QueenZone discussion #1533306
2010-11-17 QUEEN: Prince's Trust Rock Gala (definitive version)
| Golden Salmon 30.12.2018 18:35 |
   December 30th, 2018 I am ashamed to call myself a Queen fan for the last 20 years, not to mention the fact that I had also researched their “Queen +” ventures to create a pretty comprehensive compilation earlier this year, and then only recently (as in 2 months ago) have I discovered this gem featuring five great performances, by Brian May and Roger Taylor as well as a number of top-class guests. Unbelievable! After my initial discovery of Tom Chaplin’s performance with the guys, I looked around for the best quality versions. Ultimately, I found a high bitrate 1080i25 PAL AVC/AC3 file (presumably an unaltered capture of the original broadcast) that was pretty great, if only unpolished as it was. This is what I did with it: AUDIO - 6 glitches patched up: the audio goes out briefly, which made it frustrating to listen to. I successfully filled up these very small gaps with a secondary source. - 0.1 s delay fixed: starting with Brian’s speech (apparently they forgot about Queen playing IAHL live back in the day!), the sound was not in sync with the video anymore. It is all right now. - Normalized audio - AC3 to FLAC, 48 kHz: to preserve the original sound quality. VIDEO - HEVC deinterlaced multipass encode (1080p25 2560 kbits): Using one of the most modern video codecs, and through deinterlacing the original video file, the result is a more pleasing viewing experience which removes moiré artifacts and provides a higher quality progressive playback. On top of that, it’s about 1/5th of the original file size with hardly perceptible quality loss. In addition, I’m throwing in the extras found in the DVD fan source (backstage, rehearsals and alternate camera angles), also converted to HEVC deinterlaced video with unaltered AC3 audio. And for the sake of completeness, I’m providing the restored audio performances as separate FLAC files, as well as the original AVC AC3 source I found - in case you want those too. Last but not least, I’ve silently updated my Unusual Anthology to include the + tracks. Please enjoy! TRACKLIST 01 Queen - These Are The Days Of Our Lives 02 Queen - Last Horizon / Brighton Rock 03 Brian’s speech 04 Queen + Tom Chaplin - It's A Hard Life 05 Queen + Midge Ure - Seven Seas Of Rhye 06 Queen + Tom Chaplin, Tom Jones, Alison Moyet, Paloma Faith & Jamie Cullum - We Will Rock You Extras – backstage, rehearsals, alternate camera angles (IAHL, WWRY) |
| Chief Mouse 30.12.2018 18:44 |
Thanks! Is the result 50 fps? |
| Golden Salmon 30.12.2018 18:56 |
Chief Mouse wrote: Thanks! Is the result 50 fps?Both the original file and the processed HEVC file are 25 FPS :-) Chief, please see if I did something wrong that you can improve! |
| Chopin1995 30.12.2018 20:00 |
Thank you Golden Salmon :) |
| Chief Mouse 30.12.2018 20:36 |
Golden Salmon wrote:Since the source was 1080i 25fps, sa you said, you could have made it into 50 fps, which is what proper deinterlacing is supposed to do. 2 fields make up one frame, on your TV the 2 fields are separated thus it looks like you're viewing a 50 fps video, which essentially you are. In this case, one field of information was thrown away.Chief Mouse wrote: Thanks! Is the result 50 fps?Both the original file and the processed HEVC file are 25 FPS :-) Chief, please see if I did something wrong that you can improve! Just my two cents. Thanks for the upload otherwise! :) |
| Golden Salmon 30.12.2018 21:04 |
Chief Mouse wrote:I'm most certainly wrong and you're right, but the source is originally meant to look like 25 FPS, if that makes any sense.Golden Salmon wrote:Since the source was 1080i 25fps, sa you said, you could have made it into 50 fps, which is what proper deinterlacing is supposed to do. 2 fields make up one frame, on your TV the 2 fields are separated thus it looks like you're viewing a 50 fps video, which essentially you are. In this case, one field of information was thrown away. Just my two cents. Thanks for the upload otherwise! :)Chief Mouse wrote: Thanks! Is the result 50 fps?Both the original file and the processed HEVC file are 25 FPS :-) Chief, please see if I did something wrong that you can improve! Regardless, the original file is in the upload, so can you please take a look at it and see if you can improve its quality? Is there a point to making it 50 FPS if it effectively duplicates frames? |
| Chief Mouse 30.12.2018 21:33 |
Golden Salmon wrote:I checked it out. You are quite right. In fact it doesn't even look interlaced, meaning something is screwed up in the headers or flags.Chief Mouse wrote:I'm most certainly wrong and you're right, but the source is originally meant to look like 25 FPS, if that makes any sense. Regardless, the original file is in the upload, so can you please take a look at it and see if you can improve its quality? Is there a point to making it 50 FPS if it effectively duplicates frames?Golden Salmon wrote:Since the source was 1080i 25fps, sa you said, you could have made it into 50 fps, which is what proper deinterlacing is supposed to do. 2 fields make up one frame, on your TV the 2 fields are separated thus it looks like you're viewing a 50 fps video, which essentially you are. In this case, one field of information was thrown away. Just my two cents. Thanks for the upload otherwise! :)Chief Mouse wrote: Thanks! Is the result 50 fps?Both the original file and the processed HEVC file are 25 FPS :-) Chief, please see if I did something wrong that you can improve! |
| The Real Wizard 31.12.2018 03:11 |
Thanks a lot for this ! I'd always hoped for a better quality version. Without a doubt, this is one of the best things Brian and Roger have done since 1991. It's A Hard Life with a horn section ? Monumental. And it only happened once. |
| FlorianS 31.12.2018 09:48 |
Thank you very much! |
| Golden Salmon 31.12.2018 11:01 |
The Real Wizard wrote: Thanks a lot for this ! I'd always hoped for a better quality version. Without a doubt, this is one of the best things Brian and Roger have done since 1991. It's A Hard Life with a horn section ? Monumental. And it only happened once.Perhaps Chief or somebody else with the know-how can do a better job than me at processing the original file and provide a sharper version. I tested a higher bitrate encoding but maybe I did something wrong because it shows some aliasing (particularly in straight lines such as guitar strings) and the picture generally seems less stable compared to the encode I shared, so everyone is welcome to try and improve it. Meanwhile, it's a file with a good quality/size ratio. At this point I'm not very surprised they forgot / nobody told them that they had played IAHL live before, but still... |
| mric! 31.12.2018 11:04 |
Great job! Thank you! |
| Chief Mouse 31.12.2018 11:11 |
Golden Salmon wrote:I think you misunderstood. This version is the one he hoped for (the better one) ;)The Real Wizard wrote: Thanks a lot for this ! I'd always hoped for a better quality version. Without a doubt, this is one of the best things Brian and Roger have done since 1991. It's A Hard Life with a horn section ? Monumental. And it only happened once.Perhaps Chief or somebody else with the know-how can do a better job than me at processing the original file and provide a sharper version. I tested a higher bitrate encoding but maybe I did something wrong because it shows some aliasing (particularly in straight lines such as guitar strings) and the picture generally seems less stable compared to the encode I shared, so everyone is welcome to try and improve it. Meanwhile, it's a file with a good quality/size ratio. At this point I'm not very surprised they forgot / nobody told them that they had played IAHL live before, but still... |
| Golden Salmon 31.12.2018 11:17 |
Chief Mouse wrote: I think you misunderstood. This version is the one he hoped for (the better one) ;)Nah, I'm only saying that surely it can be polished further than the little processing I did. I just thought it was fine to share everything. |
| brians wig 31.12.2018 11:33 |
Any work that anybody does to improve the quality of something is always appreciated, and for that I thank you. BUT: Can you clear something up please?. You've de-interlaced it. Did it look like interlaced VIDEO to begin with, or had it been broadcast looking like film? If the latter, then what you've done is fine. BUT, if it looked like a live video broadcast and you've changed that look in the deinterlacing process and it now looks like it was shot on film, then that's a massive "NO NO" to me... The only other issue is HEVC. Whilst it's a superb codec and allows you to keep interlaced programmes interlaced with no problems (unlike .264), it's not very user-friendly for the masses. Personally I avoid it like the plague because unless you're playing it back on a computer, it's useless. It's not a supported codec on smart TV's yet and no one makes media players anymore that you can plug a hard drive into like they did 10 years ago. Whilst the Amazon FireTV will support HEVC playback (for example), they'd stupidly not put a USB port into it that accepts a hard drive for playback! |
| pmatsynot 31.12.2018 11:42 |
Thank you, nice find |
| Golden Salmon 31.12.2018 12:05 |
brians wig wrote: Can you clear something up please?. You've de-interlaced it. Did it look like interlaced VIDEO to begin with, or had it been broadcast looking like film? If the latter, then what you've done is fine. BUT, if it looked like a live video broadcast and you've changed that look in the deinterlacing process and it now looks like it was shot on film, then that's a massive "NO NO" to me... The only other issue is HEVC. Whilst it's a superb codec and allows you to keep interlaced programmes interlaced with no problems (unlike .264), it's not very user-friendly for the masses.It does look interlaced (horizontal line artifacts and whatnot) and most importantly MediaInfo reports: Scan type: Interlaced Scan type, store method: Separated fields Scan order: Bottom Field First Which I took into account to process it. It looks nicer now IMO, but there's room for improvement for sure. In any case, feel free to check it yourself and process it as you wish, if you are so inclined. It is apparent that the original file has got a number of tech issues, we should look further into it. Regarding device support, I am aware that HEVC and FLAC are not the most friendly codecs compared to MPEG2/AC3 (ancient) or x.264/PCM (compatible with most devices today), so once again feel free to process the original file to suit your needs. |
| Chief Mouse 31.12.2018 12:13 |
I checked it via VLC, VirtualDub and Avisynth. Didn't appear interlaced to me. At least not in a classic sense. It may have some combing artifacts. Scan type, store method: Separated fields That's interesting, it says the fields are already separated. So it does appear as progressive to the eye. Need to dig deeper into this. Edit: Only the scrolling credits at the end appear to be proper interlaced. The main thing is progressive 25 fps. So that's how it is. |
| earwig 31.12.2018 12:47 |
awesome! thanks! |
| Star* 01.01.2019 10:19 |
Anything Brian & Roger does without Adam Lambert would be a huge improvement in there credibility. They should be moving on making music with some of the biggest names in the music industry before its too late. Stop wasting your energy on a yanky twat. |
| pittrek 01.01.2019 10:24 |
It's so weird to remember Midge Ure from the 80's and then see him in a 2010 video :-) Thanks for this |
| akan 01.01.2019 11:37 |
this has been one of the best things made by Brian and Roger after 1991. Thank you very much, I was looking forward to a recording like this one. |
| Marlamir 01.01.2019 12:16 |
Thank you very much. |
| PROTOCOLMAN 01.01.2019 16:40 |
Thank you so much, once again! It is truly fantastic!!! |
| Golden Salmon 01.01.2019 19:11 |
Chief Mouse wrote: I checked it via VLC, VirtualDub and Avisynth. Didn't appear interlaced to me. At least not in a classic sense. It may have some combing artifacts. Scan type, store method: Separated fields That's interesting, it says the fields are already separated. So it does appear as progressive to the eye. Need to dig deeper into this. Edit: Only the scrolling credits at the end appear to be proper interlaced. The main thing is progressive 25 fps. So that's how it is.Just wondering: how do you explain the fixed moiré effect on the Prince's Trust red & white logos, as well as aliasing gone on high contrast straight lines (e.g. guitar strings)? If that wasn't corrected by deinterlacing the video, what fixed it? I'd swear I saw interlacing artifacts when I played it on VLC in my work computer, but I don't see them at home. I wonder if there's something particularly different in terms of video drivers, playback configuration and whatnot. Also, I tried a higher bitrate encode with the same parameters at 4096 kbits, but the logos flicker and the straight lines shimmer like in the original. Perhaps it's closer to what it should be, but I wonder exactly what's going on. |
| Chief Mouse 01.01.2019 19:31 |
Deinterlacing usually doesn't fix those types of artifacts. I haven't particularly researched about moire but aliasing can easily be fixed via Avisynth. What exactly caused it, I'm not sure. Probably something in between the generations the video went through from the camera to this file. It's rare that I deal with these kind of digital HD broadcast videos. As you may guess, most of my sources are DVD rips :) And sometimes ProRes film scans. By the way, I noticed that the video sometimes briefly glitches out some interlace artifacts during the main feature too (not sure if it does in your encode, I didn't have time to examine it). It's a bit of a mess, this source. |
| AOCQ 01.01.2019 19:36 |
Thanks! |
| QSMJohn 01.01.2019 20:04 |
Big Thanks! |
| tassilo 04.01.2019 16:10 |
Thank you very much. |
| Blackvy 04.01.2019 17:23 |
Thanks a lot! :) |