| Biggest Band On The Planet 13.06.2016 17:56 |
Does anyone know why Mother Love is credited to Brian and Freddie instead of Queen ? All the other songs from that era are credited to Queen. |
| Sebastian 13.06.2016 22:19 |
Perhaps Brian wanted more money on royalties. |
| Cruella de Vil 14.06.2016 02:29 |
Simple, John was on holiday in Bali and Roger was shagging someone. Brian left his clogs at Freddie's place, After droping over to pick them up, they had a cup of tea and a couple of vodkas, then they came up with this great song. |
| dudeofqueen 14.06.2016 03:44 |
Sebastian, re: >Perhaps Brian wanted more money on royalties. That was exactly my thought the day I saw it at the Fan Club launch at Hammy Odeon. Brian clearly spotted the opportunity and decided that as it was going to be lauded as Freddie's parting gift, the very last thing that he worked on and the mileage he could get out of the story of Freddie meaning to sing the final verse but never actually getting to do it. The only financial split would be between Freddie's estate and Brian. |
| Costa86 14.06.2016 07:36 |
Ever the consummate business man. Well, they all were really, and still are. Good for them though. |
| Cruella de Vil 14.06.2016 09:30 |
Seriously do you really think that Brian was that opportunistic? It's not like they hadn't co-written a song before. It really probably was just a matter of circumstance. |
| Rick 14.06.2016 10:04 |
CruellaDeVille wrote: Seriously do you really think that Brian was that opportunistic? It's not like they hadn't co-written a song before. It really probably was just a matter of circumstance.I'm 99% sure that Brian's ego is the reason John doesn't want to be involved with Queen anymore. |
| brENsKi 14.06.2016 10:38 |
i think Brian's attitude about song-writing credit sice FM's passing has been nothing short of attrocious. what a self-important, grandstanding and utterly unlikeable man he's become -seizing every possibility to redress the imbalance between him and the other three as main "hits" songwriter. this is NOT the first time he's tried to re-write the song-writing credits - i doubt the notion is ever very far from his mind? he can't do anything about the pre-"queen co-credits" - up to that point he was the officially FOURTH least successful writer with regard to actual chart hits - perhaps, therein lies the nub of the problem. doesn't matter what he does - he can't change things -despite his shameful efforts. |
| Sebastian 14.06.2016 11:33 |
I think GVHII credited him as the sole author of 'I Want It All'. Which on the one hand is absolutely fine because ... well, he was! But on the other hand, it sort of violates their rule. But if Roger, John('s lawyers) and Freddie('s estate...'s lawyers) were alright with that, then that's it. All I can offer is my comment as a customer ... it would've been nice if they'd also reversed the rule for the rest of the tracks and credited 'Invisible Man' to Roger, 'The Miracle' to Fred and so on. |
| Vocal harmony 14.06.2016 11:57 |
Could the guitar line (or any other part of the music) for Mother Love have already been written and maybe even excisted on tape in some guise many years before those final sessions with Freddie? |
| Sebastian 14.06.2016 12:53 |
Well, there's nothing to confirm or deny that ... same for the lyrics. But the 'rule', as they described it, was that 'everything' would be credited to 'everyone' regardless of the individual circumstances. At the end of the day, it doesn't matter too much IMO, since it's their decision and it's their song anyway. |
| mooghead 14.06.2016 13:04 |
I think it was another case of Brian over compensating for his incredibly tiny penis. |
| andres_clip 14.06.2016 14:17 |
Anyways since Freddies passing, you can clearly see who's missing in everything Queen does. So I can go for that Brian ego thing and even royaltys the reason for credit to Mother Love |
| Supersonic_Man89 15.06.2016 05:27 |
I don't know why nobody has suggested that it could have been Roger and John who pushed this forward and insisted on Brian/Freddie taking credit for it. Just a thought. |
| dudeofqueen 15.06.2016 05:49 |
mooghead, re: >I think it was another case of Brian over compensating for his incredibly tiny penis. This. Would love to hear some kiss-and-tell stories about Brian's groupie antics; there's a book there, surely. |
| Holly2003 15.06.2016 07:09 |
andres_clip wrote: Anyways since Freddies passing, you can clearly see who's missing in everything Queen does. So I can go for that Brian ego thing and even royaltys the reason for credit to Mother LoveAnd yet in Mr Bad Guy, you can also clearly see what and who is missing |
| Sebastian 15.06.2016 08:02 |
Supersonic_Man89 wrote: I don't know why nobody has suggested that it could have been Roger and John who pushed this forward and insisted on Brian/Freddie taking credit for it. Just a thought.Sure, John and Roger said, 'hey, we don't want to make money out of this beautiful song, so we'll withdraw from it.' Sure, that's a realistic possibility. Of course! |
| dudeofqueen 15.06.2016 09:40 |
Holly2003, re: >And yet in Mr Bad Guy, the Cross, and all other non-Fred solo efforts Did you mean "non-Brian"? If so I'd argue against The Cross featuring in that list; having Brian around would only have confused matters and personally, I think The Cross (excepting the AWFUL "Shove It") were STRONGER for the lack of any Queen 'trademarks' in terms of sound and production. Mr Bad Guy is musically horrendous and would have really benefitted from Brian's prolonged input as evidenced on "She Blows Hot And Cold" whose guitar solo is absolutely rip-roaringly brilliant. |
| Biggest Band On The Planet 15.06.2016 12:35 |
Sebastian wrote: Perhaps Brian wanted more money on royalties.I don't think royalites would have came into it seeing as Mother Love was never released as a single. |
| Holly2003 15.06.2016 13:26 |
dudeofqueen wrote: Holly2003, re: >And yet in Mr Bad Guy, you can clearly see who and what is missing. Did you mean "non-Brian"? .No ;) |
| Sebastian 15.06.2016 13:52 |
Biggest Band On The Planet wrote: I don't think royalites would have came into it seeing as Mother Love was never released as a single.First of all, he'd still receive royalties for the song's inclusion on the album. Second of all, at the time they decided on the credits, they probably still didn't know which were gonna be the singles. |
| andres_clip 15.06.2016 15:15 |
Holly2003 wrote:As a commercial hit it didn't work but music and lyrics works for me.andres_clip wrote: Anyways since Freddies passing, you can clearly see who's missing in everything Queen does. So I can go for that Brian ego thing and even royaltys the reason for credit to Mother LoveAnd yet in Mr Bad Guy, you can also clearly see what and who is missing |
| AlbaNo1 15.06.2016 15:22 |
By most accounts Brian drove the completion of the album and is responsible for the way it sounds. Brian May is by a huge distance the second most important member of Queen. The hits of the other two don't have greater musical or emotional quality than Brian's songs. Radio gaga or White Queen? I know which I prefer. Brian and Freddie wrote Mother Love. Brian shaped it. The others did not. And probably could not. Joint credits were used for two albums when all four were alive and creating. Why should same rules apply for a posthumous project. |
| Saint Jiub 15.06.2016 16:25 |
Roger and John started Made in Heaven without Brian, and then Brian unceremoneously dumped what John and Roger had already worked on. link "Nothing was heard from the final post- Innuendo sessions until the autumn of 1995, though the band had been working on the songs as far back as the summer of 1993, when Roger and John started working on the material, adding new drums and bass to old songs. Brian was annoyed. "Roger and John became very impatient with me and started working on the tapes. I didn't want this stuff to go out without my involvement, so I took the tapes off them, felt that they'd done it wrong and spent months putting it all back together. Doing Made In Heaven was like assembling a jigsaw puzzle. But I wouldn't have put my seal of approval on it if I hadn't thought it was up to standard." |
| AlbaNo1 15.06.2016 16:32 |
Panchgani wrote: I thought Roger and John started Made in Heaven without Brian, and then Brian unceremoneously dumped what John and Roger had already worked on?That's one way of putting it |
| matt z 15.06.2016 16:57 |
...u never know though. Unceremoniously? Perhaps there was a ceremony. A screaming one. Hence the latter instances where the fan messages were done B+J and R+J separately |
| Saint Jiub 15.06.2016 19:15 |
Yep it was a big sourie, complete with roast badger |
| The Real Wizard 15.06.2016 22:48 |
Rick wrote:Focus on that remaining 1%.CruellaDeVille wrote: Seriously do you really think that Brian was that opportunistic? It's not like they hadn't co-written a song before. It really probably was just a matter of circumstance.I'm 99% sure that Brian's ego is the reason John doesn't want to be involved with Queen anymore. Deacon was already done with the music business in the 80s. For all we know it could've been amicable. Not every documentary is going to be like the Eagles one where everyone unearths their dirty laundry (pardon the pun). This is one of those "what happens in the band stays in the band" things. |
| The Real Wizard 15.06.2016 22:53 |
Supersonic_Man89 wrote: I don't know why nobody has suggested that it could have been Roger and John who pushed this forward and insisted on Brian/Freddie taking credit for it. Just a thought.But then Queenzone wouldn't be Queenzone, and people wouldn't be able to slag off one of the most respected people in the music business with impunity. It's fair to assume that 99% of people on this site have never met Brian or worked with him, yet they are the ones who are doing the character judgements here without access to all of the available information. Oh well. It is what it is. Carry on... |
| The Real Wizard 15.06.2016 23:02 |
dudeofqueen wrote: Mr Bad Guy is musically horrendous and would have really benefitted from Brian's prolonged input as evidenced on "She Blows Hot And Cold" whose guitar solo is absolutely rip-roaringly brilliant.Yup, but even that couldn't rescue that god-awful song. |
| The Real Wizard 15.06.2016 23:06 |
dudeofqueen wrote: Would love to hear some kiss-and-tell stories about Brian's groupie antics; there's a book there, surely.It's called his music ! Listen carefully - it's all there. |
| The Real Wizard 15.06.2016 23:08 |
Holly2003 wrote:Ding.andres_clip wrote: Anyways since Freddies passing, you can clearly see who's missing in everything Queen does. So I can go for that Brian ego thing and even royaltys the reason for credit to Mother LoveAnd yet in Mr Bad Guy, you can also clearly see what and who is missing Like most collectives, the whole is greater than the sum of the parts. They had their moments solo, but nothing they created separately remotely compares with their 1974-76 work. |
| Sebastian 16.06.2016 03:12 |
The Real Wizard wrote: But then Queenzone wouldn't be Queenzone, and people wouldn't be able to slag off one of the most respected people in the music business with impunity. It's fair to assume that 99% of people on this site have never met Brian or worked with him, yet they are the ones who are doing the character judgements here without access to all of the available information. Oh well. It is what it is. Carry on...It's not like people are asking for death penalty for Brian or anything ... there's no need to get so touchy. He's a public person, and his decisions will be debated and questioned, whether it's cheating on his wife, touring with an American Idol loser or reversing the 'four-way-split' credits agreement. At the end of the day, it was his and Freddie's song and I very much doubt he put a gun on John's and Roger's head to agree to it so, whatever they decided on the matter is up to them. The larger point, however, is that Queen fans are by and large pretty harmless. Worst we can do is inadvertently offending some hardcore Brian fan by daring claiming he wasn't the Messiah, but that's it. He hasn't, to the best of my knowledge (yeah, I'm part of the 99% of people who's never met him, but that doesn't invalidate my right to comment here), received death threats or been attacked by people for the choices he's made. Wanna see who's had at least one really nasty fan? Ask John Lennon, Dimebag, Selena Quintanilla or, recently, the late great Christina Grimmie. The whole concept of theorising is so often slammed that even the word 'speculation' is filled with negative connotations, as if it automatically meant 'not having the slightest fucking idea of what you're talking about.' Of course, there are plenty of lazy-arse hypotheses or excessively deep deductions inaccurately extrapolated and interpreted with a fair share of flawed logic (e.g. assuming 'Was It All Worth It' was Brian's song because it had a lot of guitar, or assuming 'Don't Try So Hard' had to be John's song because the other 11 pieces allegedly couldn't be his and, allegedly, he had to have penned at least one track on each album since 1974). I myself have been a culprit for coming up with incorrect conclusions from time to time (John singing, 'Who Wants to Live Forever' not featuring bass, Fred recording 'Mother Love' in October), but that doesn't mean at all that 'speculations' should be outlawed altogether. It's thanks to people who 'speculated' that humanity has progressed so much, in virtually all fields of science, arts, sports, etc. That's gonna have its downside as well, and it's that amongst the countless hypotheses people can come up with, some (or many, or sometimes even all) of them might offend or hurt those who see Brian as a magical mystical Mayestic creature who can do no wrong just because he's a magnificent musician. |
| Vocal harmony 16.06.2016 08:00 |
The Real Wizard wrote: But then Queenzone wouldn't be Queenzone, and people wouldn't be able to slag off one of the most respected people in the music business with impunity. It's fair to assume that 99% of people on this site have never met Brian or worked with him, yet they are the ones who are doing the character judgements here without access to all of the available information. Oh well. It is what it is Carry on...Completely agree with this. But the nature of any fan site is such that people will pass comment on what they believe which is not always the fact of the the matter. 99% of fans of any artist will only know what they have read and some have been lucky enough to have said hello, but spending a minute or two exchanging a polite hello and getting an autograph or photo isn't the same as spending time working with or socializing with someone and finding out more about them as a person. Character assassinations are easy from a distance and even easier via a keyboard |
| Oscar J 16.06.2016 08:25 |
I'm more inclined to agree with Sebastian on this. It won't hurt Brian and it doesn't make me a loser saying that I believe, from what I've seen and heard, that Brian is a very proud man with a big ego. But he's also humble and kind, a great guitarist and have loads of other favourable qualities as well. |
| Sebastian 16.06.2016 08:27 |
Oscar J wrote: I believe, from what I've seen and heard, that Brian is a very proud man with a big ego.Not to mention the fact he's admitted it himself... and, allegedly, he knows himself far better than any of his fans do. So if Brian says he was the most pig-headed member of a band that included Fred and Rog, then there's no reason to believe otherwise IMO. |
| Costa86 16.06.2016 09:28 |
Sebastian wrote: ....touring with an American Idol loser....Nice one (and completely factual so it can't even be rebuked). |
| The Real Wizard 16.06.2016 12:45 |
Sebastian wrote: That's gonna have its downside as well, and it's that amongst the countless hypotheses people can come up with, some (or many, or sometimes even all) of them might offend or hurt those who see Brian as a magical mystical Mayestic creature who can do no wrong just because he's a magnificent musician.Mayestic - ha HAAAA !! Best thing I've read all day. Of course you're right - the dialogue and speculation are a healthy and a necessary part of the whole picture. But it sometimes goes too far when it becomes downright character assassination. |
| Sebastian 16.06.2016 12:58 |
The Real Wizard wrote: But it sometimes goes too far when it becomes downright character assassination.But how far is too far? Who defines that? Saying Brian's got a massive ego (when he's admitted it himself, and he knows himself better than both you and I know him) is not character assassination. |