QueenZone discussion #1398505
piano sound on march show
| bootLuca 12.09.2014 10:44 |
I'm sure you already have noticed the piano on march show that sounds like a toy this sound is different from the concert of November but also from the reel to reel tape of the march show I think it's perfect for song like The Fairy Feller's Master Stroke but it's not so great for songs like White Queen I guess is not an acoustic piano, does anyone have information about what kind of keyboard could be? |
| Oscar J 12.09.2014 10:54 |
Pretty sure it's a acoustic piano, just not miked up well. |
| bootLuca 12.09.2014 11:02 |
I'm not convinced, it sounds a bit "detuned"... |
| bootLuca 12.09.2014 11:51 |
Could someone transcribe what Brian said introducing The Fairy Feller's? I don't understand the word after "jungle" perhaps there's a clue on what instrument Freddie is going to play... |
| BETA215 12.09.2014 13:08 |
That isn't Jungle Ball. Even that isn't junglebell. Fucking bad Brian's pronunciation. He said something like Jungleb---. Junglebong, jungleboun, that remembers me to The Jungle Book. But nothing like an instrument. Weird thing. Maybe that was Brian calling the piano junglebong, joking with young Fred over there. Maybe if QPL had that lost 30 m. 16mm film, we can see S&D, White Queen, Great King Rat, this Fairy song, KYA, SSOR and MTR 'n' R in video, and judge if they were joking and what instrument was. And you, collector which have that songs in video, if you, are reading this, or if not, please, sell that tape that will make you rich, to Queen Productions Ltd. Do you read correctly. Yes. Queen Productions Ltd. Think about it. It will make you rich. |
| Oscar J 12.09.2014 14:11 |
He said jangle box, referring to the piano. I remember them calling the upright piano in Killer Queen a "jangle piano". |
| Doga 12.09.2014 14:30 |
BETA215 wrote: And you, collector which have that songs in video, if you, are reading this, or if not, please, sell that tape that will make you rich, to Queen Productions Ltd. Do you read correctly. Yes. Queen Productions Ltd. Think about it. It will make you rich.Ha! That's made me smile. I don't want to sound negative, but most probably the discarded footage of the March show of Rainbow is in the same place of the discarded footage of Montreal and Budapest. |
| The Real Wizard 12.09.2014 14:46 |
Doga wrote:That's definitely not true. The Hungarian government discarded the footage. They offered it to QP in the early 90s, but they were busy grieving and working on Made In Heaven. You can be pretty sure the very last thing they were interested in was footage of a concert.BETA215 wrote: And you, collector which have that songs in video, if you, are reading this, or if not, please, sell that tape that will make you rich, to Queen Productions Ltd. Do you read correctly. Yes. Queen Productions Ltd. Think about it. It will make you rich.Ha! That's made me smile. I don't want to sound negative, but most probably the discarded footage of the March show of Rainbow is in the same place of the discarded footage of Montreal and Budapest. |
| Doga 12.09.2014 15:34 |
The Real Wizard wrote:That's was my point, for one reason or another the outtakes of Budapest and Montreal were destroyed. There are a lot of posibilities the same happened with the footage of the march show if the band don't have it in their archives.Doga wrote:That's definitely not true. The Hungarian government discarded the footage. They offered it to QP in the early 90s, but they were busy grieving and working on Made In Heaven. You can be pretty sure the very last thing they were interested in was footage of a concert.BETA215 wrote: And you, collector which have that songs in video, if you, are reading this, or if not, please, sell that tape that will make you rich, to Queen Productions Ltd. Do you read correctly. Yes. Queen Productions Ltd. Think about it. It will make you rich.Ha! That's made me smile. I don't want to sound negative, but most probably the discarded footage of the March show of Rainbow is in the same place of the discarded footage of Montreal and Budapest. Hope i'm wrong, of course, and the remaining footage could see the light of day one day. That would be something isn't it? An early Queen concert filmed in 16 mm and with songs like Fairy Feller and Great King Rat! |
| bootLuca 12.09.2014 16:02 |
is this a picture of Freddie playing a "Junglebong"? :-) I never seen this photo before and it was taken on march 22 in Canvey Island, nine days before the concert at the Rainbow, maybe the Rainbow venue provided to Freddie the same kind of piano? Wurlitzer seems to be the name of that instrument taken from queenlive.ca... thanks Bob! |
| Oscar J 12.09.2014 17:42 |
A Wurlitzer sounds NOTHING like a piano. If you want to hear how it sounds, listen to the intro of YMBF. It's the early 70's man, there was nothing electric that sounded even remotely close to a real piano. Freddie used a real piano and nothing else at Live At The Rainbow. And Brian still said "Janglebox" which was a loose reference to the Jangle piano which was used in the recording of Killer Queen. link |
| bootLuca 12.09.2014 23:15 |
Oscar J wrote: A Wurlitzer sounds NOTHING like a piano. If you want to hear how it sounds, listen to the intro of YMBF. It's the early 70's man, there was nothing electric that sounded even remotely close to a real piano. Freddie used a real piano and nothing else at Live At The Rainbow. And Brian still said "Janglebox" which was a loose reference to the Jangle piano which was used in the recording of Killer Queen. linkI don't know how a Wurlitzer sounds The Wurlitzer was just an example to say that at that time Freddie used to play what the venue gave him, anyway on november show the piano sounds like a piano, but on march show it sounds like a toy. what the sense of introducing TFFMS referring to another song? and above all I do not know how Brian could refer to a song that will be recorded only 4 months later... |
| Bad Seed 13.09.2014 03:14 |
A friend of mine went to the Sunderland show on the 8th March, he said that the piano was indeed an upright at that show. |
| Oscar J 13.09.2014 03:33 |
That explains it. So was the piano used in KQ ( but with coustomized hammers). And you do know how a Wurlitzer sounds, if you've ever heard YMBF, as I said before. |
| Oscar J 13.09.2014 03:33 |
That explains it. So was the piano used in KQ ( but with coustomized hammers). And you do know how a Wurlitzer sounds, if you've ever heard YMBF, as I said before. |
| bootLuca 13.09.2014 04:14 |
as seen in the picture above, on 22nd march Freddie doesn't play a piano, do you know for sure what he played on 31st March? all I can say is that Freddie had played an instrument that doesn't sound exactly like a piano, it could be a piano but it could also be something else if you have proof to support what you say show it! |
| Oscar J 13.09.2014 04:37 |
You're being ridiculous. 1. Bad Seed just stated above that Freddie used an upright piano. 2. As I said: In the early 70's, there was nothing electric that sounded even remotely close to a real piano. So it must have been a real piano. If it's an upright piano like stated above, that'd explain the slighty twangy quality of the sound. So yeah. |
| Oscar J 13.09.2014 04:39 |
it's strange though, this pic is according to Bob's website from the March concert, and shows, by the looks of it, a full grand piano and not an upright. link |
| bootLuca 13.09.2014 04:55 |
Oscar J wrote: You're being ridiculous. 1. Bad Seed just stated above that Freddie used an upright piano.Bad Seed stated that Freddie used un upright piano on 8th march 1974, not on 31st march on 22nd march of the same tour Freddie used an Wurlitzer |
| bootLuca 13.09.2014 04:58 |
Oscar J wrote: it's strange though, this pic is according to Bob's website from the March concert, and shows, by the looks of it, a full grand piano and not an upright. linkfull grand piano or not, if this picture was taken 31st march, this is the proof that Freddie used an acoustic piano (that sounds like a toy :P ) that night, great discovery thank you! |
| master marathon runner 13.09.2014 09:27 |
I guarantee you, the stage a Sunderland locarno could hardly have accommodated a grand piano with band. |
| BETA215 13.09.2014 09:35 |
^ But being Queen, that incredible new "fashionated" band, why don't be nice to attract the band and have more money 'cause of the audience? Even, they are going to record the entire concert! Why not? |
| MercurialFreddie 17.09.2014 09:35 |
I've made two snapshots of the march footage (bonus material on the very recent Rainbow release). As seen here, there was grand piano that day on stage. |
| MercurialFreddie 17.09.2014 09:35 |
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| Vocal harmony 17.09.2014 09:59 |
What has to be remembered is that a Grand Piano is difficult to mic up, particularly for live work. Also capturing the sound on tape is not easy. This show very early in their career and I'm sure there would have been limitations on what could be spent. From about 77 onwards the very expensive and high quality Helpenstil piano pickup was fitted to Piano. This device is like a guitar pickup, only bigger, and fitted to the sound board. It is designed to produce a clear piano sound. Before this system was used, they put two mics under the piano lid, which did the job but not as well. Discrepancies in what the mics pick up and the recording process are what has resulted in the "toy piano" sound, which actually doesn't sound that bad |
| Oscar J 17.09.2014 11:00 |
Thanks for explaining. I said it probably was the miking, but they didn't believe me! I like the early piano sound, it sounds vintage. |
| thomasquinn 32989 18.09.2014 01:20 |
bootLuca wrote: all I can say is that Freddie had played an instrument that doesn't sound exactly like a piano, it could be a piano but it could also be something elseNo, it couldn't have been something else, because there was nothing else available at the time that sounded remotely like a piano. When there is nothing available that sounds like a piano and you hear a piano, even if the sound is a little odd, it has to be a piano. When you say it wasn't a piano, the question is what else could it have been then? The answer is "nothing, it was a piano". |
| bootLuca 18.09.2014 05:07 |
all doubts are resolved now, you're right! that night Freddie played a grand piano however I think that my doubts were well supported: in that tour Freddie used to play what the venue gave to him march 8th in Sunderland he played an Upright Piano march 22nd at Canvey Island's Civic Hall he played a Wurlitzer march 31st at the Rainbow Theatre: Grand Piano |
| bootLuca 18.09.2014 05:23 |
You will hate me! How do you explain that in the Reel to Reel tape transfer of the march show, the grand piano sounds better than the official release? (in my humble opinion) Could QP have made a better equalization on the official release? |
| Oscar J 18.09.2014 11:56 |
I would be fairly surprised if he actually used that barky Wurlitzer instead of a piano to be honest. Wouldn't really work with songs like White Queen, MOTBQ or FOTW. |
| dysan 19.09.2014 04:51 |
Great thread. Usually in those s part of the live contract between artist and venue included, as necessary, something along the lines of 'The venue / promoter shall provide a grand piano or suitable alternative for the concert'. I'm sure that some places would have been content to use a little toy organ as used by Ron Mael from Sparks at that time. Was it a Vox continental? Dunno. |
| Vocal harmony 19.09.2014 10:38 |
dysan wrote: Great thread. Usually in those s part of the live contract between artist and venue included, as necessary, something along the lines of 'The venue / promoter shall provide a grand piano or suitable alternative for the concert'. I'm sure that some places would have been content to use a little toy organ as used by Ron Mael from Sparks at that time. Was it a Vox continental? Dunno.Yup that's exactly how it is when you're touring on a tight budget. By the A Night At The Opera tour they were renting a Bechstein grand to tour with. By the end of the following year FM had bought a Steinway D9 concert grand which was used on every tour from then on |
| Sebastian 19.09.2014 15:25 |
Oscar J wrote: I would be fairly surprised if he actually used that barky Wurlitzer instead of a piano to be honest. Wouldn't really work with songs like White Queen, MOTBQ or FOTW.White Queen: Wouldn't be the same as other versions, but if there was no other choice I think he would play it. Black Queen: Wasn't part of the live set then. Flick of the Wrist: Didn't exist yet. Vocal harmony wrote: By the A Night At The Opera tour they were renting a Bechstein grand to tour with.No, they weren't. Out of the 77 concerts of that tour, only 1 was with the Bechstein white piano. The remaining 76 gigs (98.70% of the tour) featured different pianos depending on the venue. |
| Oscar J 19.09.2014 15:56 |
Damn, forgot about that. |
| BETA215 24.09.2014 23:43 |
The Fairy Feller's Master Stroke: Here you have the song with the piano boosted and almost without main vocals (you can hear only the echo) and some part of the harmonies (listen to Brian!): PS: Lossy file. |
| winterspelt 24.09.2014 23:58 |
It sounds as if the mic is placed far from the piano but near the bass strings above the lid or down even the piano... I would blame the mics and the mic placement, even if they used the same piano and mics in the same venue, a misplaced mic will always get a different sound. Specially considering the technology from 1974! |
| Rick 25.09.2014 06:25 |
Same with Roger's cowbell. It sounds much better on the November show. |
