelin and Genesis communities, people do not have such worries, because virtually everyone has quality standards, so they trust each other. What do you think it would take for us to reach that point? No need to answer. As usual, I'll outline every detail for you to read, and maybe you'll finally understand it. The first step towards reaching that point is if people like you stop sharing mp3s here. The fact that you shared mp3s means the Chicago 82 "second generation tape > WAV > CDR (x) > WAV > ? > CDR (x) " cannot be inherently trusted to be lossless, because that question mark in the lineage could be either mp3 or FLAC. Some people downloaded the mp3s because the files are smaller, which they think are just as good (or almost as good, but not much worse, so who cares, right?). Since this forum has no quality standards, another problem is that most people don't feel required to be educated on matters of documenting their recordings properly. Thus, the people who downloaded your mp3s with plans to trade will most likely burn them to CD, and document their mp3-sourced CDs as "Chicago 82, 2CD", because nobody advised them that such a thing may be a problem of some kind. I know it for a fact, because I've seen hundreds of collectors' lists, and that's what most of them look like. You're probably one of them. I've seen your topics here about quality, where you'd rate each show with a letter grade, regardless of which source, tape generation, and digital format you're rating. So, if we all pull together, stop the spreading of mp3s, and distribute the best version of each show in a lossless format, then we won't have to worry about multiple versions of the same recording circulating in various formats. When that happens, everyone can be happy knowing they can trust that their fellow traders will add equally great recordings to their collections. Everyone wins. I do not understand how you can attempt to impose your demands on Richard's website when mp3 sharing is clearly allowed here.Just because it's a rule doesn't mean it's correct. Your statement implies that all rules are inherently correct, and that anyone who challenges a rule is committing some kind of crime, regardless of the validity of the challenge. I do not understand how you can call for the ban of a legal product (mp3) that is used by millions worldwide.And I do not understand how you have managed to read so selectively and remain so ignorant despite having been bombarded with logic on this subject matter for years. This topic and many other recent topics have all the reasons outlined in perfect black and white for everyone to understand. Just because millions of people do something doesn't make it inherently right, and that all alternatives are inherently wrong. It takes more than a simple-minded person to be able to see that an alternative used by a smaller number of people has the potential of being a better alternative. Is meat-eating inherently correct on all levels because less people are v |
| MDNA 19.11.2007 04:56 |
Gym Bitch wrote: I do not understand why you can not use a spectral analyzer. I do not understand how you can attempt to impose your demands on Richard's website when mp3 sharing is clearly allowed here. I do not understand how you can call for the ban of a legal product (mp3) that is used by millions worldwide.We do use a spectral analyser, but you have to agree that is very frustrating to send a bunch of shows to someone that you know are lossless and get back a bunch of MP3 sourced CD's in return, like I have. I only dis a couple of trades and already found myself in that situation. Trust me it is not very pleasant. If you're lucky the person who sent the CD's didn't know it either and it usualy comes down to choosing something else. |
| Saint Jiub 19.11.2007 08:24 |
If you are so afraid of receiving mp3 sourced recordings in a trade, why don't you insist on receiving an e-mailed wav sample before you agree to a trade? Better yet, if the trader that you are dealing with is unknown to you, an established, respected trader, can tell the newbee trader up front that he will not mail his portion of the deal until the newbee's package has been delivered and evaluated to be what was promised. There will always be bad traders. You can not eliminate bad traders by banning mp3. You CAN, however, be virtually certain that what you trade, and what you receive in trade by taking a few minutes and religiously use a spectral analyzer. Similarly, you can not ban or lock up every HIV positive person to prevent him or her from unprotected having sex with other people. However, the proper use of condoms will be virtually certain to prevent the transmission of HIV to you. Ultimately one can only control one's own actions. You can not control the actions of others with bans, jail time, or executions. If one could truly contol the actions of others there would be zero crime (no illicit selling of drugs, no murders, no robberies, etc. etc). |