| anderssteen 13.05.2020 09:27 |
It's been years since my last post here, but I'm happy to be back. I've always been a great fan of Rogers solo output especially the 1977 single (and the two first albums). I admired him for being able to make such a convincing doo-wop arrangement of the soul-funk track (I Wanna) Testify) by The Parliaments. If one cares to compare the two tracks it is obvious that Rogers version is a complete remake as only part of the original song is used. How did he come up with this unlikely idea? Well he didn't. The track on the A-side of Rogers 1977 single is indeed NOT "(I Wanna) Testify" of The Parliaments but "Women and Drinkin'" by The Persuasions. Admittedly the doo-wop group The Persuasions uses the chorus (the "I wanna testify-part) of the Parliaments track in their own song. Rogers track however is an almost note-for-note re-recording of the Persuasions song (with added instrumental parts). The Parliaments released "(I Wanna) Testify in 1967 The Persuasions released "Women and Drinkin'" in April 1977 (Elektra E-45396) Roger released his single in August 1977 While I absolutely don't mind Roger having done a somewhat "cheap" cover version of a great song I do wonder how/why he/someone messed the credits up. Also I wonder if no-one stumbled across this before? (What does the liner-notes of "The Lot" say) Here's links to three great songs: The Parliaments - (I Wanna) Testify link The Persuasions - Women and Drinkin' link Roger Taylor - (I Wanna) Testify link Anders |
| . 13.05.2020 09:44 |
Brilliant! How did you make this discovery? .... and thanks for posting. |
| anderssteen 13.05.2020 09:52 |
Thanks, you're welcome. I visited a HiFi-shop just the other day where they played another album by The Persuasions. I found it entertaining and well-recorded so yesterday I went to my local record-store and found their album "Chirpin' which has Women and Drinkin' on it. Recognized the ressemblance immediately. |
| . 13.05.2020 09:54 |
As you say, both were released just months apart back in 1977, so what's the story here? |
| anderssteen 13.05.2020 10:44 |
Good question |
| Negative Creep 13.05.2020 12:01 |
Nice find. Whilst it is clearly a cover version of that song and that they covered it up is dubious (and quite surprising that it wasn't found out at the time because it wasn't some old unknown song) - now calling the track cheap and "an almost note-for-note re-recording of the Persuasions song (with added instrumental parts)." seems really petty and wrong. Musically it has been completely re-worked - the original is bare bones to say the least. EDIT - I don't think Roger has ever claimed credit for the song actually. If he was claiming to have only used an element of the Parliament track, then added his own lyrics and arrangement, he would have been credited on the original single surely. |
| . 13.05.2020 12:10 |
Lyrics are credited to David Dashev and Jerry Lawson on "The Persuasions" vinyl releases. It was actually the B side of their 7" single "Papa Oom Mow Mow" (abridged to 4:40). link |
| Negative Creep 13.05.2020 13:33 |
It's just odd though - it's not like Roger has got anything out of it not crediting the right people, because he's never claim a credit himself. If he had pretended to have written the lyrics or put a new melody to it, there's no way he wouldn't have given himself a co writing credit. I notice the Persuasions came out on Elektra, Queen's US label. |
| Negative Creep 13.05.2020 13:33 |
Double post. |
| anderssteen 13.05.2020 14:08 |
Negative Creep you're absolutely right, there's much more to Rogers version than just a note-for-note re-recording. I guess I got a little carried away there. Cheers! |
| anderssteen 13.05.2020 14:15 |
The Kurgan yes the credits on the single is The Persuasions lead singer and their producer. So nothing pointing back to The Parliaments. Negative Creep it is odd. Good spotted with the Elektra label, but if anything I would think that them being on the same label would make it obvious to get the credit right (though perhaps it might have been quite the opposite..?) |
| GoodTimesAreNow 13.05.2020 18:20 |
The Lot says it’s a Parliament cover. And according to the single label Roger dit claim a part of the credits |
| GoodTimesAreNow 13.05.2020 18:56 |
A man named Daron Taylor co-wrote Testify with George Clinton, not Roger Taylor. So, the conclusion is that Clinton/Taylor received the royalties and not the two composers of Woman an Drinkin’. I wonder if Roger ever new about this... Btw. I think it’s a great but also shocking find! I feel fooled for over 40 years |
| Sebastian 13.05.2020 19:45 |
This is what Roger told the BBC in 1977: 'We came back from America, and there's a sort of slack period, and I was a bit sort of bored, I had nothing to do, and I just went into the studio with our engineer Mike Stone and did an old song by The Parliaments. I've got an a cappella version, I just sort of heavied it up a bit and did it all by myself, just really as an experiment.' I wonder if by 'I've got an a cappella version' he meant he also owned the other record (the one you mentioned) besides the original Parliaments one. If so, it all adds up. |
| ggo1 13.05.2020 20:45 |
Good catch, but I would suggest the credits on the label are basically correct. There's a very strong argument that the credits on the Persuasions version are just plain wrong, after all it doesn't credit the writers of I Wanna testify at all, despite using that songs same basic tune and lyrics. Admittedly with a radical re-arrangement. I feel pretty sure that if the Persuasions version had been a big hit there would have been a court case from The Parliaments. Having said that, It's possible if Rogers version was a big hit, The Persuasions would be arguing for a writing credit too. Either way, Roger never claimed he wrote it. |
| . 13.05.2020 21:55 |
Roger lifts virtually the entire lyrics from The Persuasions arrangement, so I would credit them in that respect. Quite unusual that he based his arrangement on somebody else's arrangement! The fact that the original song was written by another "Taylor" is just a confusing coincidence, but it's all a great story. I need to now seek out that abridged version by The Persuasions. |
| Saint Jiub 14.05.2020 01:13 |
Years ago I heard Women and Drinkin' during lunch at local greek themed fast food restaurant called Munchie P's. The owner has a large music collection going back to the '40s, and this restaurant played an eclectic mix of songs. It might have been The Persuation's' version, but I don't remember. Another time at Munchie P's I heard an old version of It's Only Make Believe (1959 Conway Twitty song covered by Brian May). |
| anderssteen 14.05.2020 07:34 |
Sebastian, that sounds very plausible. If Roger just came back from the states he could have picked the single or album up over there. ggo1, I also wondered if there could have been a claim from The Parliaments to get credits from The Persuasions "re-make", but as far as I can tell from a blurry picture on discogs of a CD-reissue, the song was still only credited to The Persuasions in 1990. Otherwise it could have explained Rogers crediting. |
| louis.007 14.05.2020 11:08 |
There's also this version by Johnny Taylor to consider as well: link |
| louis.007 14.05.2020 11:18 |
There's also this version by Johnny Taylor to consider as well: link |
| . 14.05.2020 12:36 |
louis.007 wrote: There's also this version by Johnny Taylor to consider as well: linkSurely the last surname coincidence! |
| Daniel Nester 19.05.2020 23:50 |
What a great discovery -- I always thought the cover of 'Testify' took liberties -- turns out there's a whole other song in the mix! |
| The Real Wizard 20.05.2020 01:22 |
Daniel - nice to see you again ! But an FYI, this is pretty well the only fruitful non-troll affected thread on this forum in quite some time. The majority of this forum's members had a mass exodus to queenforum.net about six weeks ago. |
| brENsKi 20.05.2020 07:38 |
Daniel Nester wrote:What a great discovery -- I always thought the cover of 'Testify' took liberties -- turns out there's a whole other song in the mix! The Real Wizard wrote:Daniel - nice to see you again ! But an FYI, this is pretty well the only fruitful non-troll affected thread on this forum in quite some time. The majority of this forum's members had a mass exodus to queenforum.net about six weeks ago.yes. where this particular song has been very nicely dissected |
| brENsKi 20.05.2020 07:43 |
anderssteen wrote: The Kurgan yes the credits on the single is The Persuasions lead singer and their producer. So nothing pointing back to The Parliaments. Negative Creep it is odd. Good spotted with the Elektra label, but if anything I would think that them being on the same label would make it obvious to get the credit right (though perhaps it might have been quite the opposite..?)well, there (kind of) is. The Persuasions version uses the Parliaments' chorus lyrics. |
| . 21.05.2020 13:01 |
I have managed to source a UK supplier for the US 7" and album releases, if anyone wants info PM me. FYI the US (promo) 7" vinyl is a double A side, it's only the general 7" release that has the Women and Drinkin' (abridged) B side. |
| . 13.07.2020 13:02 |
I received a very nice vinyl copy of the album in the post this morning, and have given it a spin. I'm delighted with it, so thanks again anderssteen for bringing it to my attention. |
| . 10.08.2020 09:58 |
Just for fun I created my own abridged version from my vinyl copy of the LP: |
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