| AmeriQueen 15.03.2007 13:15 |
link I thought Brian May was just being humble when he declared that he had "no illusions" about being in the same league with Steve Vai and Joe Satriani. I still haven't seen anything by the later that suggests he's anything near Brian, but the link above should clearly cite excellent reason for May's submission to Vai. This guy is a freaking alien! Watch that video and then tell me there's a better guitarist in the world. I'd still take Brian as my favorite due first and foremost to the sound of the Red Special, but I have yet to see Vai's equal in technical mastery. This video really blows my mind. |
| PieterMC 15.03.2007 13:30 |
Steve Vai is certainly certainly a much better technical player but what I love about Brian is the emotion that he puts into his playing. |
| Matias Merçeauroix 15.03.2007 13:42 |
PieterMC wrote: Steve Vai is certainly certainly a much better technical player but what I love about Brian is the emotion that he puts into his playing.and Steve doesn't? |
| bigV 15.03.2007 14:36 |
What sets Brian May apart from other great guitarists is not so much his playing ability, but his songwriting - both musically and lyrically. V. |
| Elizabeth Knightson 15.03.2007 14:48 |
True Steve Vai is a very good guitarist, but I prefer the sound of the Red...imagine Steve playing the red! |
| FriedChicken 15.03.2007 14:57 |
He's fast, but he plays without any feeling. Technique doesn't say shit |
| masterstroke_84 15.03.2007 15:26 |
its boring... he is always trying to show how technical he is and fast he is... |
| Matias Merçeauroix 15.03.2007 15:50 |
He just tries to show off his speed, huh? tell me just ONE song where Steve plays just fast. just ONE. I have all of his records, and can't find that one song yet. Instead, I find lots of songs played with LOTS of fucking emotion and loads of great melodies. Played perfectly, of course. If Steve plays with no feeling, then feeling does NOT exist. |
| user name 15.03.2007 16:02 |
BigV and VSS are right. Steve Vai is one of the most emotionally-charged and innovative guitarists out there. He's one of the few guitarists who can be completely at one with his instrument. Brian May, while not as technically proficient, has all the same emotion, refined through some of the best songwriting that has ever graced the world of music. |
| teleman 15.03.2007 16:06 |
Valensian Sky Surveillance wrote:I wouldn't say Steve Vai lacks emotion in his playing but it doesn't affect me the way some other musicians do. He is a monster player, no doubt, but I prefer Brian among others.PieterMC wrote: Steve Vai is certainly certainly a much better technical player but what I love about Brian is the emotion that he puts into his playing.and Steve doesn't? |
| thomasquinn 32989 15.03.2007 16:32 |
Zappa was absolutely speechless at Vai's skill. That says it all for me. And seeing how Satriani taught Vai, that should be sufficient proof for Joe's skills. |
| bigV 15.03.2007 16:43 |
Take David "don't-call-me-Dave" Gilmour. He's doesn't really play fast, but the emotion he puts into every solo he plays... Oh, man! Save for Queen's "Bijou" I don't think that there's any other guitarist who has made me cry. Gilmour has done it with "Comfortably Numb", "Marooned", "Shine On" et cetera, et cetera... V. |
| Marcelo_argentina 15.03.2007 17:33 |
C´amon you people...we all know Steve is an amazing guitar player...we all know about him...and his great music...the diference is that Brian May is the guitarist of Queen..that´s a big, huge diference guys!!... |
| Matias Merçeauroix 15.03.2007 17:44 |
teleman wrote:Then that's YOUR problem, not Steve's.Valensian Sky Surveillance wrote:I wouldn't say Steve Vai lacks emotion in his playing but it doesn't affect me the way some other musicians do. He is a monster player, no doubt, but I prefer Brian among others.PieterMC wrote: Steve Vai is certainly certainly a much better technical player but what I love about Brian is the emotion that he puts into his playing.and Steve doesn't? It's not his fault that you don't understand his music. Not everybody can enjoy something like the Fire Garden suite. ah |
| The Real Wizard 15.03.2007 18:32 |
You can't accuse someone of playing with a "lack of emotion". Emotion is relative to one's tastes. Players like Vai are over most people's heads. The mainstream is mostly exposed to guys like Clapton, Page, and Santana who stick with major and minor scales over simple chords. Players like Vai, Satriani, and Petrucci, however, are just plain over the heads of most people - which is fine. Nobody says we have to like them all. But the fact is, you will never, ever find people who musically understand these fine musicians saying how they play too fast, or don't play with emotion. |
| ok.computer 15.03.2007 19:30 |
My tuppence worth? Brian's playing is more accessible, more recognisable, more....more FUN damn-it... I won't get into a who's better who's best competition slanging match, but I will say this: you never saw Steve Vai in the Top 10 too much back in the day... |
| Sebastian 15.03.2007 19:32 |
Gilmour and May are songwriters first, guitarists second. When it comes only to guitar playing, Vai is way better than both. And Steve's a wonderful songwriter too, and plays other instruments, and sings quite well. |
| Back2TheLight 15.03.2007 19:56 |
You see, I grew up with Vai and Satriani and Clapton, and all the virtuosos. Quite honestly, they are all fine guitarists in their own right. Jimmy Page was a songwriter...he's an average guitarist. Ever hear that guy on Led Zpeelin's last tour?? Good God!! My point being...Brian May has got his own thing to him, as does Satriani and Vai. They both have great skill, and they all play with quite a bit of emotion. But they just play their instrument differently. That's all. It's got nothing to do with technique, or any of that garbage. Ask yourself...what was it that attracted you to Brian May's guitar playing?? Or Vai? Or any of those guys?? They made a sound that grabbed your ears and your heart and didn't let go. Therefore, you turned all your nickles and dimes over to get their records. Case closed. Brian May is just being humble about himself, which there was a day when he was like that...not so much now, but 15, 20 years ago?? Absolutely!! |
| maxpower 15.03.2007 21:08 |
For me Hendrix rip off - dull as fuck bored me after 45 seconds, no where near Brian stick "technique" where ever you wish... give me Mick Jones any day of the week it you want excitement |
| bigV 15.03.2007 21:10 |
Sebastian wrote: Gilmour and May are songwriters first, guitarists second. When it comes only to guitar playing, Vai is way better than both. And Steve's a wonderful songwriter too, and plays other instruments, and sings quite well.A wonderful songwriter he may be, but I can't imagine him writing something along the lines of "High Hopes" or "The Show Must Go On". And THAT is what makes messirs Gilmour and May legends. V. |
| Matias Merçeauroix 15.03.2007 22:06 |
maxpower wrote: For me Hendrix rip off - dull as fuck bored me after 45 seconds, no where near Brian stick "technique" where ever you wish... give me Mick Jones any day of the week it you want excitementobviously, you're a poor dipshit |
| Adolfo and the spiders from Mercury 16.03.2007 01:07 |
they r just different, cant compare them, steve is from out of the universe, and brian is the master of the universe, just different and they both play with feeling, check out steve's "for the love of god" or "tender surrender" |
| teleman 16.03.2007 01:10 |
Valensian Sky Surveillance wrote:It's not a problem for anyone but you.teleman wrote:Then that's YOUR problem, not Steve's. It's not his fault that you don't understand his music. Not everybody can enjoy something like the Fire Garden suite.Valensian Sky Surveillance wrote:I wouldn't say Steve Vai lacks emotion in his playing but it doesn't affect me the way some other musicians do. He is a monster player, no doubt, but I prefer Brian among others.PieterMC wrote: Steve Vai is certainly certainly a much better technical player but what I love about Brian is the emotion that he puts into his playing.and Steve doesn't? I remember buying Flexable on cassette when it came out and learning Little Green Men, Salamanders In The Sun, The Attitude Song and Call It Sleep. I was pointlessly impressed with myself. Intellectually I understand his music but it just doesn't move me. I'm sure Steve Vai is comfortable with that. I'm comfortable with that. The only person who seems to have a problem is you. I hope you can get help with that. Music is subject to individual tastes. If we all liked the exact same music then music would be stagnant and we'd all still get a hard-on for some monkey beating a log with a rock. |
| The Real Wizard 16.03.2007 01:43 |
teleman wrote: If we all liked the exact same music then music would be stagnant and we'd all still get a hard-on for some monkey beating a log with a rock.Oh come on, what would be wrong with that? ;) |
| Matias Merçeauroix 16.03.2007 01:53 |
teleman wrote:it's not just about "intellectually understanding" but about ACTUALLY understanding what did he mean with every part of the song.Valensian Sky Surveillance wrote:It's not a problem for anyone but you. I remember buying Flexable on cassette when it came out and learning Little Green Men, Salamanders In The Sun, The Attitude Song and Call It Sleep. I was pointlessly impressed with myself. Intellectually I understand his music but it just doesn't move me. I'm sure Steve Vai is comfortable with that. I'm comfortable with that. The only person who seems to have a problem is you. I hope you can get help with that. Music is subject to individual tastes. If we all liked the exact same music then music would be stagnant and we'd all still get a hard-on for some monkey beating a log with a rock.teleman wrote:Then that's YOUR problem, not Steve's. It's not his fault that you don't understand his music. Not everybody can enjoy something like the Fire Garden suite.Valensian Sky Surveillance wrote:I wouldn't say Steve Vai lacks emotion in his playing but it doesn't affect me the way some other musicians do. He is a monster player, no doubt, but I prefer Brian among others.PieterMC wrote: Steve Vai is certainly certainly a much better technical player but what I love about Brian is the emotion that he puts into his playing.and Steve doesn't? The theory part just comes in when we want to know what is he doing, but for trying to understand what did he mean, we just have to LISTEN. And I do understand him, because he makes it easy for us to understand the meaning and will of his music. Some people like you, think that as long as they can play The Animal or Erotic Nightmares, they understand his music. PS: Sucker |
| The Real Wizard 16.03.2007 02:23 |
ok.computer wrote: I won't get into a who's better who's best competition slanging match, but I will say this: you never saw Steve Vai in the Top 10 too much back in the day...Sorry, but that argument has no merit. Most lists are popularity contests, being as they have little to no criteria. Valensian Sky Surveillance wrote: The theory part just comes in when we want to know what is he doing, but for trying to understand what did he mean, we just have to LISTEN.What a beautiful set of words. QZ post of the day. |
| jeff payne 1680 16.03.2007 04:27 |
But Steve hasn't got the Red special |
| Saif 16.03.2007 05:20 |
Sebastian wrote: Gilmour and May are songwriters first, guitarists second. When it comes only to guitar playing, Vai is way better than both. And Steve's a wonderful songwriter too, and plays other instruments, and sings quite well.I can submit to the fact that May was a songwriter first, guitarist second. But Gilmour? No way, he was only good as a guitarist. Roger Waters wrote all the lyrics anyway(The Division Bell doesn't count since it sucks). And I think David Gilmour isn't a good guitarist at all, just overrated. He has a bit of skill, he does the job - that's how I see it. I don't see him as some kind of guitar god or even close. Anyway that's just my opinion. The solo on Comfortably Numb is great, no doubt, but it isn't something that only Gilmore could pull off... Joe Satriani and Steve Vai are both great but IMO Satriani is better, he has puts more feeling into his compositions and performances. The man tutored Kirk Hammett for fuck's sake, who is a guitar god in his own right... I'd take Eddie Van Halen over any of these guys any day... and Jimi Hendrix... now those two guys can play and take your attention off the actual lyrics... And to the person who said that Jimmy Page wasn't a good guitarist but he was a good songwriter...I'd say he was a great guitarist and an average songwriter. In terms of guitar skill May and Page are on the same level the way I see it. Led Zeppelin apparently stole a lot of tunes from obscure bluesmen but all their lyrics contain "Baby, baby" in every other line kinda like how a lot of Queen songs contain "Mama", "Honey", etc. Actually if you substitute "Baby" for "Honey" or "Mama" in a song, you'll get the Queen version of it. :P But anyway they're all awesome so who cares... |
| john bodega 16.03.2007 06:02 |
Hmmm... Satriani... y'know, it doesn't detract from his ability to say this, but a lot of his music (to my ears) just sounds a little dated or whatever. An amazing player, but I mean I can't play Gran Turismo 4 without feeling I'm being pushed into a decade I don't want to be in, simply because it has him playing on it. You won't often find a consensus in a discussion about guitar because we *all* do it differently. If I walked into a room and said "Gilbert or Van Halen" I think I'd deserve to be laughed at. For one thing.... one came before the other and thus is integral to the junior. I think as little as a year and a bit ago, I said Vai or someone played 'without emotion' or something, but I'm kinda glad I grew up!! It's amazing what a bit of an education can do. Anyone else see the video of Eddie Van Halen at the NAMM thing this year?? He sounds like George Carlin!! The guy's amazing. |
| Sebastian 16.03.2007 09:04 |
Indeed Steve wouldn't write 'High Hopes' or 'Show Must Go On', but when it comes to guitar playing he's much better than May and muuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuch better than Gilmour. Even though David wasn't a first-class lyricist, he was a very good composer and arranger. He was much better at that than playing per se: the beauty of his solos is that they're well-written, but as you've implied, they're easy. By the way, Hendrix is more overrated than all other guitarists combined. He was a legend and he inspired many people and he was creative and he was an all-round musician ... but when it comes solely to guitar-playing, there are many many many people who are much much much better. And Eddie's extraordinary. He's much more than just tapping (which he didn't invent btw), and for me that's an actual guitar-god, which Jimi wasn't. Page is a great guitarist and a wonderful arranger. As a songwriter ... well, quoting Stravinski: "a good composer doesn't imitate, he steals". And even if Brian reinvents himself, that's nothing unique: every guitar legend reinvents himself (why isn't there a guitar goddess yet is betond me). |
| Saif 16.03.2007 09:14 |
Sebastian wrote: Indeed Steve wouldn't write 'High Hopes' or 'Show Must Go On', but when it comes to guitar playing he's much better than May and muuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuch better than Gilmour. Even though David wasn't a first-class lyricist, he was a very good composer and arranger. He was much better at that than playing per se: the beauty of his solos is that they're well-written, but as you've implied, they're easy. By the way, Hendrix is more overrated than all other guitarists combined. He was a legend and he inspired many people and he was creative and he was an all-round musician ... but when it comes solely to guitar-playing, there are many many many people who are much much much better. And Eddie's extraordinary. He's much more than just tapping (which he didn't invent btw), and for me that's an actual guitar-god, which Jimi wasn't. Page is a great guitarist and a wonderful arranger. As a songwriter ... well, quoting Stravinski: "a good composer doesn't imitate, he steals". And even if Brian reinvents himself, that's nothing unique: every guitar legend reinvents himself (why isn't there a guitar goddess yet is betond me).Yeah, you're right. Just like I said, Gilmour is not a great guitarist but he composes great music. The Comfortably Numb solo, IMO is superior to all the Stairway to Heaven solos put together because it's easier to play while being just as sophisticated. It sounds nice too. Led Zeppelin's biggest steal was probably "Whole Lotta Love". Page and Plant were both geniuses, John Paul Jones as well but Bonham wasn't that great...he was the perfect drummer for Led Zeppelin and definitely a great drummer even if you subtract the other three from the combination but he doesn't serve much else... He's like Neil Peart, except half as intelligent and twice as wild. |
| sixpennybit 16.03.2007 10:31 |
So you feel there is no emotion in the steve vai footage shown?? all I can say for sure is that the chordal piece at the end of Brians buckingham palace version of God save the Queen stole from Liberty by steve vai! Emulation and respect from both parties I believe, steve vai is a seminal player, so is Brian for his harmony construction. gotta love em both if you love music? |
| AmeriQueen 16.03.2007 12:22 |
FriedChicken<br><font size=1>The Almighty</font> wrote: He's fast, but he plays without any feeling. Technique doesn't say shitWhat???!? Are you high? Obviously you didn't watch the video I linked. |
| AmeriQueen 16.03.2007 12:26 |
jeff payne wrote: But Steve hasn't got the Red specialDing! We have a winner! I'll go so far as to say Brian's solo's are more structurally perfected than Vai's(or anyone's for that matter), but what ends all debate is that old fireplace that hangs around his neck. |
| Sebastian 16.03.2007 13:18 |
The Red Special is overrated imo. It's a great instrument, but Brian could play well even if the RS didn't exist. I'm sure that Brian can take a Strat and a Marshall (the most usual combination) and still sound like himself. So it's not because of the Red Special, the sixpence, the treble booster or the modified echoplex, it's because of him. |
| its_a_hard_life 26994 16.03.2007 13:19 |
Brian May! <3 Steve Vai! <3 |
| teleman 16.03.2007 13:20 |
Valensian Sky Surveillance wrote:All I said basically was that Vai wasn't my cup of tea. I've said nothing disparaging against him. I have the highest regard for Steve Vai as a man and a musician but it just ain't my thing.teleman wrote:it's not just about "intellectually understanding" but about ACTUALLY understanding what did he mean with every part of the song. The theory part just comes in when we want to know what is he doing, but for trying to understand what did he mean, we just have to LISTEN. And I do understand him, because he makes it easy for us to understand the meaning and will of his music. Some people like you, think that as long as they can play The Animal or Erotic Nightmares, they understand his music. PS: SuckerValensian Sky Surveillance wrote:It's not a problem for anyone but you. I remember buying Flexable on cassette when it came out and learning Little Green Men, Salamanders In The Sun, The Attitude Song and Call It Sleep. I was pointlessly impressed with myself. Intellectually I understand his music but it just doesn't move me. I'm sure Steve Vai is comfortable with that. I'm comfortable with that. The only person who seems to have a problem is you. I hope you can get help with that. Music is subject to individual tastes. If we all liked the exact same music then music would be stagnant and we'd all still get a hard-on for some monkey beating a log with a rock.teleman wrote:Then that's YOUR problem, not Steve's. It's not his fault that you don't understand his music. Not everybody can enjoy something like the Fire Garden suite.Valensian Sky Surveillance wrote:I wouldn't say Steve Vai lacks emotion in his playing but it doesn't affect me the way some other musicians do. He is a monster player, no doubt, but I prefer Brian among others.PieterMC wrote: Steve Vai is certainly certainly a much better technical player but what I love about Brian is the emotion that he puts into his playing.and Steve doesn't? Big Fucking Deal! Where did I insult Steve Vai? Oh right, I didn't. |
| Matias Merçeauroix 16.03.2007 13:24 |
LMAO You're not that important, my friend I have a WHOLE LOTTA things to do with my life, I wouldn't spend even a minute sending you an e-mail so fuck you, you're just a dipshit |
| Dan C. 16.03.2007 13:41 |
teleman wrote: If we all liked the exact same music then music would be stagnant and we'd all still get a hard-on for some monkey beating a log with a rock.Those were the days... |
| quicksilver mercury 16.03.2007 13:49 |
Valensian Sky Surveillance wrote: I can wipe you off the planet so watch your back loserThat isn't very nice but pretty funny. |
| Poo, again 16.03.2007 14:04 |
Okay, what I am about to say might come as a shock for some, if this hasn't already been pointed out in the thread. Steve Vai is in fact... der String-Emil! Seriously, they're identical! |
| john bodega 16.03.2007 14:09 |
"I'm sure that Brian can take a Strat and a Marshall (the most usual combination) and still sound like himself." So much of his sound is accentuated and taken further by his instrument... but I think any guitar player who's been around for more than a couple of years would agree that there is a LOT of it that simply comes from the fingers and whatever you're using to pick with. Take it from someone who could only afford a Crate for the first 10 years of his guitar-playing life :) There *are* approximations of other guitarists that can be reached by an understanding of how the fingers can induce different sounds from the instrument. "I have a WHOLE LOTTA things to do with my life" For someone who uses the term "Led Zeppeshit", you sure paraphrase them a bit!! :P In closing... I finally got the time to watch the video at the start of the thread. You cannot discount his ability as a player... but does Steve Vai have to do such a thorough job of looking like Jim Carrey while he's performing?!?! |
| Matias Merçeauroix 16.03.2007 17:01 |
Zebonka12 wrote: "I'm sure that Brian can take a Strat and a Marshall (the most usual combination) and still sound like himself." So much of his sound is accentuated and taken further by his instrument... but I think any guitar player who's been around for more than a couple of years would agree that there is a LOT of it that simply comes from the fingers and whatever you're using to pick with. Take it from someone who could only afford a Crate for the first 10 years of his guitar-playing life :) There *are* approximations of other guitarists that can be reached by an understanding of how the fingers can induce different sounds from the instrument. "I have a WHOLE LOTTA things to do with my life" For someone who uses the term "Led Zeppeshit", you sure paraphrase them a bit!! :P In closing... I finally got the time to watch the video at the start of the thread. You cannot discount his ability as a player... but does Steve Vai have to do such a thorough job of looking like Jim Carrey while he's performing?!?!it could be AC/DSHIT too =P Steve says that his funny faces entertain the crowd xD |
| Treasure Moment 17.03.2007 09:40 |
steve is skilled but brian is MUCH better guitarist and plays catchy good solos with MUCH more emotion to it. There are alot of guitarsts that are as good and better than steve vai, check out this amazing Death Metal band who blow away steve vai with their talent. I know you probably will hate the vocals on this but just listen to the instruments, its the most intense thing ever created! link |
| Sebastian 17.03.2007 10:04 |
If a solo is "better" than the other, it doesn't mean the guitarist who played the first is better; it just suggests that the person who wrote the first may be a better composer than the person who wrote the second. |
| Matias Merçeauroix 17.03.2007 10:59 |
Atheist wrote: steve is skilled but brian is MUCH better guitarist and plays catchy good solos with MUCH more emotion to it. There are alot of guitarsts that are as good and better than steve vai, check out this amazing Death Metal band who blow away steve vai with their talent. I know you probably will hate the vocals on this but just listen to the instruments, its the most intense thing ever created! linkyou just don't get it, do you? |
| Saif 17.03.2007 11:11 |
That dude from Treasure Moment is the best guitarist ever. I'm sure if Queen weren't around they'd be the best band in the world. |
| Saif 17.03.2007 11:24 |
- |
| sparrow 21754 17.03.2007 12:07 |
steve is an amazing guitar palyer, no doubt. he shows lots of emotion, and emotion is shown in different ways by different guitarists. brian and steve are in their own league. btw i thought i should comment that steve has a beautiful guitar :) (excuse the rant) in general though, i dont like it when people claim that faster playing is better. they can claim that playing an instrument at high speed is dificult. when you try to replicate something impromtu, yes it difficult, because it was a one time, one shot thing, the play will be different the next time. when you play fast with emotion, thats one thing, but to think youre showing off a skill, anyone can play fast and messy honestly. it depends on how clean it is, and how much you can actually get into it, and if its played with a band, how well it fits with the rest of the band. just because a drummer has a double bass petal doesnt mean hes skilled at playing fast. therse plenty of tricks to show off with, but i say emotion is more important than the 'how fast i can play' skill. |
| john bodega 18.03.2007 00:00 |
See... threads like this baffle me. Music ought to be more of a collaboration than a competition. All last week I was jamming with different guitarists, and as opposed to flooding the bands and making things awful - we were inventing pretty awesome stuff on the spot, and the beauty of it is that something different came out depending on which guitarist I was 'duelling' with. One guy is a bluesy Hendrix wannabe... yet we made some unpredictable shit together. This other guy wants to be a shredder (he's well on his way... I told him that I was more of a 'splinter') and so when we were jamming we were just going *nuts* and doing harmonies... our lecturer was outside at the time and couldn't believe it was improv! Guitar is such an interesting thing; and thats without pissing matches over who's better. People really ought to just have fun with it. PS. The guy from Treasure Moment is better. |
| Saif 18.03.2007 00:40 |
Zebonka12 wrote: See... threads like this baffle me. Music ought to be more of a collaboration than a competition. All last week I was jamming with different guitarists, and as opposed to flooding the bands and making things awful - we were inventing pretty awesome stuff on the spot, and the beauty of it is that something different came out depending on which guitarist I was 'duelling' with. One guy is a bluesy Hendrix wannabe... yet we made some unpredictable shit together. This other guy wants to be a shredder (he's well on his way... I told him that I was more of a 'splinter') and so when we were jamming we were just going *nuts* and doing harmonies... our lecturer was outside at the time and couldn't believe it was improv! Guitar is such an interesting thing; and thats without pissing matches over who's better. People really ought to just have fun with it. PS. The guy from Treasure Moment is better.Did you ever try anything like "Bijou" with your guitar? Just wondering, that track is awesome. |
| john bodega 18.03.2007 00:43 |
Bijou is a very fun song to play :) A bit knife edge for me because it's kinda easy to get the completely wrong impression out of the song... one must be so gentle while doing it!! |
| Matias Merçeauroix 18.03.2007 01:29 |
Zebonka12 wrote: PS. The guy from Treasure Moment is better.I laughed SO friggin hard when I read that xDDDDDDDD |
| The Real Wizard 18.03.2007 02:36 |
Sebastian wrote: So it's not because of the Red Special, the sixpence, the treble booster or the modified echoplex, it's because of him.Fully agree. It's a guitarist's touch that creates his sound, not his gear. |
| Saif 18.03.2007 02:55 |
Valensian Sky Surveillance wrote:Did you miss my post? Hehe, because I said the same thing even earlier. =PZebonka12 wrote: PS. The guy from Treasure Moment is better.I laughed SO friggin hard when I read that xDDDDDDDD |
| ok.computer 05.04.2007 14:04 |
Sir GH<br><h6>ah yeah</h6> wrote:And yet, what are we doing here, but debating what ultimately will become nothing more than a list...?ok.computer wrote: I won't get into a who's better who's best competition slanging match, but I will say this: you never saw Steve Vai in the Top 10 too much back in the day...Sorry, but that argument has no merit. Most lists are popularity contests, being as they have little to no criteria. Sorry but my argument is as valid as anyone else's. |
| Matias Merçeauroix 05.04.2007 14:54 |
No, it is not. You're an idiot. |
| The Real Wizard 05.04.2007 18:06 |
ok.computer wrote:Absolutely. But the difference between this discussion and lists is that here we can actually provide reasons for our choices, whereas lists usually don't have criteria, and continue to say that Page and Hendrix were the greatest players ever.Sir GH<br><h6>ah yeah</h6> wrote:And yet, what are we doing here, but debating what ultimately will become nothing more than a list...? Sorry but my argument is as valid as anyone else's.ok.computer wrote: I won't get into a who's better who's best competition slanging match, but I will say this: you never saw Steve Vai in the Top 10 too much back in the day...Sorry, but that argument has no merit. Most lists are popularity contests, being as they have little to no criteria. |
| ok.computer 05.04.2007 20:35 |
Valensian Sky Surveillance wrote: No, it is not. You're an idiot.If that's all you have to add to the discussion, then really, you are an awful waste of ones and zeros.... |
| john bodega 06.04.2007 08:20 |
It's some kind of giveaway to the human mind that no guitarist thread can go for very long without turning into a low-brow kind of slanging match... Let's start a thread about drummers instead! |
| Matias Merçeauroix 06.04.2007 11:55 |
ok.computer wrote:You're a waste of semenValensian Sky Surveillance wrote: No, it is not. You're an idiot.If that's all you have to add to the discussion, then really, you are an awful waste of ones and zeros.... |
| ok.computer 06.04.2007 12:57 |
Valensian Sky Surveillance wrote:Well at least the best part of me didn't spill down me mammy's leg...as it would appear it has with your's.ok.computer wrote:You're a waste of semenValensian Sky Surveillance wrote: No, it is not. You're an idiot.If that's all you have to add to the discussion, then really, you are an awful waste of ones and zeros.... Tell me, what was the point of starting your little slagging match? Does it make you feel all powerful, a-hiding behind a keyboard and a screen? Or is it just that you are a mental midget? I think that's as much time as I am willing to waste on this, and indeed, you. I'll leave you to have the last word.... ...which I doubt will be anything other than monosyllabic. Mind you...I will concede that you did well with "semen". |
| Matias Merçeauroix 06.04.2007 13:19 |
you're 34 fucking years... all wasted. You're lame. Go ahead, old man, go read your magazines and let their clever polls and rankings fill your ass with their eternal knowledge. And may God have mercy of thy soul. |
| ok.computer 06.04.2007 13:29 |
Valensian Sky Surveillance wrote: you're 34 fucking years... all wasted. You're lame. Go ahead, old man, go read your magazines and let their clever polls and rankings fill your ass with their eternal knowledge. And may God have mercy of thy soul.Oh go on then. I can't resist. Without resorting to slagging, which is pretty much all you have contributed, where did I say I was reading magazines and polls and rankings? Here's my original post for the hard of understanding: Posted: 3/15/2007 7:29:51 My tuppence worth? Brian's playing is more accessible, more recognisable, more....more FUN damn-it... I won't get into a who's better who's best competition slanging match, but I will say this: you never saw Steve Vai in the Top 10 too much back in the day... -ends- See, you haven't really done anything other than leap into a conversation I was having with another person. You haven't added anything to the debate except vitriol and bile. That, of course, is your right. Just don't expect other people not to pull you up on it. Phew. A whole post and no resorting to "I know better than you" tactics. Go on...see if you can manage it... |
| Boy Thomas Raker 06.04.2007 14:34 |
Sir GH<br><h6>ah yeah</h6> wrote:Guys, as you're infinitely more skilled as musicians, and knowledgeable about music, I'll painfully have to disagree with this. I don't think Brian May would be Brian May without the Red Special, the sixpence, the treble booster or the modified echoplex, because that's a huge part of his tone. Put it this way, if you hooked Brian up to EVH's gear nad setup, I don't think you'd get Brian sounding like EVH, but I don't think it would sound anything like Brian's sound.Sebastian wrote: So it's not because of the Red Special, the sixpence, the treble booster or the modified echoplex, it's because of him.Fully agree. It's a guitarist's touch that creates his sound, not his gear. |
| Matias Merçeauroix 06.04.2007 14:58 |
ok.computer wrote:you don't deserve a replyValensian Sky Surveillance wrote: you're 34 fucking years... all wasted. You're lame. Go ahead, old man, go read your magazines and let their clever polls and rankings fill your ass with their eternal knowledge. And may God have mercy of thy soul.Oh go on then. I can't resist. Without resorting to slagging, which is pretty much all you have contributed, where did I say I was reading magazines and polls and rankings? Here's my original post for the hard of understanding: Posted: 3/15/2007 7:29:51 My tuppence worth? Brian's playing is more accessible, more recognisable, more....more FUN damn-it... I won't get into a who's better who's best competition slanging match, but I will say this: you never saw Steve Vai in the Top 10 too much back in the day... -ends- See, you haven't really done anything other than leap into a conversation I was having with another person. You haven't added anything to the debate except vitriol and bile. That, of course, is your right. Just don't expect other people not to pull you up on it. Phew. A whole post and no resorting to "I know better than you" tactics. Go on...see if you can manage it... |
| The Real Wizard 06.04.2007 17:37 |
ok.computer wrote:Ouch......... :DValensian Sky Surveillance wrote: You're a waste of semenWell at least the best part of me didn't spill down me mammy's leg...as it would appear it has with your's. |
| The Real Wizard 06.04.2007 17:41 |
Boy Thomas Raker wrote: Guys, as you're infinitely more skilled as musicians, and knowledgeable about music, I'll painfully have to disagree with this. I don't think Brian May would be Brian May without the Red Special, the sixpence, the treble booster or the modified echoplex, because that's a huge part of his tone. Put it this way, if you hooked Brian up to EVH's gear nad setup, I don't think you'd get Brian sounding like EVH, but I don't think it would sound anything like Brian's sound.Of course your gear makes a difference, but look at it this way: If Angus Young played with Brian May's gear, would he sound more like Angus or Brian? At home, I play a Les Paul through a Fender Princeton amp. Using a quarter instead of a pick, I can get pretty close to Brian's tone when I'm playing Queen songs. We can make it numerical, and I'll concede and approximate that it's 90% style and 10% gear. |
| its_a_hard_life 26994 06.04.2007 18:48 |
:O |
| deleted user 06.04.2007 19:03 |
Sir GH<br><h6>ah yeah</h6> wrote:=O...ok.computer wrote:Ouch......... :DValensian Sky Surveillance wrote: You're a waste of semenWell at least the best part of me didn't spill down me mammy's leg...as it would appear it has with your's. |
| Boy Thomas Raker 06.04.2007 21:37 |
Sir GH<br><h6>ah yeah</h6> wrote:Really Sir GH? I heard your Brighton Rock solo and I think it was fantastic and a very accurate replication of Brian's sound. I know that it's impossible to quantify touch and tone, but I think, in Brian's case, it's totally his set-up and guitar that make him what he is as a player. I know his touch is light compared to an EVH who digs in to his attack, but plugging the Red Special into The Edge's set-up wouldn't give Brian his tone or unique soud. Brian himself railed against using a Strat or Telecaster on CLTCL, and IMHO, if he played a Les Paul or Fender he'd not be the legend he is. IMHO :)Boy Thomas Raker wrote: Guys, as you're infinitely more skilled as musicians, and knowledgeable about music, I'll painfully have to disagree with this. I don't think Brian May would be Brian May without the Red Special, the sixpence, the treble booster or the modified echoplex, because that's a huge part of his tone. Put it this way, if you hooked Brian up to EVH's gear nad setup, I don't think you'd get Brian sounding like EVH, but I don't think it would sound anything like Brian's sound.Of course your gear makes a difference, but look at it this way: If Angus Young played with Brian May's gear, would he sound more like Angus or Brian? At home, I play a Les Paul through a Fender Princeton amp. Using a quarter instead of a pick, I can get pretty close to Brian's tone when I'm playing Queen songs. We can make it numerical, and I'll concede and approximate that it's 90% style and 10% gear. |
| ok.computer 06.04.2007 22:14 |
Valensian Sky Surveillance wrote:you don't deserve a replyI didn't really think you could manage one. |
| john bodega 06.04.2007 23:34 |
"Really Sir GH? I heard your Brighton Rock solo and I think it was fantastic and a very accurate replication of Brian's sound. I know that it's impossible to quantify touch and tone, but I think, in Brian's case, it's totally his set-up and guitar that make him what he is as a player. I know his touch is light compared to an EVH who digs in to his attack, but plugging the Red Special into The Edge's set-up wouldn't give Brian his tone or unique soud. Brian himself railed against using a Strat or Telecaster on CLTCL, and IMHO, if he played a Les Paul or Fender he'd not be the legend he is. IMHO :)" As I recall, Mack eventually convinced Brian to just use a Tele.... but I might be wrong! I really think it depends on what is seen as more important; the actual tone of the guitar, or the way he plays it. Gearwise.... you can approximate 'that' sound that Brian had. It is a lot easier with a Red Special, of course - but there's ways of doing it! The tone of an instrument and it's reaction to high levels of distortion will always have a certain character that can't really be changed, but you'd be surprised at how much you can do just by the way you're playing it, at what part of the strings you're picking on... and if you've got an effects pedal with any real tinkering ability, it's quite possible to chase other peoples sounds. While I think the Red Special really comes alive once you're playing very loudly with a decent amp (hehe) it does have its own characteristics when you're playing totally clean. I think the beauty of this instrument is that you can more easily imitate other guitarists, whereas they'll always have a slightly harder time of trying to sound like the Red Special. It's a very versatile instrument... if you dick around long enough, there are Fender sounds, there are Danelectro sounds... muahaha. I can't stress enough how much importance is on the player themselves!! Even when Brian was playing a Tele, doing the most ersatz solo you'll ever hear him doing, he still has his own way of approaching it. I think it'd be a real hoot to force the most distinctive guitar players around and force them all to play on a totally clean sound, and see if we can still tell the difference! |
| redspecial85 06.04.2007 23:51 |
Interesting thread for a guitarist to read...I actually have seen both of these guys live. I saw Steve Vai at the Eric Clapton Crossroads Guitar Festival in Dallas back in 2004. He was incredible live; The best song he did was "I'm the Hell Outta Here." I don't think there's anyone that holds a candle to his technical ability as a rock guitarist. I saw Brian in Washington D.C. on the Queen/PR tour. That was a dream come true...Brian May is my hero. I don't really think its fair to say that what makes Brian May who he is as a guitarist, is his tone. That's a valid point, because any discussion among guitarists about him...everyone's said that they love his tone. On most of Queen's big hits that everybody is familiar with...his lead stuff isn't mind-blowing to hear, its very tasteful and precise...some of it is quite tricky to learn though. Melodically I think he's a genius...the way he layered all of the guitar parts and faithfully and fully re-created them appropriately in a live setting. His stuff isn't impossible to learn if you know what you're doing. But there's no question, if you study his playing thouroughly...you'll see that he truly is a unique player. Look at A Night at the Opera...or any other Queen album from the very beginning up to Jazz...then Innuendo... Vai and May are very different in a lot of aspects...they have two completely different approaches to the guitar. May was a huge inspiration to Vai, as well as Satriani. When it comes to feeling; and who's ultimately the better guitarist. Its all subjective. I've been a part of several "coluorful" debates about it. Why don't you all give a fair listen to their catalogues of music and decide for yourself. |
| Sebastian 07.04.2007 00:00 |
I play different kinds of guitars and I always sound like me. There's of course a difference depending on the type of neck, amp, strings, etc but the larger part is on the actual person. We've got to realise too that Brian built his sound around the equipment he had, which probably means that if he hadn't built the RS he probably would have been "yet another axeman with Strat or LP". But I'm sure he'd still be distinctive. To pretend that a big(ger) part of Bri's sound or legacy comes from the gear rather than his fingers (or soul, or heart, or mind, or spirit, or whatever) is as thinking that Fred's voice came from the mic or Shakespeare's sonnets came from the kind of pen he used. |
| Matias Merçeauroix 07.04.2007 00:13 |
ok.computer wrote:Valensian Sky Surveillance wrote:man, yours are so clever that everybody's else's brains will explode.you don't deserve a replyI didn't really think you could manage one. |
| john bodega 07.04.2007 01:33 |
"if he hadn't built the RS he probably would have been "yet another axeman with Strat or LP". But I'm sure he'd still be distinctive." Yeah! He always talks about the sound that he had in his head that he wanted to accomplish, and even if there'd never been a Red Special he would've gravitated towards that anyway. And to be honest... for me, the tone hasn't really been the focus of what makes him brilliant. It's distinctive - but what always got me about Brian is he could play solos that one could sing along with! Make music that people can involve themselves in, and you'll always be acknowledged just as much (if not more so) than the guy who can play at a rate of 15000 rpm. Now... if you can do both - then you're special. Heh. |