| mooghead 29.11.2019 20:08 |
I know there a bunch of Queen fans here who thinks they can't do wrong but bearing in mind they were the biggest band in the world at the time then brought out this mess... This guy nails it link |
| stevelondon20 29.11.2019 20:46 |
Sorry Rob. I love Hot Space! |
| kosimodo 29.11.2019 21:54 |
Hot Space.. still inspiring the world.. link |
| brENsKi 29.11.2019 22:34 |
IMO - people who genuinely love HS must have multiple auditory disorders. why? (along with Works) - the drum and syn drum sound is terrible the overall production is too tinny and compressed to f*ck. but each to their own. |
| stevelondon20 29.11.2019 23:16 |
brENsKi wrote: IMO - people who genuinely love HS must have multiple auditory disorders. why? (along with Works) - the drum and syn drum sound is terrible the overall production is too tinny and compressed to f*ck. but each to their own.I love it. |
| stevelondon20 29.11.2019 23:17 |
kosimodo wrote: Hot Space.. still inspiring the world.. linkGood go at it! |
| Bob Harley 30.11.2019 00:25 |
Hot Space is one of my favourites Queen albums. Don't kill me |
| master marathon runner 30.11.2019 07:31 |
Yes, love Hot Space ! |
| dysan 30.11.2019 08:17 |
Another vote for Hot Space here. It's fucking lazy and blinkered to write it off. |
| stevelondon20 30.11.2019 08:36 |
Great that the album is getting a lot of love! |
| dysan 30.11.2019 08:39 |
What did the guy say? The video loaded and I saw him and heard one word and them punched my laptop across the room. |
| dysan 30.11.2019 08:40 |
The list of bands given tells me the guy need to get out a bit more. |
| Dim 30.11.2019 11:21 |
brENsKi I think you are wrong about the studio production. It was a pionner production done by Mack, he also refers this album as his favorite productions. If the writing was great and the album had success, the discussion about the sound would be very different. The problem with Hot Space is the music not the production. |
| brENsKi 30.11.2019 11:31 |
Dim wrote:brENsKi I think you are wrong about the studio production. It was a pionner production done by Mack, he also refers this album as his favorite productions. If the writing was great and the album had success, the discussion about the sound would be very different. The problem with Hot Space is the music not the production.as i said, each to their own - and that includes personal views on production. Personally, I think the songs are pretty lazy, but even lazy songs can sound "better". The production for both HS and Works (to my ears) is compressed and tinny. I'm not (for one minute) saying better production would make these into great albums - it simply wouldn't. I'm saying that the production - and the over-use of synths just compounds the disappointment. Too many tracks use something "fake" - completely obliterating the classic queen sound. "Staying Power" - drum machine "Dancer" - synthesizer (Oberheim OB-Xa) "Backchat" - synthesiser "Body Language" - bass synth "Action" - drum machine and bass synth "Life Is Real" - synthesizer "Las Palabras" - synthesizer "Cool Cat" - synthesizer, drum machine "Under Pressure" - synthesizer |
| Holly2003 30.11.2019 11:32 |
When Queen dabbled with funk/soul/disco on Jazz (i.e.Fun It) it sounded good; it also sounded like Queen. Hardly anything on Hot Space sounds like Queen. |
| brENsKi 30.11.2019 11:55 |
Holly2003 wrote:When Queen dabbled with funk/soul/disco on Jazz (i.e.Fun It) it sounded good; it also sounded like Queen. Hardly anything on Hot Space sounds like Queen.my point exactly. the difference between The Game and Hot Space is like comparing Chateau Lafitte to Liebfraumilch. By HS, the creativity well was running dry and the synths became the toys to occupy/distract a band that was going through a disinterested/lazy phase. Factor in the production and the whole is a "bit of a mess" that dates very badly. |
| stevelondon20 30.11.2019 12:38 |
Disinterested and lazy? You couldn't be any more wrong! |
| brENsKi 30.11.2019 12:53 |
stevelondon20 wrote: Disinterested and lazy? You couldn't be any more wrong!that's your opinion - and you're fully entitled to it. but my own is this: where a synth is used to create a sound for an actual instrument that one of the band members already plays extremely well, then laziness has crept in. Anything that can be programmed eliminates a huge amount of artistic effort = laziness and/or disinterest. out of curiosity, what is your favourite Queen LP? |
| matt z 30.11.2019 19:57 |
I'd cut a couple songs off it, but yeah he's absolutely right about the lame white funk bit. Level 45 and AWB prove that white dudes CAN pump out some borderline funky stuff. But goddamn STAYING POWER as the opener is something I'll never get. It's such a cocaine nightmare of a song. Absolute garbage save for that brass bit arranged by Arif Mardin I'd still keep DANCER BACK CHAT ACTION LAS PALABRAS DE AMOR SONG FOR LENNON and of course COOL CAT but realistically Life is real should've been a charity single or something Under pressure was pretty much "off album" It's not a complete shit album side B is petty good but different |
| The Real Wizard 30.11.2019 20:24 |
stevelondon20 wrote: Disinterested and lazy? You couldn't be any more wrong!Nah, he's not far from the truth. Queen were in the weeds in 82 creatively. Mercury had become a completely different person and was becoming more difficult to work with. He wasn't even showing up to mixing sessions for his own songs anymore. The other three guys learned from this and ponied up with great songs on the next two albums. Most of the hits were theirs, not his. Mercury may have still been a great collaborator, but he was no longer the driving force. You could've replaced whichever song with Soul Brother and shifted around the track listing, but there was no way Hot Space was going to be good considering the inner turmoil the band were in. But points to them for hiding it well, and still putting on great shows on the ensuing tour. |
| Dim 30.11.2019 20:54 |
Freddie song writing between 1982-86 was sometimes very clever while other occasions was below standard. However he was still great on orchestrations. Hot Space Era was a lost opportunity for all the band, they had Freddie in his best 80s voice, but none of them brought a great song. |
| stevelondon20 01.12.2019 00:49 |
brENsKi wrote:Innuendo mate.stevelondon20 wrote: Disinterested and lazy? You couldn't be any more wrong!that's your opinion - and you're fully entitled to it. but my own is this: where a synth is used to create a sound for an actual instrument that one of the band members already plays extremely well, then laziness has crept in. Anything that can be programmed eliminates a huge amount of artistic effort = laziness and/or disinterest. out of curiosity, what is your favourite Queen LP? |
| stevelondon20 01.12.2019 00:52 |
The Real Wizard wrote:I respect your opinion mate. I just smile every time I hear Hot Space. I love the vibe of it!stevelondon20 wrote: Disinterested and lazy? You couldn't be any more wrong!Nah, he's not far from the truth. Queen were in the weeds in 82 creatively. Mercury had become a completely different person and was becoming more difficult to work with. He wasn't even showing up to mixing sessions for his own songs anymore. The other three guys learned from this and ponied up with great songs on the next two albums. Most of the hits were theirs, not his. Mercury may have still been a great collaborator, but he was no longer the driving force. You could've replaced whichever song with Soul Brother and shifted around the track listing, but there was no way Hot Space was going to be good considering the inner turmoil the band were in. But points to them for hiding it well, and still putting on great shows on the ensuing tour. |
| kevin79 01.12.2019 01:16 |
I don't think it's a bad album. Maybe not my top Queen album; but not my least favorite either. I will say that after hearing "Staying Power" and "Back Chat" on the Live at the Bowl album, I wonder what "Hot Space" would have been like had they added some rock elements to the studio versions of the club type songs. |
| GreatKingFairyFeller 01.12.2019 02:12 |
Here’s how I see it Staying power- Ok tune, sounded better live. 6/10 Dancer- Really catchy tune. Kind of like it. 7.5/10 Back Chat- Love this song. 9.5/10 Body Language- Worst song of the album. 4/10 Action this day- Pretty good song that was great live. 8/10 Put out the fire- Great song. 9/10 Life is Real- I actually really like it. 9/10 Calling all Girls- Pretty catchy, awful video. 7/10 Las Palabras De Amor- Amazing Song. 9.5/10 Cool Cat- Ok song 6.5/10 In conclusion it’s a good album, but is overshadowed by the other greater albums. I don’t hate it, but don’t love it as much as other better Queen albums. |
| Holly2003 01.12.2019 09:16 |
Glad to see a bit of love for Back Chat. For me, that's a successful example of what they were trying to achieve. In particular, Brian's guitar solo is perfect and totally fits the song. Sadly, most of the other songs don't match up. |
| brENsKi 01.12.2019 10:10 |
kevin79 wrote:I don't think it's a bad album. Maybe not my top Queen album; but not my least favorite either. I will say that after hearing "Staying Power" and "Back Chat" on the Live at the Bowl album, I wonder what "Hot Space" would have been like had they added some rock elements to the studio versions of the club type songs.Well, in my forty-five years as a Queen fan, Hot Space is the only LP I can ever remember Freddie apologising for. And I was there when he did it: [color=purple]June 5th: 1982 "Now most of you know we've got, uh, some new sounds out in the last week, and uh. For what it's worth we're gonna do a few songs in the funk, black category - whatever you call it. That doesn't mean we've lost our rock 'n' roll feel - okay? I mean - it's only a bloody record. People get so excited about these things. We just want to try those new things. This is Staying Power"[/color] and that ^ is an apology. If there was no apology needed, then don't even say it, just say "this next track is off our new album it's called...Staying Power" - and leave it at that |
| Dim 01.12.2019 13:34 |
I think this type of thing explanation by Freddie was done for changing music style, not for bad written music. Heavy metal, hard rock and post punk were the trends, funk, disco had become uncool. QUEEN were considered Rock band, even if they never was. |
| brENsKi 01.12.2019 13:48 |
Dim wrote: I think this type of thing explanation by Freddie was done for changing music style, not for bad written music. Heavy metal, hard rock and post punk were the trends, funk, disco had become uncool. QUEEN were considered Rock band, even if they never was.ordinarily, I'd agree with you, but: purple that's an apologetic counter to the reception the new album had been receiving. I was there at MK. Even though they attempted to "rock them (Staying Power, Backchat and Action) up a little - live" - they were still the low points of the gig for myself and my friends that day. Hot Space - regardless of music style (remember the Game had already ventured here - and done an excellent "crossover" job, to boot) was NOT up to the high standards of previous Queen output. |
| Dim 01.12.2019 15:50 |
I agree with you, Hot Space didn't match the music standards of Queen and even the rockier version of its songs didn't match them either. |
| master marathon runner 01.12.2019 16:44 |
Don't remember him apologising in Edinburgh a few days before. |
| brENsKi 01.12.2019 17:21 |
master marathon runner wrote: Don't remember him apologising in Edinburgh a few days before.well with HS dropping out of the top ten - perhaps they felt compelled to say something? date........position may 15...4 may 22...8 may 29...10 june 5.....18 not exactly the kind of chart placings big bands expected for their albums - back in those days. 3 weeks in the top 10? the next LP the Works spent 25 weeks in the top 10. |
| cobohall 01.12.2019 17:24 |
There are some solid songs on Hot Space, but I don't think I'd give any of them Higher than a 7 or 8 out of 10. Under Pressure being the exception. In my alternate universe the tracks run like this: Side 1: I Go Crazy Action This Day Put Out The Fire Back Chat Life Is Real Side 2: Calling All Girls Las Palabras De Amor Cool Cat Soul Brother Under Pressure This is how I've set it up on my computer. I like the way it flows. How could they release Body Language as a single? |
| matt z 01.12.2019 18:44 |
^i love that track list because it recognizes which songs are the weakest or boring. I think I'd dare shift up under pressure to the first half but hey it's nit picking I love the first 20 seconds of TEAR IT UP (powerful stuff!) but it really goes nowhere. For one of Brian's raunchy rockers, it's light on energy. PUT OUT THE FIRE has a great breakdown. Maybe they could've condensed both into a song ;) So the album had one good rocker...on the subject of I GO CRAZY...are we yet sure this emerged during these sessions with Bowie or shortly thereafter? It's one of their best "unsung" tracks |
| The Fairy King 01.12.2019 20:19 |
The first 3 tracks are the highlight of the album for me. I can't get over some of the cringy lyrics on the album, especially Life is Real, which is the weakest the track on the album + Put Out The Fire. Love the rest. |
| MyHumanZoo 01.12.2019 20:23 |
I agree Matt...I Go Crazy is one of my favorite songs, it should have been it’s own A side or at least on an album. As far as Hot Space goes, Staying Power is about the only song I can tolerate from that album. I force myself to listen to it on occasion out of allegiance and to see if perhaps more age has changed my opinion....hasn’t happened yet. |
| Thistle 01.12.2019 21:41 |
"Doesn't sound like Queen"? What sounds like Queen? It was (kinda) of its time. They experimented with something new, and there's a few really good tunes on there. Production ain't the best, but it's still an enjoyable, fun album IMO. Not that I'm comparing the albums (or their success) but a lot of people didn't like Sgt. Pepper because it strayed from the traditional sound The Beatles were known for. It was sacrilege to some die-hard fans, and too far out and weird for others. For me, the principle is the same, even if the outcome wasn't. HS may not be to everyone's taste, but it's good to see it get some love on this forum :) |
| GreatKingFairyFeller 01.12.2019 21:50 |
To be fair to Queen the album that is considered their worst was a huge influence on the best selling album in the world Thriller, so I can’t ever say it’s a bad album. I think it’s just not good for Queen standards and Queen audience’s. |
| matt z 01.12.2019 22:15 |
Isn't that a late age unsubstantiated Brian May-ism that it influenced THRILLER? |
| brENsKi 01.12.2019 22:20 |
GreatKingFairyFeller wrote:To be fair to Queen the album that is considered their worst was a huge influence on the best selling album in the world Thriller, so I can’t ever say it’s a bad album. I think it’s just not good for Queen standards and Queen audience’s.Not so sure about that. Jackson was already well into the "funk" zone by 1979 with Off The Wall. Thriller is a natural sequel to Off The Wall, in the same way Queen's Races followed Opera. Most of Thriller is a more polished remake of Off the Wall. Dance tunes feel more complete and "in your face". The album has the usual ballads; The Lady in My Life/The Girl Is Mine/Human Nature - to change the tempo. The dancers Baby Be Mine/Billie Jean/PYT/Wanna Be Startin' Something really wouldn't be out of place on Off the Wall. |
| AlbaNo1 01.12.2019 22:45 |
HS is a part disco pastiche by a middle aged white rock band. Cannot imagine this influenced Jackson given funk, disco etc were old at this point. Brian’s solo on Back Chat and Van Halen on Beat It is a similar disco/rock crossover idea though. |
| GreatKingFairyFeller 01.12.2019 23:15 |
link |
| GreatKingFairyFeller 01.12.2019 23:24 |
Keep in mind when Hot Space was released they had only just begun recording sessions for Thriller. Seeing how it has been said Freddie and him were close friends at the time he may have heard some material before Hot Space was released. Songs like Beat It and Baby Be Mine in particular sound a lot like the tracks on Hot Space. Seeing how Queen influenced MJ in many ways it would make sense if this album was a influence. |
| brENsKi 02.12.2019 00:46 |
GreatKingFairyFeller wrote:Keep in mind when Hot Space was released they had only just begun recording sessions for Thriller. Seeing how it has been said Freddie and him were close friends at the time he may have heard some material before Hot Space was released. Songs like Beat It and Baby Be Mine in particular sound a lot like the tracks on Hot Space. Seeing how Queen influenced MJ in many ways it would make sense if this album was a influence.>> Beat It was Quincy Jones dance tribute to My Sharona >> Human Nature was an unfinished song by Toto >> Billie Jean's bass line came from Hall & Oats' "I Can’t Go for That" and wasn't Wanna Be Startin' Something borrowed from an African artist. So all-in-all between Off The Wall and the above, probably not any inspiration from HS at all. |
| GreatKingFairyFeller 02.12.2019 01:18 |
link These are a few songs recorded during the Thriller sessions that I feel show how Hot Space influenced the energy into making Thriller. Though most of the songs on the album don’t sound very similar, Hot Space influenced MJ to make the album be a funk disco album with a bit of rock. Though I think songs like Back Chat are similar to Beat it (even if it was a dance tribute to My Sharona) I feel that Hot Space was more of a basis of what he wanted the album to be genre wise. |
| matt z 02.12.2019 03:20 |
brENsKi wrote:Human Nature being written by Steve Porcaro (TOTO) , PYT by James Ingram (prob based only on the song title because that undated MJJ demo is a slow ballad and in virtually no way associated with the PYT known)GreatKingFairyFeller wrote:To be fair to Queen the album that is considered their worst was a huge influence on the best selling album in the world Thriller, so I can’t ever say it’s a bad album. I think it’s just not good for Queen standards and Queen audience’s.Not so sure about that. Jackson was already well into the "funk" zone by 1979 with Off The Wall. Thriller is a natural sequel to Off The Wall, in the same way Queen's Races followed Opera. Most of Thriller is a more polished remake of Off the Wall. Dance tunes feel more complete and "in your face". The album has the usual ballads; The Lady in My Life/The Girl Is Mine/Human Nature - to change the tempo. The dancers Baby Be Mine/Billie Jean/PYT/Wanna Be Startin' Something really wouldn't be out of place on Off the Wall. wanna be starting something demo is supposedly from 1978.... so damn near all of this claim falls apart. BILLIE JEAN was based almost directly (*down to the strings being a replacement for the keys) on HALL & OATES "I can't go for that". So yeah. It's just revisionist talk from Brian trying to create a positive vibe to the album....although it's possible MJJ cared about them "taking a risk" and "crossing lines". BEAT IT originated as a vocal demo by Michael (by himself : go look it up it's all there) Bringing in a guest guitarist yo pad it out was intentional to sell the album across demographics. But production wise, i can't help but think that the album direction was more influenced by EWF, KOOL & THE GANG and TOTO's polished stuff that they'd done since backing up BOZ SCAGGS STEELY DAN and QUINCY himself. The comparison is absurd. Queen had ZERO rhythm on that album (Hot Space) and everything on it never influenced anything else. The closest they came to something new were BACK CHAT and COOL CAT. the rest was contrapuntal mess on STAYING POWER (that screech twang guitar intended to inspire off kilter stuff when SPACE is the biggest element of funk) And on the wannabe POGO-ING dance craze ACTION THIS DAY riffing. They didn't invent shit in terms of sounds. And if you don't know any of the group's listed above or even Roy Ayers or George Duke then you're pretty limited in your rationale that hot space "brought FUNK (*arguably an invention from Sly Stone/James Brown/George Clinton&Parliament - TWO DECADES PRIOR! ) to the white masses is beyond absurd. Go listen to some stuff from the 70's. It was pretty deep. |
| matt z 02.12.2019 03:46 |
link Link to one "outed" vocal demo from MJJ: BEAT IT *(in case you've lived under a rock and never heard it before) |
| The Real Wizard 02.12.2019 17:47 |
GreatKingFairyFeller wrote: Action this day- Pretty good song that was great live. 8/10 Put out the fire- Great song. 9/10 Life is Real- I actually really like it. 9/10 Calling all Girls- Pretty catchy, awful video. 7/10If this is how highly people are rating these half baked songs, then everything from the first six albums should be a 10/10 or higher. |
| The Real Wizard 02.12.2019 17:48 |
master marathon runner wrote: Don't remember him apologising in Edinburgh a few days before.Did you ever manage to dig up those photos you took that night ? |
| master marathon runner 03.12.2019 12:37 |
/\ Bob - how come ' server error' comes up when I try to pm you?? Shall I try e - mailing to your site ? |
| ggo1 03.12.2019 13:42 |
There's an opportunity for someone to take the HS tapes and rework a number of tracks into decent rock/pop songs. The Love Kills ballad shows they have the capability to fundamentally change the sound and style of a track. Not sure it would be worth the effort though. It's neither a good pop/rock album and its very lacking as a dance/funk album. There are two tracks on The Game, Dragon attack and AOBTD that would sit well on HS in terms of style, but they would be the best tracks on the album and that shows, for me, that it's not just the style of music that's wrong with the album but the songs themselves just aren't up to standard. The whole album is filler. My least favourite Queen album by some distance. (Every track on there is better than Man On the Prowl though) HS isn't terrible, and fair play if you like it, there are definitely worse albums out there by other artists but for me, the songs just aren't that good. |
| dysan 03.12.2019 14:21 |
I like it very much. It's very much its own 'thing'. I don't care if people think that makes me a lesser person than them. But please, no 'updating' of the album plz |
| The Real Wizard 03.12.2019 17:57 |
master marathon runner wrote: /\ Bob - how come ' server error' comes up when I try to pm you?? Shall I try e - mailing to your site ?Because this forum has countless basic functionality issues that'll likely never be addressed. bob@queenlive.ca Thanks ! |
| *goodco* 05.12.2019 04:14 |
The Real Wizard wrote:I'd actually rate CAG 8.5. Having suffered through side one, well...GreatKingFairyFeller wrote: Action this day- Pretty good song that was great live. 8/10 Put out the fire- Great song. 9/10 Life is Real- I actually really like it. 9/10 Calling all Girls- Pretty catchy, awful video. 7/10If this is how highly people are rating these half baked songs, then everything from the first six albums should be a 10/10 or higher. and, yes, everything on the first six albums (other than the song SHA) are 10/10's and higher;-) |
| dysan 05.12.2019 07:49 |
The video for CAG is fucking awesome |
| Dim 05.12.2019 11:57 |
I agree with *goodco* average songwriting by talented songwriters. Staying power great riff, average song better live Dancer Freddie vocals and guitar solo are the only good thing in this song Back chat this could have been a Thriller song Body language no comment..... The main riff is from a disco song called searching link Action this day awfully bad, live is average Put out the fire average rock song, only the solo counts. Life is real a good example how good was Freddie as composer, he used the characteristics Lennon keys to paid a tribute, but is just a good song nothing more. Calling all girls boring, below average Las pallabras de amore, average even back then it was outdated, Freddie vocals make audible Cool cat great bass playing, rhythm guitar and vocals. Even that things can't save this average song Under pressure despite it is a rough mix, is one a best Queen songs, it can't save the album. The only good thing with Hot Space is that has a flow and ofcourse Mack production which didn't save the average songwriting. |
| Vocal harmony 05.12.2019 12:48 |
When they recorded Fun It, it sounded like Queen. But by the time of AOBTD and then the disco/funk styles of some of Hot Space it seems to me that Mack's production was more about recording a generic disco sound and style rather than recording a Queen version of it. On previous albums, no matter the style of music, the Queen sound kind of came first and provided the building blocks. I think the problem with Hot Space is that they turned that process around. I'm naming Mack as the culprit but I don't know for sure. It could have been him and another band member or a number of band members or another outside influence. A well trodden path is implying that Michael Jackson was an influence, I'm sure he was but I also think Rick James' music may have driven some influences too. |
| The Real Wizard 10.12.2019 15:56 |
dysan wrote: The video for CAG is fucking awesomeYep, agreed. In fact, I'd say it's my favourite Queen video next to Breakthru. |
| brENsKi 10.12.2019 16:21 |
The Real Wizard wrote:quite a few obvious references in there. also like the masks being an almost Mr Robot "prequel".dysan wrote: The video for CAG is fucking awesomeYep, agreed. In fact, I'd say it's my favourite Queen video next to Breakthru. |