ili 26.12.2014 14:41 |
Regarding the spanish guitar part in the middle section played by Steve Howe, I read somewhere that Brian asked him to play because he admitted that he wasn't able to... I'm not a guitar player but I have been listening and watching Brian for the last 25 years, Without debate he is one of the greatest guitarists in the world; if not the greatest of them all. Personally I don't think there's any melody/ tune / music that Brian cannot play on any kind of guitar if he wants to. Why do you think he made such a statement that he could not play what Steve was able to? Was he just being humble or really telling the truth? I'd like to get opinions from you especially if you're a guitar player. |
Sebastian 26.12.2014 15:05 |
Brian's a great guitarist but that doesn't mean he's perfect or superhuman or the ultimate omnipotent performer. On 'Innuendo' he played most of the bits, though, the only exceptions being the ascending chromatic run and the ornaments on the third iteration of the flamenco cadence. Those are parts he could have probably nailed had he tried to, but Steve could do them far better. To each their own. |
Oscar J 26.12.2014 15:26 |
ili wrote: I'm not a guitar player but I have been listening and watching Brian for the last 25 years, Without debate he is one of the greatest guitarists in the world; if not the greatest of them all. Personally I don't think there's any melody/ tune / music that Brian cannot play on any kind of guitar if he wants to.That is outrageous. He's not really a very technically accomplished guitarist and there are probably tens of thousands of guitar parts out there that he'd never be able to play. He did some acoustic noodling on Who Needs You that sort of indicates he'd be able to pull the Innuendo bits off though. |
ludwigs 26.12.2014 15:29 |
ili wrote: Regarding the spanish guitar part in the middle section played by Steve Howe, I read somewhere that Brian asked him to play because he admitted that he wasn't able to... I'm not a guitar player but I have been listening and watching Brian for the last 25 years, Without debate he is one of the greatest guitarists in the world; if not the greatest of them all. Personally I don't think there's any melody/ tune / music that Brian cannot play on any kind of guitar if he wants to. Why do you think he made such a statement that he could not play what Steve was able to? Was he just being humble or really telling the truth? I'd like to get opinions from you especially if you're a guitar player.I'd have to disagree with your, " Without debate he is one of the greatest guitarists in the world; if not the greatest of them all. Personally I don't think there's any melody/ tune / music that Brian cannot play on any kind of guitar if he wants to". I don't believe he can play lot's of things and also styles. Totally agree that he is one of the most gifted re: ideas, composition etc but fairly average as a player. (I'm not to put him down as he is my favourite guitarist too - I'm just being realistic.) Greatest of them all?? Definitely not!! I've studied his style for over 30 years both practically and theoretically and have also spent many years studying other players, so feel I can make a valid opinion/grasp on his limitations as a guitarist. Excellent composition skills but lousy 'live' player on the whole - lacking in any improv skills. Could he play some of the classical repertoire? He himself stated a few years ago, during the opening talks to one of the Proms concerts, that he didn't have the ability to pull those off. 'Sting' tries but isn't particularly good at it. Flamenco - not at all! Jazz? Hmm, again his skills are limited - both chord work and also scalar sequences/modes. Rock - Totally!!! Even the 'spin-off' genres. Latin - 'Who Needs You'. Brilliant licks and ideas/feel. My favourite guitarist, as I said but...not the greatest by a long, long way. (not versatile enough either) |
Vocal harmony 26.12.2014 15:35 |
^^^^kind of what I was thinking too. But explained so much better than I could |
mooghead 26.12.2014 15:53 |
He played the same guitar solo for a million years..... |
anniestu44b 26.12.2014 15:54 |
'lousy' live player? Wow, have you had a bad day? I agree Brian is not the best guitar player ever, not in the top ten either but Lousy.!? That's a statement too far. |
ludwigs 26.12.2014 16:19 |
anniestu44b wrote: 'lousy' live player? Wow, have you had a bad day? I agree Brian is not the best guitar player ever, not in the top ten either but Lousy.!? That's a statement too far.Really??? I've had a great day thanks. Some questions put to you annie: 1)Do you play? 2)Have you listened to most of their live catalogue? (Gregsynth has a load uploaded) 3)Can you base an opinion outside the fact of being a fan? 4)Have you listened to/ seen MANY other players' live work? Do they fuck up as often? No! 5) Can you not determine that BM ain't great live?? (Sure he rocks BUT he was probably the most error-making part of Queen on an instrument -vocals excluded.) 6) Can you not step back and hear that he made too many mistakes, too often. Even the same old songs they'd played for years.(Wasn't like he was shit-faced, like a lot of rockers either. The recent Kerry Ellis stuff - Even tho' he'd practised, he still cocked up....too often!! So, with all the evidence on-file, I stand by my view. |
tomchristie22 26.12.2014 16:42 |
I'd challenge the blanket statement that he was a bad live player and unable to improvise - he often changed up the solo to White Queen, sometimes more so than others, always with good results. Anyway, a lack of improv ability shouldn't matter when he so often turned in the solos note for note, adapting them for a single guitar while still remaining true and familiar to the album versions. |
Oscar J 26.12.2014 16:51 |
Well ludwig, I'd put it like this: he fucks up a bit too often given how little he improvises. Hendrix and Page made a LOT of mistakes, but that's because they always tried new things. |
ludwigs 26.12.2014 17:03 |
Oscar J wrote: Well ludwig, I'd put it like this: he fucks up a bit too often given how little he improvises. Hendrix and Page made a LOT of mistakes, but that's because they always tried new things.Yes, I agree with that! I'm comparing him to many, many players all around the world - even pub players. Page was always sloppy and often shit-faced - was Jimi too? |
ludwigs 26.12.2014 17:09 |
tomchristie22 wrote: I'd challenge the blanket statement that he was a bad live player and unable to improvise - he often changed up the solo to White Queen, sometimes more so than others, always with good results. Anyway, a lack of improv ability shouldn't matter when he so often turned in the solos note for note, adapting them for a single guitar while still remaining true and familiar to the album versions.I'm sure he did vary the delay part of the solo. Sometimes it was nice and sometimes it sounded just a little 'off' IMO. There are great examples and ideas in a lot of the performances. White Queen isn't really too hard a solo to play. Essentially just his usual playing in pentatonics/minor scale to work with the delay repeats. The album 6-harmony guitars over the solo are excellent!! He was MUCH better player in those days because they still had the passion and drive to succeed. Once big-time fame came their way, they kinda just went through the motions more often than not. |
Vocal harmony 26.12.2014 17:44 |
His live work in the 70's was a lot better than in the mid 80's, by which time he had become lazy. As a band they still performed well and with great power, but I always felt BM was a bit of a weak link within the band live. But there are moments when he nails it, and is stunning, but those moments are few and far between and at his and the bands level they should be an everyday thing. He has been lucky to play with a solid rhythm section which helps hold things together. |
TheAdmiester 26.12.2014 18:07 |
Isn't that part mimicked by the electric guitar for the solo? Surely that's already being able to play it? |
winterspelt 26.12.2014 18:20 |
ili wrote: Regarding the spanish guitar part in the middle section played by Steve Howe, I read somewhere that Brian asked him to play because he admitted that he wasn't able to... (...) Why do you think he made such a statement that he could not play what Steve was able to? Was he just being humble or really telling the truth? I'd like to get opinions from you especially if you're a guitar player.Think about it this way: You can make a text using Microsoft's Word (a software many best sellers authors use) but that doesnt mean that everything you write, despite your best efforts, will be a best seller. Music is an expression and even if Brian could play all the notes at the right tempo, it would not mean that everything he plays sounds properly. Steve Howe is an amazing guitar player (my favorite) but can you imagine him being a black metal guitar player? Technically he can play it, but he just dont get the "feeling" so if he needed a "black metal" part of a Yes song, he would get someone who can play it and make the music sound as it should. |
The Real Wizard 26.12.2014 19:57 |
Brian just hasn't really been a guy to work on his chops. He even admitted it in guitar magazines in the 90s, saying he prefers to focus on creativity instead of technical exercises. You really can't argue with a guy who has sold a couple hundred million records on that point. I'm a firm believer in the idea that if you change a single variable, something else switches off. There are literally a million guitar players in this world with better chops than Brian. But you can bet your life that 99.99% of them sure don't has his skills in composition and arrangement, nor his relevance, accessibility or longevity. I'd say he made the right choice. As for the original point - Brian is bang on about Steve Howe being the better player. He could've spent the time to get his chops up to snuff to play the smooth chromatic run, but it was just easier to hire Steve Howe who could already do it. |
The King Of Rhye 26.12.2014 20:38 |
^^ Great post! To put it another way, if he had worked on his 'chops' more, he wouldn't be exactly the same Brian May.....and how many of those million guitar players with better technique have written as many great songs as Brian? One of my favorite guitar players is Neil Young....probably a million guys that could 'out-shred' him as well! But definitely a guy who played with passion and soul.....(listen to the 'one-note guitar solo' in Cinnamon Girl...lol) And hugely influential, at that..... Btw, one thing I just love that Brian does, that I dont really hear a lot of other players do.........that sorta fast low-string riffing he does in solos and the like.......a bit in TYMD, and in I Want It All, Princes Of The Universe, and probably a few other songs I am not thinking of at the moment....relatively a simple thing, but it just kicks ass! Or do more guitar players do that than I am aware of? lol |
ili 27.12.2014 01:24 |
Thanks for all the comments guys....I didn't know there were that many details to consider but like I said I'm not a guitar player. I was fanatic with my comment (gretatest of them all..) but he is my favourite guitarist after all. There's no other band or musician that I follow or listen regularly / continously except Queen. (Don't mean I did not want to or tried to). They may not be the best or hardest to play but I love Brian's guitar sound and his solos on Queen songs. The 2 most fascinating sounds I have ever heard in my life have always been: 1- Freddie's voice 2- Brian's guitar solos and no fact will change that.... |
Sebastian 27.12.2014 02:12 |
TheAdmiester wrote: Isn't that part mimicked by the electric guitar for the solo? Surely that's already being able to play it?But he's just mimicking the easy bit (the diatonic scale fragments), which, as I wrote earlier, he also recorded on classical guitar. What Steve did (and that's not included in the re-exposition of the solo) was the chromatic run and the ornaments that connect the second iteration with the third and continue thereafter. |
Martin Packer 27.12.2014 03:45 |
Maybe Steve Howe was just passing through and one thing led to another... Simplest theory of all. :-) |
una999 27.12.2014 05:32 |
ludwigs wrote:While I think saying someone is the “best” is juvenile, just because he isn’t the most technical guitar player doesn’t mean he couldn’t be one of the best guitar players ever. He can’t play at a million miles an hour and pull off every note....but going on that criteria, someone like Mozart would be the best piano player ever...but what does that matter, more people listen to John Lennon or Elton John and in general their music is easier to listen to. I’d prefer to listen to a slow uncomplicated piece than someone hitting 100 notes a second or doing some complicated runs (the run in bohemian rhapsody solo sounds pretty good to me).ili wrote: Regarding the spanish guitar part in the middle section played by Steve Howe, I read somewhere that Brian asked him to play because he admitted that he wasn't able to... I'm not a guitar player but I have been listening and watching Brian for the last 25 years, Without debate he is one of the greatest guitarists in the world; if not the greatest of them all. Personally I don't think there's any melody/ tune / music that Brian cannot play on any kind of guitar if he wants to. Why do you think he made such a statement that he could not play what Steve was able to? Was he just being humble or really telling the truth? I'd like to get opinions from you especially if you're a guitar player.I'd have to disagree with your, " Without debate he is one of the greatest guitarists in the world; if not the greatest of them all. Personally I don't think there's any melody/ tune / music that Brian cannot play on any kind of guitar if he wants to". I don't believe he can play lot's of things and also styles. Totally agree that he is one of the most gifted re: ideas, composition etc but fairly average as a player. (I'm not to put him down as he is my favourite guitarist too - I'm just being realistic.) Greatest of them all?? Definitely not!! I've studied his style for over 30 years both practically and theoretically and have also spent many years studying other players, so feel I can make a valid opinion/grasp on his limitations as a guitarist. Excellent composition skills but lousy 'live' player on the whole - lacking in any improv skills. Could he play some of the classical repertoire? He himself stated a few years ago, during the opening talks to one of the Proms concerts, that he didn't have the ability to pull those off. 'Sting' tries but isn't particularly good at it. Flamenco - not at all! Jazz? Hmm, again his skills are limited - both chord work and also scalar sequences/modes. Rock - Totally!!! Even the 'spin-off' genres. Latin - 'Who Needs You'. Brilliant licks and ideas/feel. My favourite guitarist, as I said but...not the greatest by a long, long way. (not versatile enough either) Brian May’s has his own approach to the guitar and the best thing about him is he always produces a kick ass sound with fantastic licks – even a song like hang on in there has some interesting licks. The Queen catalogue is littered with these types of licks and runs, they don’t need to be complicated, it’s the way they’re pulled off that is the skill. And also what a skill he has in orchestration. Even Roy Thomas Baker said he was incredible at building up guitar harmonies and at speed! I’d take listening to Brian May any day for the types of licks he creates. Maybe he is the best. |
ludwigs 27.12.2014 05:42 |
una999 wrote:Totally agree!!!ludwigs wrote:While I think saying someone is the “best” is juvenile, just because he isn’t the most technical guitar player doesn’t mean he couldn’t be one of the best guitar players ever. He can’t play at a million miles an hour and pull off every note....but going on that criteria, someone like Mozart would be the best piano player ever...but what does that matter, more people listen to John Lennon or Elton John and in general their music is easier to listen to. I’d prefer to listen to a slow uncomplicated piece than someone hitting 100 notes a second or doing some complicated runs (the run in bohemian rhapsody solo sounds pretty good to me). Brian May’s has his own approach to the guitar and the best thing about him is he always produces a kick ass sound with fantastic licks – even a song like hang on in there has some interesting licks. The Queen catalogue is littered with these types of licks and runs, they don’t need to be complicated, it’s the way they’re pulled off that is the skill. And also what a skill he has in orchestration. Even Roy Thomas Baker said he was incredible at building up guitar harmonies and at speed! I’d take listening to Brian May any day for the types of licks he creates. Maybe he is the best.ili wrote: Regarding the spanish guitar part in the middle section played by Steve Howe, I read somewhere that Brian asked him to play because he admitted that he wasn't able to... I'm not a guitar player but I have been listening and watching Brian for the last 25 years, Without debate he is one of the greatest guitarists in the world; if not the greatest of them all. Personally I don't think there's any melody/ tune / music that Brian cannot play on any kind of guitar if he wants to. Why do you think he made such a statement that he could not play what Steve was able to? Was he just being humble or really telling the truth? I'd like to get opinions from you especially if you're a guitar player.I'd have to disagree with your, " Without debate he is one of the greatest guitarists in the world; if not the greatest of them all. Personally I don't think there's any melody/ tune / music that Brian cannot play on any kind of guitar if he wants to". I don't believe he can play lot's of things and also styles. Totally agree that he is one of the most gifted re: ideas, composition etc but fairly average as a player. (I'm not to put him down as he is my favourite guitarist too - I'm just being realistic.) Greatest of them all?? Definitely not!! I've studied his style for over 30 years both practically and theoretically and have also spent many years studying other players, so feel I can make a valid opinion/grasp on his limitations as a guitarist. Excellent composition skills but lousy 'live' player on the whole - lacking in any improv skills. Could he play some of the classical repertoire? He himself stated a few years ago, during the opening talks to one of the Proms concerts, that he didn't have the ability to pull those off. 'Sting' tries but isn't particularly good at it. Flamenco - not at all! Jazz? Hmm, again his skills are limited - both chord work and also scalar sequences/modes. Rock - Totally!!! Even the 'spin-off' genres. Latin - 'Who Needs You'. Brilliant licks and ideas/feel. My favourite guitarist, as I said but...not the greatest by a long, long way. (not versatile enough either) Guitar wanking does nothing for me. I have stated BM is my favourite player - he isn't fast but I'm more into the structure, feel and compositional skills/ideas of a player - and his sound, just does it for me. His work (and Queens) is the vast majority of my transcribing and replication work Yes, I've worked the Rush, Rhoads, Sabbath, Vai catalogue BUT it's BM's work that I spend literally months working out pieces. |
Holly2003 27.12.2014 06:33 |
Aside from all of that, he and Roger make a hell of a racket together, which can only be a good thing. |
Oscar J 27.12.2014 06:49 |
Liszt was way faster than Mozart. |
ludwigs 27.12.2014 07:25 |
Oscar J wrote: Liszt was way faster than Mozart.And a dragster is faster than an E-type jag but..... Which holds more of an emotive preference? |
miraclesteinway 27.12.2014 09:02 |
Actually more people listen to Mozart than John Lennon or Elton John, and not just because his music has been around for longer, but you're right more people are, today, into pop music. More people alive today probably know Justin Bieber and Miley Cirus than John Lennon..... Rachmaninoff and Horowitz were probably the greatest pianists we have recorded, in any genre, and Art Tatum too. The question as to why Brian chose to invite someone else to play a particular passage on a particular song is probably simply that he admired the playing of Steve Howe, and wanted him to play that particular passage. It's probably that simple. Brian could have probably played it, or even used editing to make it work (like the harp on A night at the opera). I agree that Brian is one of the greatest minds in rock music arranging. I'll bet he helped Freddie with some of the complex vocal arrangements on some songs, and I think he probably has some of the best ears in the business. However, there is a certain wooden-ness in his playing live, you know, like he's a little bit scared to do something wrong (and then does it wrong anyway), but it's not like he screws up ALL the time. He isn't a Hendrix, but then he's not that kind of musician. Brian seems to thrive in the studio, and I know he says he loves live playing and have the direct contact with the audience, but it seems that there is a little bit of a fear factor comes into play. Maybe not fear, but just a bit of tension in his technique perhaps. Like his singing too - it's good. His voice is good, great range, but there are few times when he really (and I mean REALLY) lets go and lets it flow. I still think he's awesome though, and untouchable, and he is a founder member of one of the greatest (in terms of the whole thing - the look, the sound, the marketing, the scale of the thing) groups in rock music. |
anniestu44b 27.12.2014 10:50 |
I still think 'LOUSY' live player is too harsh a statement. He deoes make mistakes I agree, as I said he isn't the best guitar player in the universe, as Brian has stated himself. And no I don't play, I'm just an appreciator of music, not a perfectionist either. I just like sitting back, enjoy listening to good music (of many kinds), not analysing,not picking things to pieces, not breaking things down (I leave that to the talented people/musicians amongst us). Oh and I think I better add that my name isn't Annie, it's Stu lol. I better change my Username! |
musicland munich 27.12.2014 11:18 |
@ Ludwigs....great post(s)... |
Oscar J 27.12.2014 11:31 |
ludwigs wrote:I didn't mean anything by that, was just referring to una999's comment, which seemed to suggest that Mozart was the most technically accomplished pianist ever.Oscar J wrote: Liszt was way faster than Mozart.And a dragster is faster than an E-type jag but..... Which holds more of an emotive preference? Wait, are you comparing Liszt to a dragster? :-) |
Sebastian 27.12.2014 12:45 |
miraclesteinway wrote: The question as to why Brian chose to invite someone else to play a particular passage on a particular song is probably simply that he admired the playing of Steve Howe, and wanted him to play that particular passage.According to what the late David Richards said, it was Freddie who invited him, not Brian. Now, it's not like Freddie said 'hey, we need Steve for this, let's fly him from wherever he is,' it's, as someone else already said, a simple coincidence: they'd been working on the song (and, judging by what Steve commented later on, they'd already recorded Brian's bits, which are 90% of the classical work and 100% of the rock work on that piece), Steve dropped by to say hello to them as he'd been doing a session nearby, and then they (Fred, Bri, whoever) asked him to add some chromatic runs and put the icing on the cake and that was it. |
mooghead 27.12.2014 15:41 |
I just wish Brian was less of a perfectionist and prepared to take more risks. I know that makes him what he is but I cannot think of the last time I listened to one of his solos all the way through because they are all just so 'Briany'. The echo thing got boring very quickly, from the first album... from Queen at the Beeb even.... |
ludwigs 27.12.2014 17:06 |
anniestu44b wrote: I still think 'LOUSY' live player is too harsh a statement. He deoes make mistakes I agree, as I said he isn't the best guitar player in the universe, as Brian has stated himself. And no I don't play, I'm just an appreciator of music, not a perfectionist either. I just like sitting back, enjoy listening to good music (of many kinds), not analysing,not picking things to pieces, not breaking things down (I leave that to the talented people/musicians amongst us). Oh and I think I better add that my name isn't Annie, it's Stu lol. I better change my Username!Apologies Stu, I just went on the first name in the icon. |
ludwigs 27.12.2014 17:08 |
Oscar J wrote:Ha ha.ludwigs wrote:I didn't mean anything by that, was just referring to una999's comment, which seemed to suggest that Mozart was the most technically accomplished pianist ever. Wait, are you comparing Liszt to a dragster? :-)Oscar J wrote: Liszt was way faster than Mozart.And a dragster is faster than an E-type jag but..... Which holds more of an emotive preference? Liszt has a mammoth wealth of technically and fast works.... |
ludwigs 27.12.2014 17:09 |
musicland munich wrote: @ Ludwigs....great post(s)...Many thanks munich (sic) |
Band Forever 27.12.2014 19:15 |
Hammer to Fall 2nd Wembley Show, This Solo was amazing assisted by Spike Edney. Brighton Rock was a bit tired after so many years. I would have preferred BM trying something else It's Late or Father to Son. |
RafaelS 27.12.2014 20:35 |
Loads of rubbish that Brian is an average guitarist. A thing though is that in the last 10 years he lost a lots of his skills... But I think that John Deacon is a better bassist that Brian is a guitarist. |
fras444 27.12.2014 23:21 |
John deacon played Spanish guitar also on who needs you and is debated who actually gets the credit for that. .. John deacon could have pulled off an amazing job. Esp him being a finger bassist and those flamenco parts really needs some good finger string coordination. Would have been awesome to have witnessed John perform on the classical guitar |
dudeofqueen 27.12.2014 23:45 |
As with a number of people here, I've been a Brian May fan for 30+ years. I absolutely love his early love playing and The Rainbow release really did a cracking job of showcasing ho hard he could rock. The issue I have is that Queen set lists have always been so incredibly formulated that there has been little if any chance for Brian to step outside of the expected. His reliance on the Brighton Rock solo is, frankly, laughable - what better time to head for the urinals when he launches into that? Surely someone of his talent could come up with something a little different after all this time....... If he took a few risks onstage (and these days, that's incredibly unlikely.....) perhaps we might see him step out, but my take is that he's afraid of making any mistakes. |
The Real Wizard 28.12.2014 00:02 |
Story here: link If a tape of this show would come out, I bet we'd learn a lot about Brian May. |
Sebastian 28.12.2014 02:38 |
link According to that, there are about 84 million people in the world who play guitar beyond just basic chords. Even if a million of them were actually technically better than Brian (which I very much doubt but let's go with that), then he's still be technically more accomplished than 98.81% of the guitarists in the world. That means he's much much much much much better than 'average,' and if we factor in the hundreds of millions who only play a few chords (and are therefore much less proficient than Brian), then he's even higher up in the 'elite.' Now, John played Spanish guitar on 'Who Needs You' but not Spanish 'lead' guitar. Brian did the solos. Seeing John on classical guitar would've been nice but not particularly breath-taking, as far as it's been documented he only played a bit and was good enough to pull off a fireplace rendition of 'Classical Gas,' which is something he shares with hundreds of thousands of amateur guitarists (and, nowadays, YouTube guitarists). I think, and hopefully time will prove me either right or wrong, if there's a tape of that Joe Perry incident, all it'll teach us is what we already know: that people exaggerate in their recollections, and that Brian's memory's far from perfect. Not in the sense of not being able to play a concert from memory, but in the sense of not remembering the incident accurately. |
miraclesteinway 28.12.2014 03:07 |
It comes back to the old thing that being a musician is far more than having a good technique, and some of the best musicians have been technically sloppy, even at the top level. Nureyev was a technically less than perfect dancer, but he was meticulous too, a bit like Brian. Freddie was a less than technically perfect singer or pianist, but he had unbelievable energy and panache with it, Horowitz was a less than technically perfect pianist, but he knew how to connect with the music he was playing. There are many great techniques out there that are frankly boring or lack some greater knowledge. Perhaps within the confines of the Queen show, Brian felt he didn't need to take so many risks. Besides in some of the middle period show, Freddie took some risks didn't he? With the vocal improvisations in Prophet's song for instance, at Earl's Court, and he was such a ball of light on stage that perhaps Brian felt his job was to keep things more grounded so the show actually functioned. I don't know that's the case, I'm just speculating. |
Vocal harmony 28.12.2014 06:30 |
^^^ good points, but within the frame work that BM played/plays he wasn't that well rehearsed and often made repeated mistakes over the years. As an aside to this, BM on his website today is asking what they should play at the New year gig. So I'm guessing they have allowed one day to rehearse a show that's going to be viewable by millions, the chance for mistakes is a lot higher than the chance of a well played show, As for Freddie's improvisation during Prophet's song. It was more rehearsed than you'd think. John Harris had to switch in the delays as and when needed, in order to get that right they would have had to spend time on it. |
Holly2003 28.12.2014 10:15 |
I think some forget that improv in live shows isn't necessarily a sign of skill. It could be ego, for example. And as someone who once tried to listen to a Grateful Dead concert, I can testify improv is often boring and unlistenable. Queen put on a show for the audience that was there that night, not for people who would be listening to bootlegs decades later. For each concert audience, the performance was "new" every night (with exceptions being those people who went to multiple shows) so radically changing a setlist or doing improv was really an unnecessary luxury for a professional touring band. But of course they did do it on occasion: Fred and Brian especially. And of course there are bands/musicians who have a different approach, and change things a lot. I don't think that many guitar solos are improvised on the spot anyway: a guitarist will usually have tried all those licks beforehand. I'll bet the different way Brian plays the Crazy Little Thing solo didn't come to him in a moment of inspiration onstage, for example. |
cmsdrums 28.12.2014 16:24 |
Vocal harmony wrote: As an aside to this, BM on his website today is asking what they should play at the New year gig. So I'm guessing they have allowed one day to rehearse a show that's going to be viewable by millions, the chance for mistakes is a lot higher than the chance of a well played show, .Call me cynical, but I would suggest that whatever anyone responds with regarding song suggestions for NYE or the upcoming tour, will have absolutely NO impact whatsoever on what is actually played! The set will already be settled on. Same goes for the past however many years that QOL has openly asked for fans' suggestions as to what should be considered for release; all simply marketing ploys I'm afraid :-) |
Fireplace 28.12.2014 17:26 |
It's a sad state of affairs these days. Freddie's dead, Brian sucks, John is a retired recluse and Roger is old, senile and totally out of shape. And Live at the Rainbow sounds too good. Thank God we have the amazing talents of people like Greg Brooks, Anton and WK Mahler to maintain our faith in music. They are the real reason we come here, not that lousy stinkin' ol' band called Queen. Brian is indeed the most boring guitarist ever, it's incredible how songs like Who Needs You, It's Late, Dead On Time, Cool Cat, Keep Good Company and Brighton Rock all sound exactly the same. Thanks for pointing that out to me. Perhaps we should consider giving Brian an award for being the most succesful absolutely lousy guitar player ever. |
Vocal harmony 28.12.2014 17:50 |
BM is one of, if not the, most amazingly original guitar player there is. Without his input Queen just wouldn't have been has unique as they were. That side of him is different to BM the live guitarist, who is often under rehearsed and too easily distracted. fact! |
Vocal harmony 28.12.2014 17:58 |
cmsdrums wrote:[/ Call me cynical, but I would suggest that whatever anyone responds with regarding song suggestions for NYE or the upcoming tour, will have absolutely NO impact whatsoever on what is actually played! The set will already be settled on. Same goes for the past however many years that QOL has openly asked for fans' suggestions as to what should be considered for release; all simply marketing ploys I'm afraid :-)You could be right, and i'd be surprised if the set for New years eve hasn't been sorted. But in 2012 they asked for set list suggestions and ended up including KYSA, SSOR, WWRY fast and DSMN all of which may have well been asked for by fans and after two tours with PR seemed to be songs that had been forgotten |
tomchristie22 29.12.2014 00:28 |
I think it'd be a bit much to hope that they'd add songs by request a few days before the concert. Perhaps they'd consider those suggestions which they'd already rehearsed at some point, but things like It's Late (which a few people asked for) don't seem likely to happen. |
Sebastian 29.12.2014 01:55 |
It could be as simple as some marketing strategy: asking people what they'd like to hear hoping some of the requests will coincide with what they've already rehearsed, and then make feel people like they had something to do with that choice. |
BETA215 29.12.2014 02:15 |
^ Bingo. |
cmsdrums 29.12.2014 02:19 |
Vocal harmony wrote:Roger has already said in interviews that he was listening heavily to the Rainbow gigs pre-release when rehearsing the U.S. tour, and he then suggested they do those early tracks as it brought back their heavy rock roots. Stone Cold Crazy, Keep Yourself Alive and Now I'm Here were all added based on his suggestions I'm afraid, not ours!cmsdrums wrote:[/ Call me cynical, but I would suggest that whatever anyone responds with regarding song suggestions for NYE or the upcoming tour, will have absolutely NO impact whatsoever on what is actually played! The set will already be settled on. Same goes for the past however many years that QOL has openly asked for fans' suggestions as to what should be considered for release; all simply marketing ploys I'm afraid :-)You could be right, and i'd be surprised if the set for New years eve hasn't been sorted. But in 2012 they asked for set list suggestions and ended up including KYSA, SSOR, WWRY fast and DSMN all of which may have well been asked for by fans and after two tours with PR seemed to be songs that had been forgotten |
Oscar J 29.12.2014 04:15 |
Listening heavily? I though he put it on in his car. |
The Real Wizard 29.12.2014 11:06 |
Sebastian wrote: It could be as simple as some marketing strategy: asking people what they'd like to hear hoping some of the requests will coincide with what they've already rehearsed, and then make feel people like they had something to do with that choice.Same strategy as Freddie used every night on the ADATR tour before Brighton Rock. |
Sebastian 29.12.2014 13:31 |
And possibly quite a few artists when they do 'Live by Request' gigs or specials. |
The King Of Rhye 29.12.2014 17:05 |
The Real Wizard wrote:Haha........yeah, I've heard that on a few bootlegs......someone always yells out for Liar.......;)Sebastian wrote: It could be as simple as some marketing strategy: asking people what they'd like to hear hoping some of the requests will coincide with what they've already rehearsed, and then make feel people like they had something to do with that choice.Same strategy as Freddie used every night on the ADATR tour before Brighton Rock. |
The King Of Rhye 29.12.2014 17:11 |
Returning to the original topic for a moment...... I dont remember where I read it, but I liked the story of Steve Howe somehow ending up crossing paths with a small group of Queen fans........someone recognized him and they all came over saying stuff like "hey youre Steve Howe, youre on Innuendo!" (not, you're Steve Howe from Yes....lol) |
Sebastian 30.12.2014 13:22 |
The story comes from his official website, he used to have a Q&A there... maybe he still does? I don't know... Anyway, it makes sense: he was on a ferry going to Rotterdam and there were Queen fans going to a Queen event there. In their eyes, his reputation as the 'Innuendo' guitar co-soloist probably precedes his reputation as Yes axeman, the same way Bowie fans may first associate Queen with 'Under Pressure' rather than, say, 'Bo Rhap' or 'Rock You'. |
Sebastian 16.07.2017 17:38 |
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Another Roger (re) 17.07.2017 12:18 |
Loads of crap to be read in this thread. Brian isnt the fastest guitarplayer in world. But luckily music is a lot more than a speed competition. Brian May's sound, musical intelligence, taste, patience, perfectionism and ability to compose makes him the best guitar player ever for me. |
Dr Magus 18.07.2017 07:05 |
^bingo^ |
mike hunt 18.07.2017 13:01 |
Who was putting Brian May down? I havn't seen anyone in this thread saying anything negative. Brian is one of the greats, though he doesn't get mentioned enough when discussing best guitarist by music fans. Anyone who knows his early stuff (not only the hits) Queen to Jazz understands his greatness, especially Queen2 to ADATR. I don't care about shredding all that much. Usually I tell people he's in the top 20 of the best rock guitarist. I don't get arguments on that, but if I said top 5 I admit people say no way. |
Sebastian 18.07.2017 15:02 |
He'd also admit there's no way. It obviously depends on which criteria you're using (and no, it's not just shredding). Brian's an extraordinary all-round musician. Purely as a guitarist (not counting his songwriting, singing, piano-playing, bass-playing, producing, arranging, animal activism, astrophysics or stereo photography) he's also magnificent (May-estic) but there are better ones and he'd be the first to admit so. Then again, to be fair, most of 'Innuendo' was him. Steve only did the chromatic run and a few ornaments here and there, but everything else (including the main part of the solo, and its octave doubling, and its parallel thirds) was recorded by Brian. Not just the distorted electric bits, but the Spanish nylon ones as well. |
mike hunt 18.07.2017 15:31 |
Yea, I'm not talking about composing or anything else. Just as a guitarist, I think top 25 is fair. He had a style and sound that only he could create. Not many players could achieve that. I also say no way on the top 5. Players like Page, Clapton, Eddie Van Halen made generations of players pick up the guitar for the first time. May did have an Influence, but not on that level. Of course popularity isn't everything, Slash is way more popular than May, but I think May was the better player and influenced more big time guitarists. |
Holly2003 19.07.2017 14:29 |
That youtube video in which one guitarist plays an excerpt from every Queen song gives a good indication of how versatile and interesting Brian was across the range of his career. And if you want one song which shows his incredible ability to compose multi-layered and harmonising guitar parts then listen to (the amazing) Good Company. However, he is not a virtuoso like Yngwe or Vai, he can't shred like Eddie, and he can't do more expressive stuff like this: link As a solo artist he never really reached any great heights. In contrast, check out this from one of Jeff Beck's solo albums: link |
mike hunt 19.07.2017 17:25 |
Agreed Holly! But guys like Vai, yngwe, Eddie, Beck are top 15 players. I think Brian deserves too be in that next level of greats, once you get past those top 15 or 20 guys. Then we start talking about the May and Iommi's of the world. |