Mr Fred 05.11.2004 15:35 |
I have wondered about when Freddie got the virus. Was it before the MagicTour or afterwards. I know that he told the other 3 that he didn't would tour forever, he said that late on the Magic tour. Do you guys thinks that he had been infected for a short or long time...... |
Penetration_Guru 05.11.2004 17:02 |
Just after the "postman" "delivered" his "special delivery" deep into the "letterbox" |
brENsKi 05.11.2004 17:35 |
HIV had become aids by the time of the Barcelona sessions |
Scirocco1977 05.11.2004 17:53 |
There are various rumours about this. Most people tend to believe Phoebe who said that Freddie knew it in 1987. If Freddie already was positive before the Magic tour, then he would not get green light from the medical for insurance... Also, it is said that Freddie got infected when he lived in New York. |
Sonia Doris 05.11.2004 19:06 |
after he had shaved his balls and wrote bo rhap |
Ramses 05.11.2004 23:24 |
I would also suspect it was the early 1980's, since that's when Freddie became more...promiscuous. But it is also interesting to mention that HIV can take YEARS before any symptoms are detected. To be infected and die within 10 years is considered quick by most researchers I believe...look at Magic Johnson. Very interesting |
Scirocco1977 06.11.2004 09:21 |
As far as I know, Magic Johnson is immune from the HI virus. Meaning from his HIV. |
Sonia Doris 06.11.2004 09:42 |
bo rhap is all about it!!! didn't you read the old topics here??? guess not... no offense to anyone |
Fenderek 06.11.2004 09:47 |
Actually- even Keep Yourself Alive is about it, so I guess Brian knew (great psychic powers!)around 1972 and told Freddie in 1974, when they started recording BoRhap... |
brENsKi 06.11.2004 10:22 |
1975! - they were recording bo-rhap in 75 |
Sonia Doris 06.11.2004 10:46 |
i might suspect even an earlier date...i guess the time he won the contest for the most beautiful baby picture... then, when he was a child, all zanzibar knew about that!!! wait a minute his great-great-great-great-great etc-grand mother, back in the 16th century suspected freddie of aids!!! |
gabriel79 06.11.2004 12:46 |
he knew it in 1987 but probably he fell ill before.mick rock says he fell ill during new york years(80-82) |
Dennis ™ 06.11.2004 16:49 |
he knew in '86. i think he has been einfected around '78 till '82 cause like Brian says on the extra commentairy on Body language, Freddie was very mutch into the gay thing.So, wel I don't have to explain it further, do I? |
KingMercury 06.11.2004 17:40 |
Freddie knew he was infected after the Magic Tour. It was between 86/87. Before that, and although he didnt the HIV test, he had a pre-feeling, because much of his ex-lovers had the virus, or died because of AIDS. And Freddie knew he was infected because Mary Austin told him. The people from the Lab called to Freddie, and it was Mary who picked up the phone, and they told her. And when did freddie get the virus? It was between 82/84. Freddie went to a Gay Club in New York called "Studio 59" or something like that, so its possible that he get infected in there. |
BiggyRat 06.11.2004 21:50 |
The story we got fed here was that some aircraft steward had infected him on a flight (musta been the mile high club I guess) in early '87. So many stories, who knows the truth? |
deleted user 07.11.2004 01:19 |
BiggyRat wrote: The story we got fed here was that some aircraft steward had infected him on a flight (musta been the mile high club I guess) in early '87. So many stories, who knows the truth?But don't forget Freddie's next-to-last-lover Winnie Kirchberger (sp?) who also died of AIDS, although he died later than Freddie, but it can be considered an angle. So maybe Freddie infected him, or Winnie got infected by somebody else and got Freddie infected...etc. Endless possibilities. |
BiggyRat 07.11.2004 01:23 |
<font color="whitesmoke">bambam wrote:Yeah good point bambam, I doubt we'll ever know the full story, or the real one for that matterBiggyRat wrote: The story we got fed here was that some aircraft steward had infected him on a flight (musta been the mile high club I guess) in early '87. So many stories, who knows the truth?But don't forget Freddie's next-to-last-lover Winnie Kirchberger (sp?) who also died of AIDS, although he died later than Freddie, but it can be considered an angle. So maybe Freddie infected him, or Winnie got infected by somebody else and got Freddie infected...etc. Endless possibilities. |
Borhap80 07.11.2004 04:32 |
Sad to say but it's impossible to tell, considering how many persons he was in contact with during the early eighties. Here's some of them : - Vince the barman - Tony Bastin - Bill Reid - John Murphy - Thor Arnold - Nicolay Grishanovitch - Winnie Kirchenberger And countless more.... Of all he had connection with in the gay world 99 % of them are dead. The spreading of the disease is impossible to track down, he could have got it from absolute anyone. It's sad that he just gave a damn about his life in those days. It was doomed to go wrong!! |
concert 07.11.2004 06:40 |
I say the best reference is Jim Huttons book: He (Freddie) was obvious aware of the possibility that he was infected during the late 1986. And Freddie told Jim that he has the positive result sometime in April 1987, just after he did the test. So, if this is fact, we only can say that just after his result, about May 1987 his HIV infection developped into AIDS (skin-cancer). And as the virus needs at least about 3 to 6 months to developp into AIDS, we only can say for sure, that Freddie was infected latest by the end of 1986. And that are all the facts! The rest is speculation and will never be for sure! |
Sicmot 07.11.2004 07:04 |
You people should watch the "When freddie mercury met kenny everett" documentary.. it explains and describes it a lot.. how and when and with who it likely happened.. The program refers to Nicholai as the source of infection. |
Daburcor? 07.11.2004 09:00 |
I think Freddie got HIV sometime before it killed him. |
deleted user 07.11.2004 09:51 |
Good call, Dan. |
mrbadguy86 07.11.2004 11:38 |
I think he got the Hiv virus between the late 70's and early 80's. One good example is when he was a lot in the states, like the partys in New York and of course the Halloween Party in New Orleans in 78! It was around that time gaypeoples got infected by the "unknown" illness in San Francisco, Los Angeles, New York and New Orleans. Like he said "I take everything, and everyone!" lol... Or maybe, he got the virus around his time in Munich between 84-85. When you take a look at the famous and crazy birthday party he held in Munich in 1985, you can think of that too! |
Daburcor? 07.11.2004 14:04 |
*bows* Thanks Manders. ;) |
Sonia Doris 07.11.2004 15:39 |
after he met the postman? i mean the one who posted this topic |
mamamia 07.11.2004 16:01 |
I heard he lived HIV Positive for seven years so he might have been infected around 1983, but who really knows? |
Monte: Liquorice Years 07.11.2004 23:55 |
i believe that freddie was scard of becoming HIV postive before the Magic tour, but didn't get it 'til after (like a year after), but then again, what would i know! you all probably have hardcore facts, whereas im guessing monte |
Borhap80 08.11.2004 05:24 |
It´s impossible to say. I´d guess he got infected between 80-82... He probably knew he had HIV in 84-85 and probably developed into an early stage of Aids in 85 and it got a lot verse from 87 and onwards.... I remember I read someplace that doctors tried prevent him doing the magic tour... If thats true it would mean he already knew something we didnt... |
Fairyfeller 08.11.2004 05:34 |
I believe the Mercury and me story, where it is told he prolly got it in munchen, but like everyone already said: no one knows for sure. At least we all know Fred tried to keep it a secret for as long as possible... another question: Are you bothered by the fact Freddie never told his fans he had aids? Given the fact that they only told the world the day he died I personally don't, it would have been a huge media hype, which is not something he could use, plus I think it's his private business |
Brian_Mays_Wig 08.11.2004 05:55 |
I wasnt bothered he didnt tell us til the day before, because I think it was blatently obvious what was going on! As soon as we saw him at the Brits we knew that it was most likely to be AIDS. |
Martin Packer 08.11.2004 08:50 |
Fairyfeller, I'm not bothered he didn't tell us. It seems to me to have a reasonably productive and unhassled life he had to do it that way. Imagine the converse: Him being "out" with HIV/AIDS. It doesn't really bear thinking about. And I suspect most of us were in denial (or at least not looking for it) prior to his announcement. But my suspicions started with "The Miracle" and were deepened with "Innuendo" - at some subconscious level. As I've said before there was a definite change between 1985 and 1986 - mainly in apparent mood, I think. But then it went downhill from there. I think the "Barcelona" photos looked strange, and so did "The Great Pretender" video. |
gabriel79 08.11.2004 09:13 |
why should have told that he was ill? it was his own business |
Lord Blackadder 08.11.2004 14:01 |
I HEARD 1984 he got HIV. But Freddie's assistant said 1987 was when he found out it was AIDS. But Brian said that when they were on tour somewhere in Spain Freddie said, during abit of a row, that he wouldn't be touring forever and that the others all thought he ment he was going to die. And that must've been on the Magic tour. |
concert 08.11.2004 15:22 |
Evening everybody, the facts that were mentioned by "concert" are quite true. Freddie did the HIV test in April 1987, and that is what Jim Hutton tells in his book. And also true, the AIDS developped during the next month as we can see on his face and the skin, and so on. Well, that means as written, that he must have been infected latest in 1986! Not more - not less! And for the Magic Tour: they had quite much personal stress in Spain, especially in Madrid (i think they smashed almost the whole hotel room). And Freddie just knew that he highly probably must have HIV during that tour (because of the known lovers who already had died or had AIDS at this point). Regards |
deleted user 08.11.2004 19:14 |
He could be a hermaphrodite for all I care. |
brian_may_wannabe 09.11.2004 15:47 |
1987 wasn't it? |
savingtess 28.07.2012 14:17 |
you must not be from the U.S. because everyone knows about studio 54 (as I am correctly identifying it) chances are that freddy himself didn't even know. to try and take that up as fans is just ludicrous. |
AlexRocks 28.07.2012 16:50 |
Lol. You all don't know your history or facts do you? When Freddie died in 1991 most people only lived three to four years with HIV even with medicine. It just wasn't as good as it was later on and now. As it is the medicines kept people alive longer than without anyways. When people started living as long as ten years with the medicine it was a big deal. Stuff like did not happen until the late 1990's at the earliest if I recall. Now its a big deal to be able to live with HIV for a reall long time. Of course they never say if that ones life is still cut short at all. So it is entirely misleading. (They also say that it has been discovered that those who live with HIV are still rapidly aged just the same anyways. So they look much older than they really are.) Is 50 old? 60? 70? Not in my mind by any means. It is highly unlikely that Freddie got HIV before 1986 as it just wasn't possible to live as long as he did at that time period. The early 1987 is more than likely the best answer in terms of when he got HIV. I guarantee you he did not wait many months and certainly not years before he got checked after being infected. What I don't understand is how Munich was this big deal and or negative influence on him? I mean if you are going around having gay sex and doing drugs then what's the difference in doing it in England or Germany? Wasn't Freddie doing these things since the early days of Queen or at least by the mid 1970s? How much more "wild" can one get? Does this mean they are indicating he was with underaged boys in Munich? Or are they saying that hitting "the public showers" somehow made it more likely to be infected? I just don't get it. How assinine and misleading. |
BrianMayKicksAss 29.07.2012 10:47 |
Why didn't you wear a bloody rubber, Fred? :*( Yeah, he probably knew it in the Queen I days. I mean "Keep Yourself Alive?" Of course it was about HIV! |
beautifulsoup 29.07.2012 11:16 |
Detour; I can't resist, sorry. I actually had a voice student (21 years old last year) say to me that it's assumed by others his age that "Bohemian Rhapsody" is about him having AIDS, because of the "Mama, just killed a man" and "Goodbye, everybody, I've got to go." Etc. Needless to say I educated him on the timeline. |
AlexRocks 30.07.2012 16:43 |
A lot of people who see the early years of Queen for example the short promotional film (music video) for the song "Bohemian Rhapsody" they see the members of the group and Freddie Mercury with his long hair and skinny body and say, "Yep. That makes sense. I can see what he looked like with A.I.D.s. Of course in terms of what he looked like he had looked straight, per se (l.o.l.) for years before he was infected at all. |
on my way up 31.07.2012 08:06 |
I'm certain Freddie caught that killer virus way earlier than some on here suspect... He was really unlucky in the sense that his wildest years were exactly at the same time as the rise of this dreadful disease and this disease first spread around the gay clubs in the cities he used to visit...exactly in those years. For example: I wouldn't be surprised if he got it in 1982.. or 1983 |
BrianMayKicksAss 31.07.2012 18:51 |
Wow...this thread got resurrected from the dead! If only Freddie could do the same... God? Anyway, HIV can lie dormant in the body for years before showing itself/any symptoms. The early 80s would not surprise me at all. But how about this? Lets not give a f*ck about his demise, let's care about the music. Deal? Cool! These topics are way too morbid imo... |
cmsdrums 02.08.2012 14:59 |
With the Olympics so prevalent at the moment, I heard Greg Louganis (ex champion swimmer) live on the radio this week. He's 52, and the interviewer commented how good he looked for his age, and said he looks 10 years younger. Louganis tested positive for HIV in 1988. The worst thing about the time which Freddie got the virus (my belief is that he found out in 86/87 but maybe was actually infected earlier) is that the medicines at the time were just not quite enough to avoid an inevitable early death sentence. If only Freddie has caught the disease a year or two later, he may well still be with us, and the disease be manageable - the timing always makes sad to think about. Anyway, to go back to the question, he certainly knew when he was making Barcelona so had clearly already shown symptoms enough for him to know. |
plumrach 03.08.2012 03:22 |
Well Magic Johnson and Holly Johnson both found out that they had HIV in 1991 and they are both ok, though i did read something not so long ago from Holly that he has to rest a lot because he gets tired easy |
malicedoom 03.08.2012 10:49 |
But, again, Freddie was full-blown in 1987, which leads me to believe he was probably HIV positive quite a few years before that. Amazing he lasted as long (1991) as he did. |
jazzrazzmatazz 03.08.2012 22:09 |
I always thought he got infected somewhere around 1978/1979. I mean, we all know that Freddie loved those gay clubs and in "Don't Stop Me Now" video he has a "Mineshaft" shirt which was an extremely promiscuous gay club in NYC. and we all know that the video is from 1978, right? I'm not saying he got HIV infected exactly in that club and exactly that year but the fact is that the club did close in 1985 because of AIDS scare. and people usually say that it needs about 10 years for HIV to develop into full-blown AIDS. when you do the math you realize the signs were all there by the 1988...these are just some reasons that make me think he definitely got it before the 1980s but that's just me guessing. and everything we can ever do about it is guess |
thomasquinn 32989 04.08.2012 04:16 |
February 17th 1983, at approximately 2:15 AM GMT. |
cmsdrums 04.08.2012 04:44 |
Good point about the Mineshaft t-shirt. It does make me laugh when the media often try to say that Fred his his homosexuality; the Mineshaft t-shirt in a video played all over the world, a 'Heaven' t-shirt worn at gigs and parties in front of hundreds of thousands of people, aren't exactly hiding it! And that's before considering the 'tache, leather cap and trousers etc...! |
jazzrazzmatazz 04.08.2012 06:35 |
cmsdrums wrote: Good point about the Mineshaft t-shirt. It does make me laugh when the media often try to say that Fred his his homosexuality; the Mineshaft t-shirt in a video played all over the world, a 'Heaven' t-shirt worn at gigs and parties in front of hundreds of thousands of people, aren't exactly hiding it! And that's before considering the 'tache, leather cap and trousers etc...! yes, he wore those gay club shirts all the time! Mineshaft, Heaven and also I remember he wore Market Tavern shirt a lot on Magic Tour, which was a popular gay club in London (and I think he met Jim there too) but yes, all the signs were there before the 80s and he was definitely not hiding it. I guess people back then were too dumb to connect the dots....also, that red bandana he has at Rock Montreal.. I always seen it as a hanky code which indicated, in the gay scene, what kind of sex you prefer. and I heard a lot of Queen fans saying that Hot Space is like, definite gay era for Freddie and that's when it started but to me it's always been Jazz era. so yeah, I agree with you that it all came along way before the mustache and all that |
lvq 04.08.2012 13:31 |
Ever since I've found, not only about Freddie's death at the hand of AIDS but also about the same affliction affecting one of my best friends, I've made a bit of a research into this "gay plague", so bear with me. I don't think you can accurately date infection based only on symptoms of AIDS surfacing, because while indeed, the median age is around 8-10 years, almost 20% of infected people actually show symptoms much faster (less than 5 years after infection). In fact, it was within those people's ranks, that we began to "officially" notice the first casualties in 1981, with the virus probably setting the first strong foothold in the big cities of America in around 1976. Another cohort, made of almost 50% of infected people, show first AIDS related symptoms only after 10 years. Though most of them develop symptoms soon after. The best gauge, really is made through risk analysis, rather than incubation period. And sadly, this leads us to delving into Freddie's personal life, which is shameful, but "friends" have made it possible. It's almost impossible that he got it pre 1978, since he wasn't promiscuous and HIV wasn't all that spread. Plus, you can track his first gay relationship with David Minns, which ended in 1978. David never got infected. 1978 is from what I've heard, the year of change. He started having many night outs and it's unknown under who's company he spent them. I do know that from 1978 to 1979 he had an affair with Joe Fanelli and from 1979 to 1980 he had Tony Bastin keeping company. Now, Joe Fanelli himself died soon after Freddie did, but Tony Bastin died in the mid 80s. Both were struck by AIDS and the latter most probably was infected by the time of his relationship. Does it mean that Freddie definitely got it then? No, but it kinda unearths the first... probable exposure. If not then, then definitely, New York very early into the 80s, it would have been hard to dodge this plague with this kind of life style. By 1981, the time of the first cases, it is estimated that about 20% of gay man were already afflicted. So yeah, going by all I've said, around 1978 - 1982 which can be tighten further to 1978-1980. Most probable year? 1979 for me. Now there are two other points I'd like to make. Firstly, even if Freddie played safer after 1982, I think his path was very much sealed at that time, as were the paths of many gay man infected in the late 70s/ early 80s. In no way is anyone to blame for being infected in this time frame, because no one knew of this silent killer. Secondly, while Freddie might have become suspicious of being infected, probably scared at that thought, I refuse to believe he knew of his positive status before 1987, before the time he told Jim. Because I doubt Freddie would have ever knowingly put Jim at risk. And the alleged KS lesion which prompted testing, was most probably the first clear symptom of anything going awry. HIV is pretty much silent, until AIDS strikes. And even after the onset of AIDS, you can still go on rather well, until you start going in this downward spiral, in which Freddie visibly fell by the late 88 / early 89. Ah, and one last point, there is this narrative that if Freddie survived for one more year, he could have been saved. That's very wishful thinking. There are many famous celebrities who have died in the 92-95 time frame. Medication could have perhaps further extended his lifespan, but I'd say... a better estimate is maybe around 3 years. Then indeed, the first combination treatment could have prolonged his life long enough that he'd get to try the PIs, which made appearance in... 95-96 (?) . |
AlexRocks 05.08.2012 17:25 |
I have never heard of this living ten years thing with HIV back in the 1980's. Lol. Freddie only lived four years with the meds which is what I understand to be the average time back then. My understanding is a year or two without meds. Especially back in the 1980's. Honestly if Freddie had HIV before 1987 then he would be responsible to putting many people to death. As in murder. I mean he went screwing around people out of the wa zoo. A left wing reporter from Rolling Stone Magazine went to one of their concerts and was horrified at how Freddie had a line of men waiting to fuck him in some room. So maybe that has to do with some things not being told but there is little to no chance that it was the early 1980's mere less the late 1970's. Very few people had it back then and most were dead by 1981-1982 and it would still be years before anyone even knew what they died from. The guitarist from the B-52s Ricky Wilson died in 1985 and they did not even realise it was from AIDS until a good number of months AFTER he died. |
GratefulFan 06.08.2012 01:21 |
AlexRocks wrote: I have never heard of this living ten years thing with HIV back in the 1980's. Lol. Freddie only lived four years with the meds which is what I understand to be the average time back then. My understanding is a year or two without meds. Especially back in the 1980's. Honestly if Freddie had HIV before 1987 then he would be responsible to putting many people to death. As in murder. I mean he went screwing around people out of the wa zoo. A left wing reporter from Rolling Stone Magazine went to one of their concerts and was horrified at how Freddie had a line of men waiting to fuck him in some room. So maybe that has to do with some things not being told but there is little to no chance that it was the early 1980's mere less the late 1970's. Very few people had it back then and most were dead by 1981-1982 and it would still be years before anyone even knew what they died from. The guitarist from the B-52s Ricky Wilson died in 1985 and they did not even realise it was from AIDS until a good number of months AFTER he died.One of the more disturbing aspects of the thread, more even than it's rather pointless speculative nature, is the apparent threat to public health given the lack of knowledge of this disease 30 years after it entered public consciousness. lvq is exactly right. About half of the people who have contracted the virus become symptomatic around the 10 year mark, with only small minority showing symptoms before that period, and a larger minority going past a decade and beyond. That has always been true because it's a measure of how long it typically takes HIV to wear down the immune system to the point of AIDS defining illnesses before diagnoses or medication. As a generally healthy person living well in a first world country there is no reason to speculate that Fred was outside of the norms for the disease and a first exposure in the late 70's is the most sound conclusion statistically speaking. Which is all anybody can reasonably go on, not that there's all that much reasonable about trying very hard to glean any of this in the first place. I really hope all of you lol-ing and guessing 1,2,3 even 5 years aren't making assumptions about people in your real worlds based on ideas that the disease commonly develops that fast. Jeez. This should really be common knowledge. I recently read a news item that claimed only about 28% of HIV+ Americans have the virus under control. Part of that statistic is that about 20% of infected persons don't know they're infected. This kind of bad information can only contribute negatively to statistics like that. People really need to get that those who don't know they're infected typically thrive completely normally for a decade, and often longer. |
lvq 06.08.2012 04:51 |
I think what's hard to conceive for people is being HIV positive, while showing to be at the peak of your physical powers. And really, Freddie Mercury was very much at his peak from 80 to 86. He had to be, otherwise he never would have been able to join the band in so many tours. But that's the nature of HIV infection. You feel normal for an average of 10 years and only afterwards, do you show symptoms. There is variability of course. In fact, Freddie living 4 years after an AIDS diagnostic is very much outside of the normal scope of AIDS prognosis. And had Freddie... been with Marry... monogamously until 1982 and only after, falling to these promiscuous life, then yes, post 1982 would have had been the probable answer. But Freddie started fulfillment in the late 70s. And had one almost certain exposure in a 1 year relationship. Not to say that was THE event. But it does highlight risk and the risk, in hindsight, was overt. |
people on streets 06.08.2012 06:52 |
AlexRocks wrote: Honestly if Freddie had HIV before 1987 then he would be responsible to putting many people to death. As in murder.Of course not. |
people on streets 06.08.2012 07:10 |
lvq wrote: Ever since I've found, not only about Freddie's death at the hand of AIDS but also about the same affliction affecting one of my best friends, I've made a bit of a research into this "gay plague", so bear with me. I don't think you can accurately date infection based only on symptoms of AIDS surfacing, because while indeed, the median age is around 8-10 years, almost 20% of infected people actually show symptoms much faster (less than 5 years after infection). In fact, it was within those people's ranks, that we began to "officially" notice the first casualties in 1981, with the virus probably setting the first strong foothold in the big cities of America in around 1976. Another cohort, made of almost 50% of infected people, show first AIDS related symptoms only after 10 years. Though most of them develop symptoms soon after. The best gauge, really is made through risk analysis, rather than incubation period. And sadly, this leads us to delving into Freddie's personal life, which is shameful, but "friends" have made it possible. It's almost impossible that he got it pre 1978, since he wasn't promiscuous and HIV wasn't all that spread. Plus, you can track his first gay relationship with David Minns, which ended in 1978. David never got infected. 1978 is from what I've heard, the year of change. He started having many night outs and it's unknown under who's company he spent them. I do know that from 1978 to 1979 he had an affair with Joe Fanelli and from 1979 to 1980 he had Tony Bastin keeping company. Now, Joe Fanelli himself died soon after Freddie did, but Tony Bastin died in the mid 80s. Both were struck by AIDS and the latter most probably was infected by the time of his relationship. Does it mean that Freddie definitely got it then? No, but it kinda unearths the first... probable exposure. If not then, then definitely, New York very early into the 80s, it would have been hard to dodge this plague with this kind of life style. By 1981, the time of the first cases, it is estimated that about 20% of gay man were already afflicted.So yeah, going by all I've said, around 1978 - 1982 which can be tighten further to 1978-1980. Most probable year? 1979 for me. Now there are two other points I'd like to make. Firstly, even if Freddie played safer after 1982, I think his path was very much sealed at that time, as were the paths of many gay man infected in the late 70s/ early 80s. In no way is anyone to blame for being infected in this time frame, because no one knew of this silent killer. Secondly, while Freddie might have become suspicious of being infected, probably scared at that thought, I refuse to believe he knew of his positive status before 1987, before the time he told Jim. Because I doubt Freddie would have ever knowingly put Jim at risk. And the alleged KS lesion which prompted testing, was most probably the first clear symptom of anything going awry. HIV is pretty much silent, until AIDS strikes. And even after the onset of AIDS, you can still go on rather well, until you start going in this downward spiral, in which Freddie visibly fell by the late 88 / early 89. Ah, and one last point, there is this narrative that if Freddie survived for one more year, he could have been saved. That's very wishful thinking. There are many famous celebrities who have died in the 92-95 time frame. Medication could have perhaps further extended his lifespan, but I'd say... a better estimate is maybe around 3 years. Then indeed, the first combination treatment could have prolonged his life long enough that he'd get to try the PIs, which made appearance in... 95-96 (?) .Very good post. Thanks much! |
AlexRocks 06.08.2012 10:11 |
Of course Freddie would have been guilty of murder if he had HIV and went around screwing people and infecting them. What planet are you on?! You say he had it for ten years before 1987. So how is that not so? As it is he said himself that he did not start living clean and abstinate until he found out he had the disease. My understanding is the same it was not until shortly after he contacted it that he got checked for it because in the 1980's you could not live years with the disease. That's why people could only live a few years with the medicine and it was a big deal when people could live up to ten years with the medicines. Of course now the big deal is that people can supposedly live life much longer. |
AdamMethos 06.08.2012 12:29 |
Freddie could not be guilty of premeditated murder because he did not intentionally kill anyone. At the most, he could be guilty of negligent homicide, but even that is a stretch because it implies that he knew that his actions COULD cause death but did them anyway. Freddie didn't know he had HIV at the time he was promiscuous so he wouldn't have known he was harming anyone. |
lvq 06.08.2012 12:48 |
@AlexRocks The thing you're missing is that, while indeed, people... diagnosed with AIDS had a bleak prognosis, those people harbored HIV, the virus which causes AIDS, for years before the first symptoms arose, unwittingly infecting some their partners. HIV infection works like this: you get infected, the virus multiplies and it slowly, but systematically destroys your immune system. Now, there is a stage in this process, where the immune system is so weak that it becomes susceptible to viruses, parasites... that, normally, it would have no problem dealing with. Only then, does one develop telling symptoms. But until that stage, the virus remains silent... in the way that, one infected, generally does not sport any serious symptoms and feels perfectly fine. This asymptomatic period can last and does generally last for many years. Only when the person develops specific symptoms (caused by Opportunistic infections, acquired due to a weakened immune system), is that person diagnosed with AIDS. People diagnosed in the early 80s, indeed, didn't live long, because they already had developed AIDS by the time they were diagnosed. They were in basically... the end stage of the HIV infection. But those people had been infected for years before the onset of AIDS, time in which, the virus was working hard in spreading/damaging their immune system. It's just that, only the AIDS stage of the virus, was the stage that prompted doctor visits, because that's the time they felt the serious symptoms. You don't go to the doctor when you feel perfectly fine, you go when you are ill. Until 84, AIDS diagnostic was made solely by virtue of the specific AIDS related symptoms and the weakened immune system. A test was made available in late 84. With that test, people could be screened for the virus, thus be diagnosed way before the onset of AIDS. However, you still had to take the test, to know if you are a carrier or not. In the 80s, since there was no medicine/medicine was ineffective to slow HIV progression and because of the stigma attached to a HIV infection diagnosis, many people skipped testing and only got tested after they developed AIDS specific symptoms. Now, Freddie Mercury could have gotten tested and perhaps should have gotten tested earlier than he did. But when he did get tested, he was diagnosed with full blown AIDS, which means that, in the years prior, he was a carrier. How many years? Well... you can infer that by tracking down... the risk events. And really, from 1978 onward, those risk events became increasingly numerous. Culminating with perhaps that one relationship with Tony Bastin, who most probably was a carrier at that time. But that's the... official virus exposure, who knows how many times Freddie was exposed to HIV throughout this promiscuous period. Exposure doesn't necessarily mean infection, when exposed, there is this small chance of contracting virus, depending on the type of exposure. But obviously, with many exposures, that chance increases. Promiscuity made that chance very big and Freddie fell victim. |
AlexRocks 06.08.2012 20:53 |
He lived FOUR years with full blown AIDS? |
lvq 07.08.2012 02:57 |
Yes. It can happen. It's not common though. Freddie developed a Kaposi Sarcoma lesion on his arm, which prompted him to get tested and eventually get diagnosed. Now, there was these medical articles I've read, stating that Kaposi Sarcoma really is one of the milder of opportunistic infections one can acquire and that AIDS patients diagnosed with it have a much better prognosis... than, for example, patients diagnosed with pneumonia, which especially in the early 80s, was absolutely ravaging. Also, KS is not lethal generally, unless it affects your internal organs, especially your lungs. There is also the chance that, his immune system was still not in as worse condition as a regular AIDS patient, as Kaposi Sarcoma is known to surface even at higher levels of CD4 helper cells, (the cells which are attacked by the virus) though it's less likely. Finally, he did take what medication was available. Medication at that time could prolong life of AIDS patients for a few months. There are many variables to AIDS prognosis. Most generally die within one year of diagnostic, without medication, but some manage to live on for years. For Freddie, I'd say, AIDS effects really started showing in 1989. Which explains the drastic loss of weight. In 1988-1987, I'd suspect he was more troubled by the profound side effects of the medication taken, than by the disease itself. They were using AZT at that time, but they were prescribing very large doses of it, which made it very intoxicating to the human body. The same variability goes for HIV incubation period. You have people who have maintained a reasonable CD4 count for decades after infection, though even those people, show decrease in their immune capacity. You also have people who experience very rapid progression, taking in the span of months or a few years for the first symptoms to surface. The median for incubation is around 10 years, but that's an average, which is why I prefer tracking infection through risk events, rather than a median incubation period. In Freddie's case, we know he began living this promiscuous life in the 1978. We also know that one of his partners was likely to have been infected at the time of a 1 year relationship, in 1979-1980. Finally, New York was one of the cities most heavily hit by disease and we know Queen spent quite a bit of time there. All really point out to 1978 - 1982 being the main period of infection, more likely near the beginning of the interval. I think chances are very good that Freddie has been exposed to HIV strands from different people. From those exposures, you need only one to click and result in infection. I say this especially when looking at Freddie's track record. Tony Bastin, Bill Reid, Winnie the German all died of AIDS years before Freddie did and all had relationships with Freddie. And those are only official relationships. |
freddiefan91 07.08.2012 03:38 |
There is also the rumour that Freddie and Kenny Everett shared a lover in somebody called Nikolai who died of aids way before Freddie, so they both could of got it from him Its unfortunate that Freddie got the disease when the drugs were not strong enough to help him survive like people can nowadays |
lvq 07.08.2012 06:49 |
I think there are good chances Nikolai infected Everett who died 12-13 years after that exposure . (a number close to the median of life after HIV exposure, especially considering the advancement in medication) But I believe both Nikolai and Freddie were already infected at that time. Though of course, it is possible that infection was triggered by this event, just not that likely, given the many events that happened before this one. |
view 04.08.2013 00:51 |
si porque si estuvo con barbara valentin y ella no murió de sida y el siguiente fue winnie kirchberger y luego conoció a jim hutton que murió de sida, después que freddie Freddie's loves, channel 5, part 5 minuto 3:56 link bárbara: 3:40 |
Snackpot 05.08.2013 03:23 |
I susbscribe to the theory that Freddie had suspected or at least feared that he was sick for a long time before his diagnosis. I don't believe the test results in 1987 came as a surprise, as such. People often dismiss Briain's quotes that he felt during the Magic tour that Freddie knew on the basis his diagnosis wasn't until nearly a year later but it's not unlikely that Freddie had ignored signs/symptoms for a while before hand before finally getting checked out. Given Mary's version of events of Freddie ignoring the phone call from the doctor for a while it does suggest he was understandably having a hard time facing up to it. It may well have been something that had concerned him for a year or two before it was 'official'.So to date when he was infected becomes very difficult. If HIV can lay 'dormant', as it were, inside the body for years then it could have happened any time. |
jhfishslightlymad 16.09.2013 22:47 |
This is the post no one wants to read, and Im saying that as a huge fan of Queen and FM.I like ivqs post; a lot of it makes sense. Anyone who thinks Freddie was infected in the mid 80s is crazy, but I think there's a catch. I think that, while Freddie was definitely in increasing danger from 1978 onwards, I dont think he was actually infected until the fall of 1980, if not 1981. Freddie and Tony, from what I've read, met at the very end of 1979 when Queen were on the crazy tour, and were together from 1980 until 1982 (they did not split in 1980, and I have seen a picture of Bastin an Freddie with Everett and that Russian that looks like its from the Hot space period). As for Fanelli; I'm not sure that he would even have been infected when him and Freddie were together. That would mean Fanelli lived with HIV for almost 15 years and, without treatment, thats an extremely long time. Bastin, again from what I read, stuck to the UK while Freddie went abroad to the very worst possible place and did "everything with everybody" in New York City. Even though Tony died first, I don't believe Tony infected Freddie; I think Freddie went to NY in '80/'81, got infected there by some faceless stranger, came back and infected Tony (thats why i say this is the post no one wants to read). HIV doesnt come with a manual; in some people it takes 20 years to progress to AIDS without treatment; in others it takes ten weeks! There are a lot of people who, in absence of treatment, progress to AIDS in 4 or 5 years, and Tony was likely unfortunate enough to be one of them. I also think Freddie infected his German lover and Hutton and many many more. Then again, that stranger may not have been so faceless; there was an airline steward that Freddie met in NY in 1980/81 that he slept with and that man later died of AIDS as well. I think his name was Murphy....HIV was far more prevalent in 1980/81 than it was in 1978/79, and from what I read, Freddie was a lot more aggressive as far as New York went than he was even 2 years before. That being said, he is no more guilty being infected in 1981 vs 1979. Even as late as 1983 nothing really conclusive was known about AIDS at all. I also dont think the initial exposure/infection was what sealed his fate; i think he was reinfected many times and for him to live 5 years with full blown AIDS is extraordinary. And yes; if today's drugs had been around in 1991, we'd probably still have him. Maybe if he wasnt reinfected so many times, he actually wouldve lived long enough to get them in the mid 90s! Regardless of when he was infected and who he infected, we all post on this site because we love the man and his music. Nothing could ever change that. |
SmokyQuartz 22.09.2013 14:26 |
I was 15 in 1985. I was really into studying sciences and especially biology, it was 1985 that people were officially made aware of AIDS. Not before. I would have known. The gay community may have heard about it a little while before, but only as some strange, nameless disease that appeared to have killed some gay men in san francisco (that's when it was first heard about - but a lot of people thought it was propaganda against gay people....after all why would only gay people and not straight people get a disease?). Something else needs to be said too. No one had really heard about condoms back then, or if they had they were some laughable rubber things that maybe old granddads had used before the pill came about in the 60's. They were totally uncool back then...to the point of not even being thought about as an option. You probably wouldn't have seen many condoms in a chemist, not like today where they are everywhere. This was certainly NOT the case back then. I say that because nowadays maybe people think it's easy, use a condom, be safe......but we are talking the early 80's....no one ever died from sex back then (of course it was all set to change but at that point no one knew. And to top it all off, promiscuity was actually becoming fashionable. There were teenage magazines with articles in on 'How to Have a One Night Stand.' The 80's was all about equality for women too, a lot of people never wanted to get married and the moral aspects of promiscuity were just seen as old fashioned. A lot of this has changed, but when people think about Freddie's behaviour, it surely must be seen within that context. I'm talking of my memories from a heterosexual viewpoint, but for a gay or bisexual man in those times things were suddenly becoming liberated. The gay clubs were a way of gaining acceptance from others similar to yourself. If promiscuity was no longer seen as a bad thing, marriage was not particularly fashionable and there were clubs that accepted you as a gay person, AND you were a rockstar...and everyone was doing it without judgement....well I just think his behaviour becomes more understandable. Try to think of a world where AIDS had never been. That was the world he was living in. You've only got to listen to him in interviews to get a sense of a good person, a caring person. It's been suggested that Freddie's behaviour changed in 1985. Some people think it's because he knew he was sick. My guess is he was worried, but at that time EVERYONE was worried by the government campaign to raise awareness. It was a talking point, but not before. My friends and I were terrified of it. For a time teenagers were scared even to kiss each other. People criticise Freddie for being promiscuous when AIDS was about....if you look at the timeline, he was reported to be promiscuous before anyone was aware of it. He changed his behaviour at the same time as most people did. Sadly for him, due to travelling, etc, it was already too late. You know that's why I think the gay community showed so much dignity at that time....and think what a tragic and dreadful time in history that was....but they all pulled together, you didn't hear any blaming of each other. Even in Freddie's circles you haven't really heard blaming, just dignity and sadness from those left behind. The virus is to blame. |
musicland munich 22.09.2013 14:46 |
Well ...The disease was named AIDS in 1983 before it was often called "gay cancer" wich is not far feched because a lot of Aids patients were gay and developed cancer. But to the point we will never find out who infectet him. FACT ! And it wouldn't change anything. Freddie himself knew that he is hiv positive in 1984. (sources Mary Austin( he knew it for about seven years) and David Wigg (he knew it since 1984). But of couse he didn't speak to anyone at that point it was unknown how the virus was transmitet and there was no medical (pharmacy) option in the early 80's. But again who had given HIV to him - we will never find out - and I don't really care who it was. |
SmokyQuartz 22.09.2013 15:32 |
I totally agree, whoever gave it to him wouldn't have known what they were doing anyway. and it's true it's not going to change anything now. As I remember there was no test for HIV until about mid 1985. So not sure why it was reported that Freddie knew in 1984. There was very little publicity until then either because there was a lot of to-ing and fro-ing amongst the scientists globally, seeing if their theories were matching each other, etc. There might have been a skinny column somewhere near the back of a newspaper about a 'gay' disease, but as I say no one knew what was transmitting it and it all seemed a bit like propaganda. Maybe these reports that he 'knew' in 1984 were really just memories of his concerns when he heard about this nameless disease and had heard that it was affecting homosexual men, particularly those who lived in or had travelled in the US. But since there was no test then to find out, all anyone would have done in that situation was wait for more information. If the scientists were not shouting out to curb your sexual behaviour (no one knew if it was sexually transmitted) then how was anyone else to know... |
musicland munich 22.09.2013 15:51 |
There was no proper HIV Test in 84 - that's correct, but Freddie had acess to the best Doctors for sure. So he underwent multiple testings ( maybe he had some problems/ speculations of course) and as a result doctors told him he is possible/ maybe hiv positive. And in 85 with the new test method - he had to realize that the prediction from the 84 testings are correct. This results in leaving Munich head over heel and change his life. |
jhfishslightlymad 23.09.2013 07:31 |
Oh and I totally agree...there's NO WAY he would've known he was infecting people; it seems like in NY during the early 1980s, everyone was infecting everyone without knowing it, and people still are, even though 32/33 years later, there is no excuse....I don't even think AIDS really registered with him until after Rock Hudson died and by that point (I'm estimating) Freddie had already been carrying the uninvited guest for 4/5 years! And right after he was found to be infected, he started using protection with Jim Hutton. I've also read Greg Louganis' book, and he was very likely infected at about the same time as Freddie (and he's still alive!) It wasn't until after Rock Hudson died that he started caring about AIDS, but HIV doesn't care about that. All HIV cares about is eating white blood cells. |
Moët Et Chandin 30.09.2017 20:07 |
2nd December 1977 in New York |
Jekaling 03.10.2017 19:23 |
Not all that crap again. |
Dr Magus 04.10.2017 12:17 |
Freddie had HIV before he came to the UK in the early sixties. |
Queenman!! 04.10.2017 13:16 |
Gettin' tired of these HIV topics. Freddie got HIV when he opened his asshole to John Murphy or Tony Bastin. For god's sake stop this crap. |
Krypto_98 04.10.2017 13:35 |
It's a common known fact Freddie got it before he was born and that's why in boh rap he sings i sometimes wish I've never been born at all |
LOTV 05.10.2017 16:17 |
Queenman!! wrote: Gettin' tired of these HIV topics. Freddie got HIV when he opened his asshole to John Murphy or Tony Bastin. For god's sake stop this crap.What a lovely and informed post. You are a real charmer. |
Queenman!! 05.10.2017 21:59 |
LOTV wrote:===========Queenman!! wrote: Gettin' tired of these HIV topics. Freddie got HIV when he opened his asshole to John Murphy or Tony Bastin. For god's sake stop this crap.What a lovely and informed post. You are a real charmer. Thanks , your post stands out too... |
Moët Et Chandin 07.10.2017 07:09 |
October 1980 New York |
TRS-Romania 07.10.2017 20:59 |
If you read about HIV infection (and its symptoms) one might say that right around 1984 Freddie had more than once health issues with his voice especially when the Sun City concerts (3 of them!) were cancelled due to throat problems. Of course Freddie had more than once problems with his vocal chords, but not as in cancelling 3 concerts in a row.... There is also a report on his doctors advising him not to perform at Live Aid in 1985 due to ...vocal chord problems... I am not saying this is caused just by HIV, but it seems in 1984-1985 Freddie had more issues with his voice than ever before. Were these innocent throat infections? Perhaps. Maybe these were the first signs of a less effective immune system, that only later on showed it signs. Mind you that the first properly approved AIDS testing only appeared in 1985 ... and even those tests could give false positives. I therefore assume Freddie got a false positive when he first tested in 1985 (HIV has several strains that in Freddie's case might not have been detected at the time) , and probably Freddie's inner voice in 1985 told him that something was wrong with him or that he considered his life style too risky, whereas he abruptly left the Munich gay scene to settle down back in London with Jim. Still, Freddie cheated on Jim in 1986, thus assuming that even in 1986 he was not officially diagnosed with HIV/AIDS, as I would assume Freddie would have never infected Jim, if he would have known he was HIV positive. Probably after being infected with HIV in 1984 - he therefore initially suffered from some early symptoms, that later during the end of the year "settled down" only to show up more severely after the Magic Tour into early 1987. Maybe Freddie felt something was wrong in 1985 , but his first AIDS diagnosis was in April of 1987 ... (and I am really assuming that he did not get any positive HIV/AIDS diagnostic before that date, as he was with Jim - and Freddie would have never had unsafe sex with Jim if he would have known - as a fact - that he had HIV-AIDS) Just my 2 cents on the subject ... |
Invisible Woman 08.10.2017 10:33 |
If the exact date when he was infected known, that wouldn't change anything.Freddie didn't know for sure either when was infected.He probably had some doubts but "to know" and "suspect" isn't the same.Of course he wasn't a saint, but I don't believe that he would consciously endanger people with the possibility of infecting them. I read this topic and i decide to say something about this topic. But I was thinking about something else. Those rumors that he knew he was HIV positive before 1987(1984?) was based on Mary Austin,David Wigg and Barbara Valentin statements.But why would it be true that they said and not true what Jim Hutton and Peter Freeston said? 1986 year, after Freddie and Jim returned from Japan, the tabloids published the story that Freddie did HIV test and test was positive.If it's true that only Mary,David and Barbara knew that he was positive,by that logic, some of them sold the story to that newspaper. I am inclined to believe that these statements are merely an attempt to prove that they had a great significance in his life, greater than Jim and the other friends. I believe in what Jim and Peter said. I think Freddie wouldn't be able to hide it from them for years. These are just some of my thoughts and don't have to be true. I wouldn't have anything to say about this. |
Moët Et Chandin 08.10.2017 15:58 |
"It" happened somewhere in the US, highly likely in NY, 1977 - 1980. End of. |
Chopin1995 09.10.2017 10:19 |
Freddie got HIV between 1946 and 1991. End of story! |
Queenman!! 10.10.2017 11:01 |
Invisible Woman wrote: |
Seed_Of_Rhy 14.10.2017 13:00 |
[quote] According to Peter Phoebe Freestone it's most likely Freddie contracted the virus in or around the New York gay scene. Early eighties.(1980-1982) This was asked a lot at him at the conventions. [/quote] Me too think this most likely timespan... As one can see in Montreal '81 video close ups on Freddie (ex. when on the piano) he already has the marks of herpes or something similar on his left cheek. its quite pale though, but becomes visible when the skin stretches |
bucsateflon 17.10.2017 08:55 |
LOL those are marks specific of his ethnicity(indian) |
Sponge Caves 17.10.2017 12:05 |
Invisible Woman wrote: If the exact date when he was infected known, that wouldn't change anything.Freddie didn't know for sure either when was infected.He probably had some doubts but "to know" and "suspect" isn't the same.Of course he wasn't a saint, but I don't believe that he would consciously endanger people with the possibility of infecting them. I read this topic and i decide to say something about this topic. But I was thinking about something else. Those rumors that he knew he was HIV positive before 1987(1984?) was based on Mary Austin,David Wigg and Barbara Valentin statements.But why would it be true that they said and not true what Jim Hutton and Peter Freeston said? 1986 year, after Freddie and Jim returned from Japan, the tabloids published the story that Freddie did HIV test and test was positive.If it's true that only Mary,David and Barbara knew that he was positive,by that logic, some of them sold the story to that newspaper. I am inclined to believe that these statements are merely an attempt to prove that they had a great significance in his life, greater than Jim and the other friends. I believe in what Jim and Peter said. I think Freddie wouldn't be able to hide it from them for years. These are just some of my thoughts and don't have to be true. I wouldn't have anything to say about this.THIS ^^ I think personally these people were all battling it out to prove they knew Freddie most intimately too - I agree with you 100%. Like a pissing contest. Especially the women lol. Barbara talks 100% guff 100% of the time. Literally nothing she says can be corroborated by anyone else and she just wanted to look like she was in on the big AIDS secret, even though she admitted he didn't tell her a thing about it. She claims to know he had HIV (SYMPTOMATIC AS WELL, WITH FEVERS AND THROAT TUMOURS lol !!!) as early as 84, yet claims she had unprotected sex with him regardless. Doesn't seem likely that no one else noticed his symptoms for another 3 years after she did. Doesn't seem likely that she'd have sex with an obviously symptomatic HIV sufferer. But then the whole sex thing between them is utterly implausible, but I won't go into that here. Not the place! Mary also came up with 1984, but let's be honest here, she isn't the most trustworthy source either. Example 1 being that she has two or three very different stories about the time Freddie came out as gay to her. Example 2 is her claim his career was 'sagging' and he was about to "implode" during the in 86/87 when he was actually embarking on the new project with the TGP and negotiating work with Montserrat Caballe/Mike Moran. Just because she was his close friend does not mean she is correct and to me it looks like she has a bad memory. Also she has the 'wife' role to play so wants to act like she was the most in the know. Okay so it's likely Freddie told her before anyone else but not in 1984 when the HIV test wasn't even released til 1985. It's yet another example of her not giving a clear narrative or correct dates. David Wigg gets most of his information from Mary so is just parroting her. He also makes lots of incorrect statements in his interviews. |
Sponge Caves 17.10.2017 12:06 |
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Sponge Caves 17.10.2017 12:07 |
Sorry about the empty quote reply above - my reply didn't post for some bizarre reason. See above it for my reply! |
Beverly Andrews 17.10.2017 12:22 |
Had he not died in 1991 of AIDS-related pneumonia. |
Moët Et Chandin 19.10.2017 09:59 |
17 November 1978, 05:07 hrs New York City |
miraclesteinway 19.10.2017 10:59 |
This topic seems to keep coming up. I suppose it's biographical information pertinent to his death and therefore the cessation of his music, although it does seem like some people on here are attracted to discussing the more morbid aspects of life. My only contribution is that in 1987 Freddie found out he had AIDS. His test showed, according to Peter Freestone, that he had full-blown AIDS and was not simply HIV positive. I would reason that he was testing fairly regularly by that point and knew that he was infected before then. I posted on this forum before about a friend of mine who worked in the testing clinics in the 1980s. Around 2002 or could have been 03, 04, memory isn't all that reliable (before I personally knew about this forum) she told me that the clinic where she worked tested Freddie's sample and it proved positive. They were sworn to secrecy and not one of them leaked anything to the press as far as she knows. According to her it was about 1984, 85, and she didn't work for the clinic much longer after that. Now whether it was actually 1987 and she got her year wrong, I don't know. What she told me was that she was waiting for the story to break about Freddie for the best part of a decade before he died (1984 to 1991 is the best part of a decade), and that she knew he was ill long before the public suspected anything. This would tie in with Mary Austin's account. It's difficult to know because the AIDS timeline around the early 80s is still very murky. People were only just becoming aware of what it was and how it worked, and some people didn't realise it was sexually transmitted. Some infected people would go in to denial (quite a natural reaction), and others would probably have more readily accepted. There are accounts of Freddie's general health not being so good around 1984-85, so perhaps that ties in with some kind of flare up. That said, anything is possible. Catching a cold or flu can't necessarily be attributed to a complication of early-stage HIV even in an infected person, and without actually going back to the year 1984 and being Freddie's doctor and living Freddie's life, we're probably never going to know. By the way in 1986-7 Freddie possibly did feel his career was sagging. He was working on that solo project which he abandoned in favour of Barcelona, he may have felt a little down after the massive tour with Queen (the massive, and hugely successful tour), and the Kind of Magic LP did well but it wasn't the kind of success which he craved. The Mr Bad Guy LP was a failure, and perhaps he still felt that niggling somewhere inside, and he also knew he was ill and probably going to die. That he went on to produce music at all after this was a miracle. Excuse the pun... |
dudley-fufkin 7834 19.10.2017 11:52 |
Whats with all the aids stuff? Everyone knows freddie died of man flu! |
dudley-fufkin 7834 19.10.2017 11:52 |
Whats with all the aids stuff? Everyone knows freddie died of man flu! |
Moët Et Chandin 19.10.2017 14:03 |
Just after Christmas 1978, Freddie had what he thought was a most severe bout of flu, and the remainder of the Jazz tour then started late January 79. |
c.jory 19.10.2017 15:45 |
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c.jory 19.10.2017 15:46 |
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c.jory 19.10.2017 15:47 |
First up, sorry for the blank messages - the Quote function is failing me The ELISA HIV test was cleared for release in March 1985 in the UK, so that is probably when your friend's lab tested him. So even if Freddie was suspicious (likely) he didn't KNOW for definite, and therefore, Mary did not know either. Mary IS capable of being wrong, despite being close. (Think of the three different coming out as gay stories she has, as someone mentioned above). She also said in The Mysterious Mr Mercury that he didn't tell her til much later. The only illness evidence I can think of with Freddie in 85 was his Simon Bates interview where he said he'd been unwell and of course the throat infection during the Live Aid period, and like you said, may not necessarily be due to HIV. Going to discount Valentin's account of all his symptoms because nothing she ever said ties in with anyone else. This is the woman who claimed he strangled her, then denied it, then claimed he tried to drown her lol. So lets put her to one side. If he was going to implode, he'd have surely done it in 1983/4 when Queen were inactive, or not getting on well. He was in Peter Freestone's opinion 'very emotional' at that time. Mack gives an account of him being very upset that he'd lost control of himself and ended up in a dumpster at this time too. It seemed like his career was uncertain and his personal life was spiraling out of control at that time. Conversely in 1986 his life seemed to be back on track having got rid of subversive influences from his life. He appeared to clean himself up, stop sleeping around and clubbing and inventive again. I know it's likely he had found out he was HIV+ by this period, but nonetheless he was settled in his home with Jim - Terry Giddings even remarked that he was in a 'happy place' just before he discovered he had full blown AIDS. Furthermore, despite his secret diagnosis, he sounds jokey, and enthusiastic for future projects in his David Wigg interviews. |
YAWN 19.10.2017 16:22 |
Lol what accounts were there of Freddie not being in good health in 84 and 85? The only person who made that claim was Barbara and she lied about absolutely everything. Peter never mentioned Freddie being ill or not being in the best health in 84 or 85. Nobody suspectedanything until later on. And I'm sorry, but I just don't believe you and your friend being someone who just happened to have tested Freddie's blood. How did she know it was his blood? He used a fake a name to test under. The only person who had his real information was his doctor. I'm American but I worked in an LGBT youth center for years and when we tested, we NEVER were able to view the person's personal information and if they used a fake name, that's all we had. The doctor was the one who had their info and they (by law) were not allowed to tell anyone what their real name was. Even if your friend saw Freddie come in the clinic, she would have no way of knowing that was Freddie's blood and she certainly would not have been told the results and to not talk to the press. Freddie would not use a name that could be easily traced back to him. Every biography on him said what his birth name was. He wouldn't use that to test under. As for Mary I think she either said 84 to "outshine" the already lying Barbara in the 'I knew him best' trash show, or she genuinely got her years mixed up. Let's stop putting all our confidence in 2 women who weren't around him daily and start focusing on the man (and men) who were. Peter Freestone is the most trustworthy source. He never said Freddie's health wasn't the best in 84/85. We know he tested in 87 but the earliest he tested before that (if he did) Peter said was 86. 1984 is just not possible. |
Dustin Zimmerman 19.10.2017 16:28 |
Horse shit. Your friend happened to be in the clinic that tested his blood and she managed to find out who he was (without getting fired) despite him not using his real name? Yeah and I'm Freddie's bastard son, nice to meet you. |
Biggus Dickus 19.10.2017 17:45 |
Whether the story told by the friend of miraclesteinway is true or not, there would have been people interacting with Freddie at the clinic. I'm talking about the people physically taking the sample etc. Sworn to secrecy or not, co-workers do talk about stuff with each other, even if they're not supposed to. It's human. |
Dustin Zimmerman 19.10.2017 18:43 |
Biggus Dickus wrote: Whether the story told by the friend of miraclesteinway is true or not, there would have been people interacting with Freddie at the clinic. I'm talking about the people physically taking the sample etc. Sworn to secrecy or not, co-workers do talk about stuff with each other, even if they're not supposed to. It's human.The people who took his blood (more likely just one person) weren't likely to talk. My mother was a nurse for 26 years. She said people got fired for less so they wouldn't risk it. Especially with a celebrity. The guys story is crap but also how did Freddie get tested in 84 when the test wasn't available until the next year? Did he time travel perhaps? |
Invisible Woman 19.10.2017 19:22 |
Here's what Peter Freestone said on this subject in his blog: http://www.freddiemercury.com/en/ask-phoebe/blog-70 |
Biggus Dickus 20.10.2017 05:09 |
Did you read the text properly Zimmerman? Miraclesteinway did say and I quote "According to her it was about 1984, 85." Btw why the hell are the quote and edit buttons invisible to me. |
Seed_Of_Rhy 20.10.2017 10:17 |
Biggus Dickus , so i'm not the one who don't seeing the edit buttons.."glad" to be welcome to the club then)) Villiers , I like your way of thinkin' but you got one thing arguable - statement that Freddie was in good health in 1984-85. Even if we assume, that Freestone (except Jim and maybe Joe) is the man who knew him best Freddie still can have some secrets from him about his daily conditions and/or minor pathologies. For ex. we don't know how low was his pain threshold or sensitivity to medications... |
c.jory 20.10.2017 13:52 |
I think Villiers is saying that the main source used to claim Freddie was showing signs of illness in 1984/5 is not a good one, not that it is impossible for him to have been ill at all. We do know he had a some kind of flu/viral infection in late March 85, and then throat infection in July 85. They could have been just normal illnesses; we'll never know. They didn't seem a big deal in any case and he appears to have completely recovered from them. He was certainly fit enough to tour from August-October 84, then from April-May 85 with no problems. The only other source for illness is from compulsive liar Barbara Valentin who came up with all this bizarre stuff about throat tumours, him practically dying and coughing his lungs up during a threesome with another man and her calling her gynaecologist because he had a fever! No one else has mentioned such ailments, (Peter Freestone mentioned he'd had a couple of fits that a doctor said was due to too much cocaine) at least not until he was officially diagnosed and symptomatic. So it's just one more thing in a long line of Valentin statements that cannot be verified by other close people, like Jim and Peter, who were open about the REAL symptoms he was suffering when he became "full blown". |
miraclesteinway 25.10.2017 08:23 |
Actually there was an HTLV-III test in 1984.... but anyway whatever kind of test Freddie had doesn't mean that my story is crap. My source on the other hand, could have been bullshitting. I was definitely told this story by a woman who was definitely a microbiologist who tested samples from the Harley Street Clinics in the mid-1980s. She told me that the testing of Freddie's specimen was "about 1984 or 1985" and given the tendency for people's memory to become cloudy over time, that might even mean 1987. When she said that she knew before it was public knowledge, well there was that one story in 1986 about Freddie testing positive and being accosted by a journalist at the airport, but let's face it, at the time the story was refuted and Freddie went on to complete the Barcelona project, appear in public, and it was only really when Queen didn't tour The Miracle LP that things started to really heat up in the press. Yes there were some flurries of activity before then, but Freddie wasn't subjected to the constant hounding until much later on. I'm rambling... back to my original point.... My original point is yes I was told that story, I suspect that the lady who told me this was telling the truth, but it's highly possible that she got the year mixed up in her mind. There are many times I've said things like "in 2004 I did....." only to find out later it was 2006, or 2001, or 1998. It happens. Hell, I even say "a couple of months ago" when actually it happened a couple of years ago. Everyone does that. Remember, most people in the world are not doing internet searches trying to piece together Freddie Mercury's AIDS timeline. Most people are too busy doing other things..... |
Moët Et Chandin 15.11.2017 21:49 |
Another unsupported snippet from the "Sonebody To Love" book was that " Freddie Mercury did not visit the Mineshaft until 1980". If you watch the video for Don't Stop Me Now, recorded in Jan 1979, Freddie can be seen wearing a TShirt advertising this very club under his leather Jacket. Now he was unlikely to have got that shirt from the local Walmart, souvenir shop, or a local drug store. The person who accompanied Fred on his early visits to NY gay clubs 77-78, before he hired Pheobe , and could've probably given more details was Paul Prenter. Details on NY clubs visited, or whether Freddie was a regular at the Mineshaft before 1980, or just doing a couple of visits for a reconnaissance exercise before returning a couple of years down the line |
Moët Et Chandin 16.11.2017 13:10 |
It remains as secret as Freddie wIshed it to be at the time, a time when Queen were in the ascendancy to conquering the US |
john bodega 16.11.2017 14:06 |
"most people in the world are not doing internet searches trying to piece together Freddie Mercury's AIDS timeline" ... yeah, and I'm just sick because of it. We've gotta pin the tail on this donkey, fast! |
Moët Et Chandin 18.11.2017 02:15 |
Another song written by Freddie in the summer of 78, and included on the Jazz Album was "Let Me Entertain You". In the last verse Freddie wrote: " The S & M pleasure chest, and if you dig the New York scene we'll have a son of a bitch of a time" |
Perk 27.05.2019 04:32 |
Freddie was already infected with HIV at LIVE Aid. Given that every lover he had from 1981 On has died from it I’m going to say around then. I agree with the San Francisco theory. If he got it in NYC how come two of his “NY daughters are negative”. Also since Winnie outlived him he could’ve gotten it in Munich but he was infected by latest 1983 there were no reliable tests until 1986. So insurance for the Magic Tour wouldn’t have been an issue. |
Woody43 27.05.2019 12:31 |
'Another song written by Freddie in the summer of 78, and included on the Jazz Album was "Let Me Entertain You". In the last verse Freddie wrote: " The S & M pleasure chest, and if you dig the New York scene we'll have a son of a bitch of a time" The line is 'the S&M attraction, we got the best chance' As in the star and main attraction, tour headliners. I dont beleive there was any other meaning or context for that line. |
mooghead 27.05.2019 17:40 |
? |
doughnut 27.05.2019 18:09 |
perk Freddie didn't sleep with Lee Nolan of the NYC Daughters and it was one night at the most two with Thor. After that they remained just friends. If you read Thor's thread he confirms he was aware of the danger and started to use protection. Freddie has a lot of lovers so we aren't aware if they all died of aids. He didn't sleep with John Murphy and he died of aids . Tony Bastin died quite a few years before Freddie so its possible Freddie caught it from him in the late 70's . anyway I hate this ongoing saga, he has been dead 27n years now and nothing is going to change that. Why can't people leave it. |
Galileo1564 28.05.2019 03:57 |
miraclesteinway, I don’t know if you’re still around but HTLV-III is just an older name for HIV. It’s the exact same virus. There were at least 3 early names for HIV, because when you grow a new virus in your lab you have the right to name it. Once they were all discovered to be the same, the name HIV was decided upon—by some committee I think. That was in 1986. doughnut—yes it’s really silly. If he had died of the flu would people be asking this? There always seems to be some unstated subtext to these threads. |
nikilabiri 05.09.2019 02:17 |
Happy birthday to loving Freddie.anyone who has the source.that Mary says that freddie knew 7years before he had hiv?i saw that video and cant find it now |
Galileo1564 05.09.2019 18:56 |
Knew what 7 years before what? Freddie was diagnosed full blown in spring 1987. 7 years before that would be 1980. There are a couple of quotes from Mary saying Freddie “knew” some unspecified something before he was diagnosed. Her comments don’t make a lot of sense for the era. In 1987 you didn’t know you had AIDS until you were diagnosed with it, and the meaning of a positive HIV test or being diagnosed with lesser forms of HIV disease meant an uncertain future, not that AIDS would necessarily follow. So it’s never been clear to me what Mary is talking about. It’s pretty clear from things said by a number of people that he wasn’t feeling well during at least parts of the Magic Tour. Whether his not feeling well at that time was clearly HIV disease or not isn’t known. I think it’s only in retrospect that people say that’s when it started. |
Saint Jiub 05.09.2019 21:18 |
nikilabiri wrote: Happy birthday to loving Freddie.anyone who has the source.that Mary says that freddie knew 7years before he had hiv?i saw that video and cant find it nowlink He definitely knew he was HIV positive prior to the start of the Magic Tour in June 1986. Per Mary Austin at the 23 minute mark of the 2011 BBC interview (see above link). "The last tour he knew and it was really hard work for him. Working through the emotional pain; Knowing it was going to be his last tour" ... |
runner_70 05.09.2019 21:36 |
Saint Jiub wrote:Utter Bollocksnikilabiri wrote: Happy birthday to loving Freddie.anyone who has the source.that Mary says that freddie knew 7years before he had hiv?i saw that video and cant find it nowlink He definitely knew he was HIV positive prior to the start of the Magic Tour in June 1986. Per Mary Austin at the 23 minute mark of the 2011 BBC interview (see above link). "The last tour he knew and it was really hard work for him. Working through the emotional pain; Knowing it was going to be his last tour" ... |
nikilabiri 07.09.2019 01:44 |
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nikilabiri 07.09.2019 01:47 |
thnxx runner_70 you were very helpfull...although i remember that 2 months ago i saw a video that mary said freddie knew about 7 years before.i thought it was in the"untold story"but wasnt there |
lsg 08.09.2019 07:39 |
jhfishslightlymad wrote: This is the post no one wants to read, and Im saying that as a huge fan of Queen and FM.I like ivqs post; a lot of it makes sense. Anyone who thinks Freddie was infected in the mid 80s is crazy, but I think there's a catch. I think that, while Freddie was definitely in increasing danger from 1978 onwards, I dont think he was actually infected until the fall of 1980, if not 1981. Freddie and Tony, from what I've read, met at the very end of 1979 when Queen were on the crazy tour, and were together from 1980 until 1982 (they did not split in 1980, and I have seen a picture of Bastin an Freddie with Everett and that Russian that looks like its from the Hot space period). As for Fanelli; I'm not sure that he would even have been infected when him and Freddie were together. That would mean Fanelli lived with HIV for almost 15 years and, without treatment, thats an extremely long time. Bastin, again from what I read, stuck to the UK while Freddie went abroad to the very worst possible place and did "everything with everybody" in New York City. Even though Tony died first, I don't believe Tony infected Freddie; I think Freddie went to NY in '80/'81, got infected there by some faceless stranger, came back and infected Tony (thats why i say this is the post no one wants to read). HIV doesnt come with a manual; in some people it takes 20 years to progress to AIDS without treatment; in others it takes ten weeks! There are a lot of people who, in absence of treatment, progress to AIDS in 4 or 5 years, and Tony was likely unfortunate enough to be one of them. I also think Freddie infected his German lover and Hutton and many many more. Then again, that stranger may not have been so faceless; there was an airline steward that Freddie met in NY in 1980/81 that he slept with and that man later died of AIDS as well. I think his name was Murphy....HIV was far more prevalent in 1980/81 than it was in 1978/79, and from what I read, Freddie was a lot more aggressive as far as New York went than he was even 2 years before. That being said, he is no more guilty being infected in 1981 vs 1979. Even as late as 1983 nothing really conclusive was known about AIDS at all. I also dont think the initial exposure/infection was what sealed his fate; i think he was reinfected many times and for him to live 5 years with full blown AIDS is extraordinary. And yes; if today's drugs had been around in 1991, we'd probably still have him. Maybe if he wasnt reinfected so many times, he actually wouldve lived long enough to get them in the mid 90s! Regardless of when he was infected and who he infected, we all post on this site because we love the man and his music. Nothing could ever change that.I read from Freddie in an article, that he had the WORST flu of his life of September 1982, and was sick when Queen did “Under Pressure “ on Saturday Night Live” in September. So from what a lot of MD’s said, one gets flu like symptoms approximately 6 weeks post infection. I say it was July-August 1982. |
lsg 08.09.2019 07:47 |
jhfishslightlymad wrote: |
lsg 08.09.2019 07:58 |
I read from Freddie in an article, that he had the WORST flu of his life in September 1982, and was sick when Queen did “Under Pressure “ on Saturday Night Live” in September 82. So from what a lot of MD’s said, one gets flu like symptoms approximately 6 weeks post infection. I say initial infection may have been July-August 1982. His NYC friends whom he calls “his NY daughters “ insisted vehemently that Freddie never slept with flight attendant John Murphy. They knew John and stated this event never happened. They do indicate that Murphy did sleep with flight attendant “patient zero “Gaeten Dugas” Either way, I feel July or August of 1982 just because of his complaints of “ the worst flu of his life” And yes, he and Kenny Everett shared the same Russian lover living with Everett and a Spaniard in Everett’s home after he divorced his wife. I think the Russian Nicolai died after John Murphy.....but before Bastin. |
Seed_Of_Rhy 09.09.2019 09:01 |
Lsgp03, never heard about Freddie's interview of the "worst flu of his life". But it can be interesting in case of his desease progression, if true! But we cannot be sure about SNL Sept'82 case, as somebody (Freestone i think, if my memory didn't fucks me) told that it was a throat nodules thing, that can be pretty unrelated to HIV/AIDS. As Fred got the problems with vocal cords and bronchii from the beginning of his career. Also i'd read in some topic there, that during one show (in South Africa, as i remember) in 1983-84 he got his throat bleed. But it was attributed (by him or the press) on the dry climate in country. Btw, russian lover you write about is Nikolay Grishanowich? This particular horse is dark, as there is no detailed info about him in Internet...only pieces of crap biography which may be a fake. A bit weird. |
miraclesteinway 10.09.2019 03:52 |
I'm still around yes! Yeah I was aware of the different names for HIV prior to 1986. All this stuff about Freddie having the worst flu ever is really just a guessing game. I am HIV-negative and I get terrible flu from time to time, including ones that develop into bronchitis and pneumonia. Once you've had it once you can be more susceptible the next time. I know that when people seroconvert they tend to fall quite ill with various complaints and that it goes away after. Let's not forget that Freddie was constantly on tour at this time, his voice was constantly giving out from over-use (I'm talking the period 1978-1986 with that break in 1983), and that a singer falling ill with flu is not really an unusual thing. Bleeding vocal chords and blood in the cough is also not unusual when the vocal folds are compromised. Perhaps we could observe that Freddie seemed to be unwell more often in the run up to his AIDS-test of 1987, but again that would be at best a bad guess at what was actually going on. Given that he had developed AIDS by 1987, and was therefore already very sick through the recording of Barcelona, The Miracle, Innuendo, Made In Heaven and from what we can glean from Mary Austin's statement the last leg of the Magic Tour, it's a wonder we actually got the music that we got from him during this time. Obviously Freddie was exposed to the virus before 1986, in the Magic Tour videos he looks tired in comparison to his previous tours, and it would seem that some here have observed evidence of seroconversion in him as early as 1984 - someone mentioned a Kaposi's Sarcoma lesion. I'm not sure about that, to have full-blown AIDS for all that time was quite rare at that time. It would seem that the average life expectancy with AIDS (as opposed to just HIV) was 3 years. Freddie lived for 4 and a half years after diagnosis. That's amazing in itself. It's really shit that he's gone, or even that he wasn't healthy enough to see the release of Made In Heaven (which wouldn't have been called Made In Heaven under those circumstances), or even a tour. Mind you, it sucks that we all have to get older and face our missed opportunities. Freddie's life was a great example of taking every opportunity available to him at a time when the ground was still fertile enough for those opportunities to mean something. Sigh. |
Seed_Of_Rhy 10.09.2019 12:48 |
I come to think that it was lung ilnesses which drive him down to the end. And AIDS just deepened this, made it worse. In the interview with Queen in '89 link (considered his last) he loses his breath at moments but still smokes (one could hear he's clicking his lighter two or three times during conversation). Also at the end it seems Fred's slurring some phrases...how its sad to hear that the desease now had been inevitably takin his body over. |
runner_70 10.09.2019 19:31 |
Seed_Of_Rhy wrote: I come to think that it was lung ilnesses which drive him down to the end. And AIDS just deepened this, made it worse. In the interview with Queen in '89 link (considered his last) he loses his breath at moments but still smokes (one could hear he's clicking his lighter two or three times during conversation). Also at the end it seems Fred's slurring some phrases...how its sad to hear that the desease now had been inevitably takin his body over.He neither is out of breath nor is he slurring phrases. I am getting sick of those threads about when or from whom he got infected. What effect would it have on you if you knew??? |
Seed_Of_Rhy 11.09.2019 10:38 |
runner_70 wrote: He neither is out of breath nor is he slurring phrases. I am getting sick of those threads about when or from whom he got infected. What effect would it have on you if you knew???Hey, calm down, i just wrote he's really hard to breath (or talk) in that interview and one can hear that especially in the end. I've got no intention to know all his warts and sores and medical diagnosis journals, but there's some interest to track his life. It's like tracking the path of the star falling...makes you feel fascinating and curious. That's all. |
nikilabiri 03.10.2019 00:41 |
I ment that mary said he knew 7years before 1991.i thought i saw a video not a radio bbc record,that mary said freddie knew 7years before..deffinetly i saw brian may saying freddie knew 5years ago but if you listen carefully what mary says at radio that freddie knew at magic tour and continues"he looked at me,i look at him"meaning that also mary knew it.and again she says that freddie knew from his gp but he said to her that it was mistake and he revieled after 18months.so if you calculate 18months before magic tour,we go to january 1985. somewhere there freddie he first learned he was hiv possitive.so he kept it secret from mary(i imagine that it was when freddie didnt answer gps calls and "just by chance she was told the truth"as mary says at the interview)18months before tell her the truth.well,the order is this.about december 1984-january 1985 mary found out from gp .i woundt want to be at this gps possition,what freddie told him about revieling it to mary.freddie also knew and convince her that he was well.and revieles her at summer 1986 so at magic tour both knew his situation.we come to a conclusion that freddie also knew at live aid,where mary didnt just back then.according to mary freddie knew 7years before he died.sorry for my bad english. |
runner_70 03.10.2019 17:42 |
nikilabiri wrote: I ment that mary said he knew 7years before 1991.i thought i saw a video not a radio bbc record,that mary said freddie knew 7years before..deffinetly i saw brian may saying freddie knew 5years ago but if you listen carefully what mary says at radio that freddie knew at magic tour and continues"he looked at me,i look at him"meaning that also mary knew it.and again she says that freddie knew from his gp but he said to her that it was mistake and he revieled after 18months.so if you calculate 18months before magic tour,we go to january 1985. somewhere there freddie he first learned he was hiv possitive.so he kept it secret from mary(i imagine that it was when freddie didnt answer gps calls and "just by chance she was told the truth"as mary says at the interview)18months before tell her the truth.well,the order is this.about december 1984-january 1985 mary found out from gp .i woundt want to be at this gps possition,what freddie told him about revieling it to mary.freddie also knew and convince her that he was well.and revieles her at summer 1986 so at magic tour both knew his situation.we come to a conclusion that freddie also knew at live aid,where mary didnt just back then.according to mary freddie knew 7years before he died.sorry for my bad english.You watched a certain shit movie a bit too often..... |
nikilabiri 11.07.2020 21:58 |
i don't thing so,i just combine words that have been said,btw i watch all kind of movies...:P |
oystermouth1971 23.07.2020 19:56 |
I go along with Phoebe Freestone’s account. He would have mulled over the very real possibility of HIV (but not actually tested for it) until spring ‘87 with the emerging signs of (possible) KS. Tired during the Magic Tour? I don’t read much into that at all: Freddie didn’t have a gym routine whilst owning two of them (again, as per Freestone) and also there is the undeniable fact he wasn’t getting any younger to be running all around the (bigger) stage every other night for two hours at a time at almost 40 years of age whilst still smoking. So yeah, all things considered, to be a bit ‘tired’ would be par for the course there I think. Agree he was probably infected late 70s/Early 80s but no he didn’t find out formally until 1987. Which is probably why he only then suddenly embarked on his bucket list project of working with Monserrat Caballe to get it in the bag firstly before doing yet another Queen album. If he had been diagnosed before ‘87, I don’t see him doing the Magic Tour & I think he would have hooked up with Caballe sooner than he did. |
Mkls 29.07.2020 20:10 |
the Magic tour shows were full of references to his obvios concern of the disease - from wembley "we're going to stay together until we fucking well die," to snapping at the tv reporter a few days later. "if i am still alive, i will come back".. it is obvious. |
brENsKi 29.07.2020 21:18 |
Mkls wrote:the Magic tour shows were full of references to his obvios concern of the disease - from wembley "we're going to stay together until we fucking well die," to snapping at the tv reporter a few days later. "if i am still alive, i will come back".. it is obvious.hindsight is always 20.20. back (1986) then no-one outside of Freddie's circle had the remotest of clues. |
oystermouth1971 29.07.2020 22:02 |
Mkls wrote: the Magic tour shows were full of references to his obvios concern of the disease - from wembley "we're going to stay together until we fucking well die," to snapping at the tv reporter a few days later. "if i am still alive, i will come back".. it is obvious.Sure, he would have been clued up as to his chances of already having HIV during that tour but I’m saying he wouldn’t have been tested to confirm at that point. Ignorance was bliss if you like. Until he was showing signs of KS the following year. |
silver_salmon 29.07.2020 22:39 |
Freddie die of COVID-91.... END |
FreddieDearie 02.08.2020 19:51 |
Mary Austin said Freddie knew during the Magic tour. Phoebe, Brian and Roger have all gone on record saying, that in hindsight, they believe Freddie knew based on some behaviors that they didn’t understand until later. It was 1986, an AIDS test wasn’t even really available until 1985, so insurance had not get gotten to the point of requiring AIDS tests for coverage. |
Markman38 03.08.2020 07:33 |
Wel in my memory Freddie never ended a Magic Tour Show with the words See you next time, which could indicate that he knew it would be the last time he toured. I also understand that the afterparty's from the Magic Tour where very much reduced comparing to earlier tours. But it's guessing all around. Around 1984 Aids was this unknown scary disease but Freddie was defintly in the circles where it was spreading very rapidly. |
FreddieDearie 08.08.2020 17:39 |
In all likelihood, timing wise, he was infected during the time he was hanging out with the “New York Daughters” in the early 80’s. |