The Real Wizard 24.08.2015 19:09 |
The bonus EPs of the 2011 Queen remasters offered a few new pieces, but most of the tracks were previously released. The companion discs on the new Zeppelin reissues, on the other hand - 90% of them offer something new. They're different mixes, different takes, or embryonic versions. Furthermore, the Zeppelin reissues have garnered massive interest because Jimmy Page has done a swath of TV and magazine interviews explaining how important this project is. There were several Rolling Stone articles alone, never mind all the other publications. But the Queen reissues barely hit the map. There is also the issue of Queen becoming a hits band by 1980, essentially abandoning their status as an album band. Led Zeppelin, on the other hand, didn't survive past 1980. We didn't get to hear Zeppelin adjust their sound to the whims of the business like everyone else had to. What ifs are usually pointless, but this is an angle that is definitely worthy of discussion. Queen have indeed made some attempts to share their history. The Days Of Our Lives documentary was excellent, as was the Stormtroopers in Stilettoes exhibition. And the Rainbow 74 box set was riveting. But the 2011 reissues were a massive opportunity missed. Had they released a version of Bohemian Rhapsody with one of the alternate lead vocal tracks (as heard on the 24 track master that is now public), there would have been pandemonium in the press on both sides of the Atlantic. But instead it's like studying ancient Egypt and watching someone burn scrolls and papyrus right in front of you. So as someone who is an enthusiast and historian of this band, I just have one simple question: Why? |
The Ghost of Lester Burnham 24.08.2015 19:13 |
They're saving it for the anthologies. (lol) |
matt z 24.08.2015 19:24 |
Took u this long, wizard? I thought everybody was mad (THEN) about it. I simply didn't buy any of the rereleases. I played the alternate DSMN and Dreamer's ball on a jukebox but that's about it. Oh and downloaded the piano FLASH tracks The sad thing about it is. .... that every guy (like me) that didn'tbuy into em, gives further credence to the notion that nobody wants to hear their extras. Which only begs the reasoning all around again. .. nobody bought them all over again BECAUSE of the omissions. Chicken and the egg. |
Day dop 24.08.2015 19:24 |
Aside from any extras, the LZ remasters got a lot of praise on the sound quality. Rightly so. Whereas the 2011 Queen remasters - aside from Queen II - not so much. The Beatles remasters are also highly regarded for that reason. Rainbow 74 is the best thing Queen fans have had in years. |
Apocalipsis_Darko 24.08.2015 19:30 |
The documentary excelent....mmm, the documentary said nothing about the recordings of A Kind Of Magic, so.... |
Day dop 24.08.2015 19:35 |
I'm still holding out a little hope on the 2015 vinyl remasters. Not much hope, but there's some. Sure, they're from a digital source, but so was the 2015 Rolling Stones Sticky fingers LP, and although I've not heard it, word is that the remaster is excellent. |
The Real Wizard 24.08.2015 19:36 |
matt z wrote: The sad thing about it is. .... that every guy (like me) that didn'tbuy into em, gives further credence to the notion that nobody wants to hear their extras. Which only begs the reasoning all around again. .. nobody bought them all over again BECAUSE of the omissions. Chicken and the egg.You may have a point. Even with the tidbits that did come out, there was very little discussion of them. Here were the new studio pieces: Seven Seas Of Rhye - whole new ending Feelings Feelings - different take from the one that leaked about 10 years ago Don't Stop Me Now - guitar version Dreamers Ball - early take Sail Away Sweet Sister - take 1 (amazing listen - you can pinpoint the moment Brian listened back and realized he found the melody for the verse) It's A Beautiful Day - original Football Fight - piano version (this eats the studio version for breakfast) The Kiss - early take A Kind of Vision - early take The Invisible Man - Roger guide vocal Headlong - Brian guide vocal Ride The Wild Wind - Roger guide vocal This amounted to about a half hour of new music. And nothing from SHA/Opera/Races, which to me is criminal. I guess this just hits home after hearing all the wonderful things on the Zeppelin reissues. |
musicland munich 24.08.2015 19:44 |
I think the situation behind the scenes is more complicated ( ego-wise). The Bulsara family and of course John can vetoing things if they want to do it. After MIH the quality of their releases lowerd in my opinion...Queen Rocks, GH3, Greatest FLIX 3 and lots of akward mixes, all that stuff makes me almost run away from that band at that point. But in the end I didn't have a correct or suitable answer to your question...sometimes it's odd |
Bike It 80 24.08.2015 21:14 |
I think the only reason they put bonus tracks on the Queen reissues was to convince the fans to buy Queen's discography all over again (didn't work for me!) And I wasn't too excited about the bonus tracks on the LZ reissues, I don't particularly care about alternate mixes or rough mixes. The live songs on LZ1's bonus disc and the unreleased "La La" on LZ2 were cool, though! |
Bike It 80 24.08.2015 22:37 |
...and I'm starting to think that some of the Queen reissues "bonus tracks" are merely advertising other releases (Live at Wembley, Rock Montreal...) for casual fans who don't already own these. |
Bike It 80 24.08.2015 22:43 |
Maybe the problem is that they tried to target everyone with the bonus tracks : - They tried to target die-hard fans by putting some unreleased tracks; - They tried to target casual fans by putting some "unreleased" tracks (as in "not released on OFFICIAL releases") - And they put not too much unreleased songs to keep an interest for an eventual Anthology. |
Biggus Dickus 24.08.2015 23:11 |
I didn't think the alternative/rough mixes were that exciting on the Zep remasters, but then again I'm not hardcore Zep fan. The audio quality was fantastic though. Queen remasters had some good stuff but it was really daft not to put in all the 12" versions for example. And naturally most people already had those live songs from already released live albums and the single versions of the songs. All the songs could have fitted the one CD versions anyway, so I guess it was just another money making exercise for Queen Productions. |
Day dop 24.08.2015 23:20 |
Bike It 80 wrote: - And they put not too much unreleased songs to keep an interest for an eventual Anthology.What makes you think there'd be an Anthology? |
stevelondon20 25.08.2015 01:01 |
Day dop wrote:We can all live in hope mate.Bike It 80 wrote: - And they put not too much unreleased songs to keep an interest for an eventual Anthology.What makes you think there'd be an Anthology? |
user1 25.08.2015 02:31 |
I guess they were in a rush after they left EMI to Universal. The new Box Set is disappointing, too. So much money to spend and you don't even get download codes for the (disappointing) bonus tracks from 2011. Wtf? Shall we buy everything three or four times? |
tcc 25.08.2015 03:00 |
I think you have to check what else are the Led Zeppelin band members doing besides their music. In the case of the remaining Queen members, they have so many other activities to distract them. In this age of digital downloads, they may feel it not worthwhile spending so much effort on something which can be "stolen" so easily. |
pittrek 25.08.2015 04:23 |
The ONLY reason why I bought the 2011 remasters were the bonus tracks, and I listened to them maybe 2 or 3 times during last 4 years. A wated oportunity |
Holly2003 25.08.2015 04:44 |
Perhaps Page has more musical integrity than Brian & Rog. And that's saying something, given Page's shameless stealing of other people's music! But certainly he has more of a sense of LZ's place in musical history whereas I think Brian & Rog know that Queen are a 2nd tier band compared to LZ, The Beatles, Pink Floyd etc. |
GreatKingSam 25.08.2015 05:05 |
It's nice to find a topic to feel compelled to reply in! (long post, hope it makes sense, I read back and sense-checked!) Something Wizard said that got me thinking, re: Zep never having had to navigate the 80s as Queen did (although cheesy synth had started to creep its way in to some of their stuff anyway)... Queen "ended" during a funny musical period. The immediate period post-Freddie's passing was dedicated to a bit of expected down-time and reflection for the band, and organising the tribute and finishing up Made In Heaven. By that point, they probably wanted a bit of a break. Then, the next few years were the tail end of grunge, Brit pop, the rise of manufactured modern bands, hip-hop and nu-metal, and then just years of mainstream nonsense. It was a difficult time to try and become a refreshed version of a classic rock band, and the Hollywood Records reissues are a testament to that. Add that to the fact EMI was probably a little too into pushing re-issues (yes Bri and Rog - and John - could have vetoed, but if your management are offering money-making schemes that *seem* decent in a shit market, you can hardly say no). It does at least seem, over the last few years, the band are starting to function like a refreshed classic rock band since universal took the helm. Excluding the musical (which despite coming in the previously described 'nonsense' time-frame was at least decent), they've got their house in order. It's a shame it took the 40th anniversary to kick it in to gear, but still. Imagine if post-MIH, they'd gone on tour with a Paul Rodgers-esque figure, perhaps released a Queen-tinged collaborative effort in the mid-late 90s. Had a little down-time, organised a Stormtroopers In Stillettoes style exhibition, followed by a bunch of re-mastered re-issues with a handful of oddities, and then gone on a further tour with a more modern singer, with hints of a potential further collaborative album in the works, and the off new track appearing with vocals from Michael Jackson, and a film about Freddie in the works. For good measure, throw in a couple of solo albums and top documentaries, and Brian's political/animal work. In this scenario, we perhaps don't have a million Greatest Hits re-issues, perhaps we don't quite get the musical (maybe the musical is replaced by the Freddie movie), we probably wont get collaborations with 5ive, maybe it's a pre-crash Robbie Williams instead of Adam Lambert... and we view the studio re-issues with bonus tracks as something superb, rather than feeling a little underwhelmed. All of a sudden, we have all of this going into a 40th anniversary which may have been the time frame to yield the anthology box sets etc. On top of that, whilst I feel the band would still be pals with people like the Foos etc., perhaps being a far more organised active band brings them more opportunities with other members of the 'next generation'. I guess my point is, its just seemed to take the band far too long to get their house in order before starting to get things right. It's just a shame its all come about 10 years later than it should have. When seen from that view though, it does give a better impression of what they've been trying to do since Universal took over, and how it could/would have looked if in the "correct light". Or, in another world, to use an average pun, lolz. |
brians wig 25.08.2015 06:16 |
TBH, I'm a little disappointed at the bonus tracks on the Zep releases. There's an awful lot that sounds little different from what's on the albums to my ears, but then I've not been listening to Zep for 29 years like I have Queen. However, Page has gone on record in saying that there is so much leaked stuff out there from Zep's archives (I'm thinking Studio Magik 18 disc set I believe it is), that he wanted to present fans with something unheard and in that respect he's obviously succeeded. Page, blatantly, CARES about his music and wants the best quality possible out there. He's done all of this work himself. He hasn't passed the buck to someone else and said "get on with it". It also sounds like he's worked from the multitracks as well. "Queen" on the otherhand, didn't. Ludwig worked, I gather, from a stereo flat master meaning he could do little but play with frequencies much like C-Matt has been doing with his revisions (what do you mean you don't know about C-Matt's revisions? Shame on you! Get over to the Fan mix forum NOW!!!!) I'd like to think that Queen didn't adopt this approach with their bonus tracks: "Oh, that one's out there in crappy quality, Let's not bother with that one ever". I think the galling thing with the Queen bonus tracks more than anything is they wasted the BBC sessions and the extended mixes. They should have either put them ALL on the bonus discs or released them all as separate releases, not bitting and batting here and there. So. 2015 now and we're getting the albums yet again on vinyl. What's next? Bluray audio with any luck, but then after that SURELY to God they'll have no choice but to release either a BBC Sessions set, a Remixes set or , dare I say it, an Anthology set... |
Bike It 80 25.08.2015 06:45 |
Day dop wrote:I sincerely doubt this one will ever see the light of day (hell, they've been talking about it for like 20 years) but who knows... should've put more emphasis on the "eventual"!Bike It 80 wrote: - And they put not too much unreleased songs to keep an interest for an eventual Anthology.What makes you think there'd be an Anthology? |
Ghostwithasmile is BACK! 25.08.2015 06:45 |
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Ghostwithasmile is BACK! 25.08.2015 06:45 |
When a band is signed to a record deal they need to spit out products for the record company. Queen owed 1 more prodcut to EMI , this became Abs Greatest. I don't think this was the prefered choiche of the bandmembers, but they had to give EMI 1 more release. It wouldn't be wise at the time to choose for a new album or album with demo material. Now Queen is signed to Uni 2010-2013 and 2013 - 2016 again they need release products. I think the 2011 catalogue with a bonus was a good choiche. If they want to be resigned by Uni they again need to deliver sales. Due to these kind of contracts they for sure won't release all the great stuff they have in one time , but carefully 1 by 1. |
brENsKi 25.08.2015 08:09 |
Holly2003 wrote:Perhaps Page has more musical integrity than Brian & Rog. And that's saying something, given Page's shameless stealing of other people's music! But certainly he has more of a sense of LZ's place in musical history whereas I think Brian & Rog know that Queen are a 2nd tier band compared to LZ, The Beatles, Pink Floyd etc.this^^^ in a nutshell. the essence of the issue look at the boxsets and reissues of some major artists: zeppelin = superior purple = outstanding lizzy - very good rainbow = excellent beatles = superior floyd = stunning bowie = very good ac/dc - excellent queen = dogdirt Brian May should be kicking himself in the arse - huge opportunity missed..almost like their hearts weren't really in it |
Dim 25.08.2015 08:14 |
Ghostwithasmile is BACK! wrote: When a band is signed to a record deal they need to spit out products for the record company. Queen owed 1 more prodcut to EMI , this became Abs Greatest. I don't think this was the prefered choiche of the bandmembers, but they had to give EMI 1 more release. It wouldn't be wise at the time to choose for a new album or album with demo material. Now Queen is signed to Uni 2010-2013 and 2013 - 2016 again they need release products. I think the 2011 catalogue with a bonus was a good choiche. If they want to be resigned by Uni they again need to deliver sales. Due to these kind of contracts they for sure won't release all the great stuff they have in one time , but carefully 1 by 1. Great post! I think the 2013 contract is longer term than the 2011. Universal has done great job on streaming sites, digital downloads, Queen are the biggest in terms of digital sales than Led Zep, The Beatles, U2, Pink Floyd. Also in the streaming are much bigger. Their popularity is very good without being promoted like other bands of their era, that makes them a ggod investment with lower cost and bigger profit for their record company and ofcourse to them. Even Hugarian Rhaspody is the 2nd most viewed in UK. Forever sold much more than Muse new album in UK and its overall sales are pretty good, the same goes for Rainbow ( the dvd -blu ray sold much in US, UK and many countries without big fuzz). I am not happy with all their products, but their remasters (2011) had good sound, also had great critics and won an award by Classic Rock magazine, same for Led Zeppelin. In US they released a USB orb with mp3 and very good quality WAV files. I hope that one day we will see an album like Made in Heaven and a box of anthologies. |
Togg 25.08.2015 08:18 |
I think going back to the original question you nailed it in the original post, Zep finished in 1980, done... Queen are still active (whether you like it or not, whether you think Queen are Queen or not) so i would say once the finally hang up the guitar and sticks we will not see a full anthology with outtakes etc, They have resisted in the past because they felt there was more to do and the brand/band was still functioning. Zep finished after Bonham died and therefore apart from a one off gig and the odd apparence together to play a handful of track the shows over. |
tcc 25.08.2015 08:43 |
Ghostwithasmile is BACK! wrote: When a band is signed to a record deal they need to spit out products for the record company. Queen owed 1 more prodcut to EMI , this became Abs Greatest.I think the Absolute Greatest album served a purpose. In the airlines' flight entertainment menu, each artist gets one album on the list. Because AG contains the hits from the 70's and 80's, it is more representative of the band's selection of songs rather than just listing either GH I or II or III. I realized this when I saw the AG album on the airline's flight entertainment in one of my travels. |
MackMantilla 25.08.2015 09:27 |
tcc wrote:hahaha, that's true :DGhostwithasmile is BACK! wrote: When a band is signed to a record deal they need to spit out products for the record company. Queen owed 1 more prodcut to EMI , this became Abs Greatest.I think the Absolute Greatest album served a purpose. In the airlines' flight entertainment menu, each artist gets one album on the list. Because AG contains the hits from the 70's and 80's, it is more representative of the band's selection of songs rather than just listing either GH I or II or III. I realized this when I saw the AG album on the airline's flight entertainment in one of my travels. |
Dim 25.08.2015 10:15 |
Led Zeppelin re-issuies are very good, however they kind sound flat to me and it is like they have been remixed by Page. Moreover Queen remasters have better stereo mix and less compress than Led Zeppelin's |
Biggus Dickus 25.08.2015 10:47 |
Dim wrote: Led Zeppelin re-issuies are very good, however they kind sound flat to me and it is like they have been remixed by Page. Moreover Queen remasters have better stereo mix and less compress than Led Zeppelin'sYou're wrong, the Queen remasters have more compressions. link |
Dim 25.08.2015 11:59 |
My cousin works for a major record company (Warner), he expalined to me the differences. The overall result according to him and a sound specialists, is that Queen have better sound and less compression. I am not an expert, so I can not go to the details, but he explained to me, that Ludwig did a great job by keeping Queen songs "character" and succeed to reveal details without destroying the songs, kept the quite partts etc. So they avoided as much was possible to sound flat. |
Biggus Dickus 25.08.2015 12:51 |
I guess what's better sound is a matter of opinion. Which releases have more limited dynamic range isn't. |
Dim 25.08.2015 14:48 |
Yeah it is matter of taste and ofcourse equipment (hi fi). |
Day dop 25.08.2015 14:56 |
Dim wrote: Led Zeppelin re-issuies are very good, however they kind sound flat to me and it is like they have been remixed by Page. Moreover Queen remasters have better stereo mix and less compress than Led Zeppelin'sThe Zeppelin masters aren't as compressed as the 2011 Queen remasters. The only Queen one that's impressive is Queen II. Queen (debut) is alright. Sheer Heart Attack was the worst of the bunch, and it's one of the worst versions of The Game I've heard, considering it's usually one of the best sounding Queen albums. I could go through them all one by one, but let's just say that overall, on average, they weren't too great. In saying that, if you're pleased with them, that's fair enough. As I've said in another thread, the reason I pre-ordered the upcoming 2015 Sheer Heart Attack vinyl remaster is because if it sounds no better than the job of it they did on cd, then none of the other 2015 remasters will be worth getting. £20 + p&p might be a somewhat expensive way to find out, but it's not as expensive as buying the box set then finding out they're crap, if that's the case. And if they are any good, it works out easier and far cheaper than hunting out and buying copies of early pressings on the second hand market in near mint or mint condition. |
sexmachine 25.08.2015 15:37 |
Since a couple of years i am a regular visitor to London record fairs. A lot of dealers told me that Jimmy Page is a going to every record fair to search for old mint condition Led Zel bootlegs for his new reissues. I have seen pictures pictures as proofs. The reason why Led Zep bonus stuff is superior to Queen is that Jimmy Page cares and Brian May gives a shit. |
brENsKi 25.08.2015 16:09 |
greatest hits = gazillions reissues with bonus albums = limited sales Brian may DOES give a shit...about filthy lucre |
matt z 25.08.2015 17:21 |
brENsKi wrote: greatest hits = gazillions reissues with bonus albums = limited sales Brian may DOES give a shit...about filthy lucreIs that the next compilation's working title? FILTHY LUCRE has a nice ring to it |
people on streets 25.08.2015 18:29 |
LZ + Beatles reissues : yes. Queen reissues : no Just downloaded the bonus tracks in FLAC format wich was, in my country, perfectly legal at that time. The upcoming vinyl boxset is something I gladly ignore as well. |
Day dop 25.08.2015 18:41 |
sexmachine wrote: Since a couple of years i am a regular visitor to London record fairs. A lot of dealers told me that Jimmy Page is a going to every record fair to search for old mint condition Led Zel bootlegs for his new reissues. I have seen pictures pictures as proofs. The reason why Led Zep bonus stuff is superior to Queen is that Jimmy Page cares and Brian May gives a shit.I gather from what you say there that Page isn't one for online shopping then. |
little foetus 26.08.2015 05:36 |
I think the 2011 bonus tracks are a joke. Only five (!!) tracks on each disc, many tracks which are already available or "2011 mix", what the f***? Bike It 80 totally nailed it in my opinion, the bonus tracks are barely ads to past and future releases of the band. Nevertheless, I don't think that Queen is a band full of unreleased songs. I think most of it have been released and the more interesting things that remain are live shows, BBC sessions and maybe some unreleased demos. Now that they have released the Rainbow shows, they have seen that a 70ies show release can be successful. Hope there will be more soon. |
rschoorl 26.08.2015 06:14 |
As stated in interviews, Jimmy Page was scouring everywhere for Led Zeppelin bootlegs so he could get a full idea of what was already out there. He then made sure that the bonus tracks he added to each album were not available on bootlegs anywhere, so all fans (even those that thought they had everything) would have a new experience. That's a devotion to band and product. |
little foetus 26.08.2015 06:32 |
Wasn't Brian May an avid collector of Queen bootlegs at one point? |
*goodco* 26.08.2015 09:40 |
A little history: I ordered the Queen EMI CDs as imports when first released. Purchased the HR 'remasters' and dealt with some of the errors, as well as the few good extras, and mostly crap remixes. Stayed away from the 2011 overpriced and underfilled set, and simply had a friend provide me with most of the previously unreleased bonuses. Bought The Beatles' 2009 remasters, even though I have the originals, mainly because of the first four LPs finally being available in stereo, as well as just wanting the darn thing. With Zeppelin....it was worth purchasing 'How The West Was Won', as well as the expanded 'Song Remains The Same' reissue (what Live Killers COULD be). I have a friend that will make me copies of the three recent reissues, but I'm going to buy them. They provide the extra bang for the buck. They are what reissues are supposed to be, appealing to both the casual and hard core fans. |
brENsKi 26.08.2015 13:20 |
^^^ hear hear!!! |
The Real Wizard 26.08.2015 18:06 |
sexmachine wrote: Since a couple of years i am a regular visitor to London record fairs. A lot of dealers told me that Jimmy Page is a going to every record fair to search for old mint condition Led Zel bootlegs for his new reissues. I have seen pictures pictures as proofs. The reason why Led Zep bonus stuff is superior to Queen is that Jimmy Page cares and Brian May gives a shit.In Brian's defense - what has Page done in the last 15 years, other than remaster old Zeppelin recordings? Brian has simply followed other interests. Music has pretty clearly become second bananas to his beloved furry critters, astronomy and stereo photography. And with the exception of the Rainbow box set, it seems like the right people haven't been working for them. Hopefully that's just the start of a string of great things to come. |
musicland munich 26.08.2015 18:21 |
The Real Wizard wrote: ..., it seems like the right people haven't been working for them.E.X.A.C.T.L.Y. |
on my way up 27.08.2015 10:25 |
What I liked about the Queen bonus tracks is that we got some live tracks. I actually - and this might surprise people - grew very fond of the Tokorozawa (or Tokyo) November 3, 1982 performance and I'm very glad we got to hear the fast WWRY and also action this day in full glory for the first time. '39 from Earls Court was magnificent, as is the You take my breath away performance from Hyde park. Great they included Sheer heart attack from Paris too. Or the Rio songs... It was great to get a few live gems like that. On the other hand, the could have included way more such live songs on the bonus discs. If they indeed also recorded such gigs as Newcastle, Manchester end Slane '86: why not include tracks from one of those shows? That would have been really surprising. Did the Zeppelin bonus stuff include any live songs apart from the Paris 1969 show? |
cmsdrums 27.08.2015 10:29 |
The Real Wizard wrote:Agreed about Brian having a 'full' but still very public life and profile outside music....and also worth pointing out that in that 15 years he has STILL managed two world tours plus a studio album with Paul Rodgers, a couple of studio albums, one off singles, and major tours with Kerry Ellis, major Wolrd touring with Adam Lambert, numerous guest appearances on stage and recordings around the world with a wide variety of artists, written, recorded and released film soundtracks, carried on fairly 'hands on' with the WWRY musical, recorded and released the three new tracks on 'Forever', released several books including a music related one of the 'Red Special'... and probably more besides that I've not listed.sexmachine wrote: Since a couple of years i am a regular visitor to London record fairs. A lot of dealers told me that Jimmy Page is a going to every record fair to search for old mint condition Led Zel bootlegs for his new reissues. I have seen pictures pictures as proofs. The reason why Led Zep bonus stuff is superior to Queen is that Jimmy Page cares and Brian May gives a shit.In Brian's defense - what has Page done in the last 15 years, other than remaster old Zeppelin recordings? Brian has simply followed other interests. Music has pretty clearly become second bananas to his beloved furry critters, astronomy and stereo photography. And with the exception of the Rainbow box set, it seems like the right people haven't been working for them. Hopefully that's just the start of a string of great things to come. Put like that it does make Jimmy Page seems rather Sloth-like!! |
cmsdrums 27.08.2015 10:29 |
Double post |
Holly2003 27.08.2015 10:56 |
cmsdrums wrote:Out of all of that, only Let me In Your Heart Again is worth listening to more than once. I wonder how many people listen over and over to Queen live in Kiev, The Cosmos Rocks or Born Free?The Real Wizard wrote:Agreed about Brian having a 'full' but still very public life and profile outside music....and also worth pointing out that in that 15 years he has STILL managed two world tours plus a studio album with Paul Rodgers, a couple of studio albums, one off singles, and major tours with Kerry Ellis, major Wolrd touring with Adam Lambert, numerous guest appearances on stage and recordings around the world with a wide variety of artists, written, recorded and released film soundtracks, carried on fairly 'hands on' with the WWRY musical, recorded and released the three new tracks on 'Forever', released several books including a music related one of the 'Red Special'... and probably more besides that I've not listed. Put like that it does make Jimmy Page seems rather Sloth-like!!sexmachine wrote: Since a couple of years i am a regular visitor to London record fairs. A lot of dealers told me that Jimmy Page is a going to every record fair to search for old mint condition Led Zel bootlegs for his new reissues. I have seen pictures pictures as proofs. The reason why Led Zep bonus stuff is superior to Queen is that Jimmy Page cares and Brian May gives a shit.In Brian's defense - what has Page done in the last 15 years, other than remaster old Zeppelin recordings? Brian has simply followed other interests. Music has pretty clearly become second bananas to his beloved furry critters, astronomy and stereo photography. And with the exception of the Rainbow box set, it seems like the right people haven't been working for them. Hopefully that's just the start of a string of great things to come. |
mooghead 27.08.2015 13:20 |
Never listened to any of them ;-) |
Chief Mouse 27.08.2015 14:00 |
mooghead wrote: Never listened to any of them ;-)Want a cookie? ;) |
Day dop 27.08.2015 15:23 |
This is from brian may's site. "PRESS RELEASE: UNIVERSAL MUSIC AND CLARITY PRESENTS AN EXCLUSIVE PREVIEW OF “QUEEN: THE STUDIO COLLECTION” AT THE NATIONAL AUDIO SHOW Hear the 180gm vinyl box set on a studio quality hi-fi system before it is released. Queen fans can get exclusive pre-sale tickets for the National Audio Show unveiling of “Queen: The Studio Collection”, available for a limited period only from 09:00 on Tuesday 25th August until 24:00 on Friday 28th August, after which they will go on general sale. Tickets can be booked at link Clarity, the hi-fi industry trade association, in conjunction with Queen and Universal Music is very pleased to announce the presentation of "Queen: The Studio Collection” box set at the UK’s National Audio Show on 19th and 20th Sept 2015 – a full week before the box set goes on sale and Fan Club members can get exclusive pre-sale tickets to the show. The top-flight hi-fi system assembled for the event, includes the same £45,000 studio monitor loudspeakers used by Miles Showell at Abbey Road during the vinyl mastering process, to present a fantastic opportunity for fans to hear the albums sounding the best they possibly can. Using these ultra-high resolution speakers provides the capability to show off the audio quality of the box set with incredible detail and will help create a feeling of actually being at the recording itself, reproducing the energy and atmosphere that was felt when Freddie, Brian, Roger and John put the tracks together. Five years in the making "Queen: The Studio Collection” brings together the complete collection of 15 studio albums, re-mastered by the legendary Bob Ludwig and mastered for half speed vinyl cutting by Miles Showell at Abbey Road. Encased in a beautifully crafted box and complete with a lavishly illustrated 108-page book featuring material from Queen’s archive and the personal archives of Brian May and Roger Taylor, these classic albums are presented in the highest possible audio quality for die-hard fans and audiophiles alike. The National Audio Show gives audiophiles and music lovers the chance to hear the world's best hi-fi in one location. Learn about the latest technology, including how to stream music around the home, how to turn a computer into a high-end audio source and experience the very best that the vinyl resurgence has to offer." |
Day dop 27.08.2015 15:25 |
I don't know about die-hard fans (in general), but audiophiles were generally of the opinion that the 2011 remasters weren't too great (again, apart from Queen II). |
Biggus Dickus 27.08.2015 23:38 |
Day dop wrote: I don't know about die-hard fans (in general), but audiophiles were generally of the opinion that the 2011 remasters weren't too great (again, apart from Queen II).They probably think that the "top-flight" hi-fi system negates all the compression on the vinyls. If they indeed are the same as the 2011 remasters. |
cmsdrums 28.08.2015 02:45 |
Biggus Dickus wrote:I'd also much rather they spent the money getting the audio right, rather than a pointless brag about how much the speakers cost that they listened to their over-compressed tracks on!!Day dop wrote: I don't know about die-hard fans (in general), but audiophiles were generally of the opinion that the 2011 remasters weren't too great (again, apart from Queen II).They probably think that the "top-flight" hi-fi system negates all the compression on the vinyls. If they indeed are the same as the 2011 remasters. |
pittrek 28.08.2015 07:24 |
Holly2003 wrote:I heard LMIYHA maybe twice, I have never watched or listened to Born Free or Kiev, but I listed pretty often to The Cosmos Rocks and I liked it.cmsdrums wrote:Out of all of that, only Let me In Your Heart Again is worth listening to more than once. I wonder how many people listen over and over to Queen live in Kiev, The Cosmos Rocks or Born Free?The Real Wizard wrote:Agreed about Brian having a 'full' but still very public life and profile outside music....and also worth pointing out that in that 15 years he has STILL managed two world tours plus a studio album with Paul Rodgers, a couple of studio albums, one off singles, and major tours with Kerry Ellis, major Wolrd touring with Adam Lambert, numerous guest appearances on stage and recordings around the world with a wide variety of artists, written, recorded and released film soundtracks, carried on fairly 'hands on' with the WWRY musical, recorded and released the three new tracks on 'Forever', released several books including a music related one of the 'Red Special'... and probably more besides that I've not listed. Put like that it does make Jimmy Page seems rather Sloth-like!!sexmachine wrote: Since a couple of years i am a regular visitor to London record fairs. A lot of dealers told me that Jimmy Page is a going to every record fair to search for old mint condition Led Zel bootlegs for his new reissues. I have seen pictures pictures as proofs. The reason why Led Zep bonus stuff is superior to Queen is that Jimmy Page cares and Brian May gives a shit.In Brian's defense - what has Page done in the last 15 years, other than remaster old Zeppelin recordings? Brian has simply followed other interests. Music has pretty clearly become second bananas to his beloved furry critters, astronomy and stereo photography. And with the exception of the Rainbow box set, it seems like the right people haven't been working for them. Hopefully that's just the start of a string of great things to come. |
Day dop 28.08.2015 13:38 |
Biggus Dickus wrote:A decent system doesn't negate the compression on vinyl or cd, and I've never known of any that think otherwise.Day dop wrote: I don't know about die-hard fans (in general), but audiophiles were generally of the opinion that the 2011 remasters weren't too great (again, apart from Queen II).They probably think that the "top-flight" hi-fi system negates all the compression on the vinyls. If they indeed are the same as the 2011 remasters. |
Day dop 28.08.2015 13:48 |
cmsdrums wrote:Biggus Dickus wrote:I'd also much rather they spent the money getting the audio right, rather than a pointless brag about how much the speakers cost that they listened to their over-compressed tracks on!!Day dop wrote: I don't know about die-hard fans (in general), but audiophiles were generally of the opinion that the 2011 remasters weren't too great (again, apart from Queen II).They probably think that the "top-flight" hi-fi system negates all the compression on the vinyls. If they indeed are the same as the 2011 remasters. Getting audio right is what an audiophile aims for. I rarely ever see brags about how much the speakers are that they own, and for the ones that do, that's just twerpish. Expense doesn't necessarily equate quality anyway. You can throw a ton of money at a pair of speakers and they'll sound worse than an inexpensive pair - much of which will be down to room acoustics / speaker size in the room they're in / the amp driving them. You can also pick up second hand ones that sound better than new ones as you're getting more bang for your buck. Spending a lot of money on a pair of speakers shouldn't be the deciding factor at all. Sometimes that can be the worst thing to do. Over compressed tracks/poor remasters aren't exclusive for those who get decent gear either either - they're available for everyone, and you don't need a hi end system to be able to hear they're poor remasters. You'll get gullible idiots fork out a few thousand or more on speaker cables, hence there's a market for it, but then you get idiots in all walks of life. |
AlbaNo1 29.08.2015 05:48 |
The Real Wizard wrote:Totally agree with the above list for Queen highlights.matt z wrote: The sad thing about it is. .... that every guy (like me) that didn'tbuy into em, gives further credence to the notion that nobody wants to hear their extras. Which only begs the reasoning all around again. .. nobody bought them all over again BECAUSE of the omissions. Chicken and the egg.You may have a point. Even with the tidbits that did come out, there was very little discussion of them. Here were the new studio pieces: Seven Seas Of Rhye - whole new ending Feelings Feelings - different take from the one that leaked about 10 years ago Don't Stop Me Now - guitar version Dreamers Ball - early take Sail Away Sweet Sister - take 1 (amazing listen - you can pinpoint the moment Brian listened back and realized he found the melody for the verse) It's A Beautiful Day - original Football Fight - piano version (this eats the studio version for breakfast) The Kiss - early take A Kind of Vision - early take The Invisible Man - Roger guide vocal Headlong - Brian guide vocal Ride The Wild Wind - Roger guide vocal This amounted to about a half hour of new music. And nothing from SHA/Opera/Races, which to me is criminal. I guess this just hits home after hearing all the wonderful things on the Zeppelin reissues. However I've listened to the extras on Houses of the Holy and Physical Grafitti and sorry, not that bowled over. Mostly not that different to the final versions and nothing in truly embryonic stage. I do think once the dust settles people will realise there's only one or two out of seven on each album that add any value. Certainly no chance of alternative lead vocalist.. |
brENsKi 30.08.2015 08:46 |
^^ that's subjective. you may not be bowled over - others may be. the point is - a lot more time and effort went into the Zep reissues. the queen "deluxes" were rushed to get some "new product" out for the record company - and it shows. Page has spent a long time listening and compiling this stuff - pity QPL didn't spend half that time on a similar project |
Vocal harmony 01.09.2015 05:47 |
^^^ absolutely agree. And that, in a nutshell is the problem with the Queen product and the reason why the Zeppelin re masters are so good. As regards the vinyl playback event. The fact they are making such a big thing about the quality and expense of the speaker system I don't think is actually about needing good expensive equipment to listen to vinyl. They've made the point of saying it's the same system they were mastered on. So why not use any other high end audio system. Could it be that this is yet another project that's falling short and actually only sound good when played back through the speakers it was mastered on. I'm guessing the event will be open to the press and it will be at this event that the product will be reviewed from. I'm guessing when you've parted with your hard earned cash and taken the box home it won't sound anywhere near as good As the official playback or that different to the 2011 CD's |
Vocal harmony 01.09.2015 05:47 |
^^^ absolutely agree. And that, in a nutshell is the problem with the Queen product and the reason why the Zeppelin re masters are so good. As regards the vinyl playback event. The fact they are making such a big thing about the quality and expense of the speaker system I don't think is actually about needing good expensive equipment to listen to vinyl. They've made the point of saying it's the same system they were mastered on. So why not use any other high end audio system. Could it be that this is yet another project that's falling short and actually only sound good when played back through the speakers it was mastered on. I'm guessing the event will be open to the press and it will be at this event that the product will be reviewed from. I'm guessing when you've parted with your hard earned cash and taken the box home it won't sound anywhere near as good As the official playback or that different to the 2011 CD's |
AlbaNo1 01.09.2015 15:54 |
See below Amazon reviews. General consensus. Masters are generally great. Bonus material not so much. K.B. says: I was about to write the exact same thing, but John Doe got to it before me. These alternate versions offer nothing more than very minor differences from the original, and in the case of Stairway to Heaven, pratically no difference. The way Page described these re-releases were as if he had something that would really knock our socks off, and so far none of it has been really impressive. I was hoping for more unreleased music, early demos of songs (for example an acoustic take on an electric song, or vice-versa, if they even exist), and definitely more live material. Zeppelin were at their peak live during this era. DLR says: Agree 100%. I also had to check my two CDs, as I wanted to hear the different versions of the songs! So if you want to save cash, buy the single cd version. James L. Dickinson says: What I want to know if they are actual different takes? Not a different mix of the released song. And to have the same songs minus the vocals is just plain stupid IMHO. If the remaster is really good then I may just get the single disc on IV and leave it at that. I only have gotten Led Zep I due to the live disc. It seems all of the others have similar "alt" takes on disc 2. |
Day dop 01.09.2015 17:26 |
AlbaNo1 wrote: See below Amazon reviews. General consensus. Masters are generally great. Bonus material not so much. K.B. says: I was about to write the exact same thing, but John Doe got to it before me. These alternate versions offer nothing more than very minor differences from the original, and in the case of Stairway to Heaven, pratically no difference. The way Page described these re-releases were as if he had something that would really knock our socks off, and so far none of it has been really impressive. I was hoping for more unreleased music, early demos of songs (for example an acoustic take on an electric song, or vice-versa, if they even exist), and definitely more live material. Zeppelin were at their peak live during this era. DLR says: Agree 100%. I also had to check my two CDs, as I wanted to hear the different versions of the songs! So if you want to save cash, buy the single cd version. James L. Dickinson says: What I want to know if they are actual different takes? Not a different mix of the released song. And to have the same songs minus the vocals is just plain stupid IMHO. If the remaster is really good then I may just get the single disc on IV and leave it at that. I only have gotten Led Zep I due to the live disc. It seems all of the others have similar "alt" takes on disc 2. Your average Joe public on Amazon would probably think it's better just because it's a new remaster. To give you an idea of just how poor the dynamics are on the 2011 remasters (admittedly, one aspect of remastering only), see the Dynamic Range Database: http://dr.loudness-war.info/album/list After you've viewed 'Bad - Transition - Good', check out, for example, how Greatest Hits I and II did: Greatest Hits I 2011 remaster: http://dr.loudness-war.info/album/view/7333 Greatest Hits II 2011 remaster: http://dr.loudness-war.info/album/view/7322 And here you can compare the various reissues / versions: http://dr.loudness-war.info/album/list?artist=queen&album=greatest+hits About the loudness wars: http://dynamicrangeday.co.uk/about/ |
Vocal harmony 02.09.2015 06:51 |
Alphabetical listing doesn't seem to have reached this far as a concept! These lists seem to prove that downloads, for the most part are rubbish. And some remastered CD's are not very good either. Which I think most of us already knew! What I find interesting is that Musicians and producers and even managers seem incapable of spotting how bad these supposed better releases really are and seem unable to fix the problem before unleashing these money making packages on the music buying public. More and more it seems the real ears and true understanding of what actually sounds good is in the domain of those who buy and listen rather than those who produce and rake in the money. |
AlbaNo1 02.09.2015 16:49 |
Led Zep seem to have done good remasters,the fans know about the loudness war etc. My points concern bonus material, which does not seem to be much more imaginative than Queen's |
Day dop 02.09.2015 23:45 |
AlbaNo1 wrote: Led Zep seem to have done good remasters,the fans know about the loudness war etc. My points concern bonus material, which does not seem to be much more imaginative than Queen's What you said didn't concern the bonus material only. You said "General consensus. Masters are generally great." If general consensus is that they're great then they don't know about loudness wars. It's just folks lapping up remasters going with the misguided notion they're better than what they've previously had. Generally, the Queen remasters aren't great. The Zeppelin remasters are widely praised, first and foremost because they're excellent remasters. The bonus material, although a nice hook for the fans, comes second to the remastering. Personally I bought the standard remasters of LZ I & II. The bonus material / deluxe jobbies didn't interest me, I'm not that much of a LZ fan. The Beatles remasters didn't come with any bonus material whatsoever, but they were, and still are widely praised Here, There and Everywhere (see what I did there?), because, again, they're superb remasters. Queen moved over to another label. The albums had to be reissued. The deluxe versions with bonus material were clearly just a way to milk extra money out of fans - hardly any thought put into the bonus material at all. Queen Productions are fairly shameless when it comes to milking fans. Why do they need imagination when fans are willing to throw money at sub-par products and blatant rip offs? There'd be enough examples, be it Queen Forever (hey, buy the entire album for just one "new" number, and two reworkings, one exceptionally dire) or an Innuendo deckchair for 134 quid. "Sorry Sold Out". http://www.queenonlinestore.com/Queen/Queen-Archive-Edition/ The only decent things they've put out in a long time is the Days Of Our Lives doc and Live at the Rainbow. I'd say the only thing fans can look forward to is hopefully, more decent live products. As for an anthology, I can't see it somehow. Oh, speaking of prices, that reminds me folks.,, Queen online are selling new LPs for £19.99. If you're gonna buy them, get them cheaper from elsewhere. From here, £14.99: http://www.whatrecords.co.uk/search.asp?artist=queen&title=&format=&catalogue=&submit.x=93&submit.y=5 |
brians wig 03.09.2015 05:20 |
AlbaNo1 wrote: See below Amazon reviews. General consensus. Masters are generally great. Bonus material not so much. K.B. says: I was about to write the exact same thing, but John Doe got to it before me. These alternate versions offer nothing more than very minor differences from the original, and in the case of Stairway to Heaven, pratically no difference. The way Page described these re-releases were as if he had something that would really knock our socks off, and so far none of it has been really impressive. I was hoping for more unreleased music, early demos of songs (for example an acoustic take on an electric song, or vice-versa, if they even exist), and definitely more live material. Zeppelin were at their peak live during this era. DLR says: Agree 100%. I also had to check my two CDs, as I wanted to hear the different versions of the songs! So if you want to save cash, buy the single cd version. James L. Dickinson says: What I want to know if they are actual different takes? Not a different mix of the released song. And to have the same songs minus the vocals is just plain stupid IMHO. If the remaster is really good then I may just get the single disc on IV and leave it at that. I only have gotten Led Zep I due to the live disc. It seems all of the others have similar "alt" takes on disc 2.The problem is that Page said there was so much bootleg material out there that he wanted to present the fans with something unheard, but yes, there's not a lot of difference I can tell between the different versions. It IS a shame that he didn't release mint quality versions of the stuff that appears on the 18 disc "Studio Magik" bootleg - most of that is shocking quality but does contain different versions. |
brians wig 03.09.2015 05:27 |
Day dop wrote: Oh, speaking of prices, that reminds me folks.,, Queen online are selling new LPs for £19.99. If you're gonna buy them, get them cheaper from elsewhere. From here, £14.99: http://www.whatrecords.co.uk/search.asp?artist=queen&title=&format=&catalogue=&submit.x=93&submit.y=5You think THAT's bad???? Amazon.co.uk STILL haven't sorted their prices out yet (what is it with Amazon UK? They were the last Amazon site to reduce their prices for "Forever" and "Rainbow" as well....) link |
AlbaNo1 03.09.2015 15:39 |
Day dop wrote:AlbaNo1 wrote: Led Zep seem to have done good remasters,the fans know about the loudness war etc. My points concern bonus material, which does not seem to be much more imaginative than Queen's |
Day dop 03.09.2015 18:39 |
AlbaNo1 wrote: My first post , prior page, was related to bonus material. Im not volunteering a view on quality of remasters other than noting there is a positive consensus amongst those who have got them. My point is that queens bonus material has fans grumbling while zep do no wrong according to posters here. But the reality is the bonus material isnt all that. God this is tiring. Last post.^ It's like a heavy dose of deja vu. I'm glad you decided to stop. |
Day dop 03.09.2015 18:42 |
brians wig wrote:That's ridiculous.Day dop wrote: Oh, speaking of prices, that reminds me folks.,, Queen online are selling new LPs for £19.99. If you're gonna buy them, get them cheaper from elsewhere. From here, £14.99: http://www.whatrecords.co.uk/search.asp?artist=queen&title=&format=&catalogue=&submit.x=93&submit.y=5You think THAT's bad???? Amazon.co.uk STILL haven't sorted their prices out yet (what is it with Amazon UK? They were the last Amazon site to reduce their prices for "Forever" and "Rainbow" as well....) link |
Day dop 03.09.2015 18:44 |
They've got the box set up for £495.99 too. I imagine you've already seen. link |
AlbaNo1 04.09.2015 02:37 |
Day dop wrote:Im going to listen to Delilah eight times in a row to get over this topicAlbaNo1 wrote: My first post , prior page, was related to bonus material. Im not volunteering a view on quality of remasters other than noting there is a positive consensus amongst those who have got them. My point is that queens bonus material has fans grumbling while zep do no wrong according to posters here. But the reality is the bonus material isnt all that. God this is tiring. Last post.^ It's like a heavy dose of deja vu. I'm glad you decided to stop. |