| M-train 11.10.2013 13:12 |
I don't think I have ever heard any song that has the operatic theme like Bo Rap. Has anyone heard anything from a different group that is comparable? |
| dave76 11.10.2013 13:26 |
a song that has some similarity like bo rhap for me is music by john miles. it's been divided into different sections. |
| August R. 11.10.2013 16:24 |
In the late 60's and early/mid 70's there were quite a few UK rock bands that were flirting with classical music. I don't know how it got started (maybe with The Beatles and George Martin's quasi-classical string arrangements?) but as early as 1967 we got Procol Harum's big hit A Whiter Shade of Pale with a strong Bach influence. Later in the same year The Moody Blues released their Days of Future Passed album that was recorded with full symphony orchestra. In 1969 King Crimson released their In The Court Of The Crimson King LP which truly marked the birth of progressive rock. Prog rock flourished in the early/mid 70's and a big part of this was combining classical elements with rock music. Lots of bands were doing this: Renaissance, Barclay James Harvest, Yes, Electric Light Orchestra to name just a few. So, to answer the question, NO, i don't think there are any song like Bohemian Rhapsody, BUT BoRhap was definitely part of the genre that was established long before Queen had done anything. They just pushed it a little further, and dared to put it out as a lead single...and the rest is history. :) |
| The Fairy King 11.10.2013 18:54 |
Radiohead - Paranoid Android? |
| Sebastian 11.10.2013 20:57 |
There hasn't been any song like it before or since. But the same can be said about nearly every good song ever. |
| brENsKi 12.10.2013 09:44 |
excellent post ^^^ this is spot on. there were dozens of groundbreakers in the 60s/early70s - which helped and inspired Queen, when i say "helped" i mean they took risks - which made taking further risk/pushing the limits more accessible. as for "inspired" - queen made no secret of who inspired them. for me: albums like - revolver, ogdens nut gone flake, abbey road, court of the crimson king, meddle, led zep I & II, hawkwind's first lp, badfinger - no matter what, deep purple - in rock, traffic - john barleycorn must die and Yes - the yes album and fragile - made it very easy for Queen's "experimental generation" - which included newer bands like Genesis to try new things. in fairness, Queen's pushing the boundaries made it easier for the newer bands coming along - like Kansas, Styx, magnum, lone star, journey, leppard and maiden |
| ewill_rocky 12.10.2013 12:05 |
Extreme - Everything Under The Sun It's section with three songs - Rise'n Shine, Am I Ever Gonna Change and Who Cares?. It was released on album Three Sides To Every Story. It's epic music... link - link Let's Get Drung And Be Somebody link |
| brENsKi 12.10.2013 12:18 |
if you're just looking for songs with three (or more) distinctive parts there are better examples than Extreme Wings - Band on The Run ELO - Mr Blue Sky 10cc - I'm Mandy (fly me) Eagles - The Last Resort Genesis - The Musical Box Led Zep - In The Light and several Meatloaf songs |
| Sebastian 12.10.2013 17:18 |
Beach Boys had GV, Beatles had ADitL. The reason why Bo Rhap was even suggested as a single to begin with is that it had commercial potential, both because its melody and powerful harmonies, and because a lot of hit singles in 1975 Britain had loads of backing vocals (all of the No 1 tracks except for one). It wasn't the most obvious hit, but it wasn't 'that' strange and risky either... of course, they like to tell the story that nobody wanted it as a single and all that because it sounds more impressive and generates more sympathy and admiration. That's showbiz, after all. |
| k-m 12.10.2013 20:01 |
More sympathy? Are you serious? Freddie stood out as a person NEVER looking for sympathy, even during the time of his terrible illness. I think you underestimate him here. Other bands, like the Beatles might have tried classical arrangements, but no-one pushed it so far and as bravely as them. Paranoid Android is the closest thing that comes to my mind, but it happened years after the Queen single. |
| Sebastian 12.10.2013 21:41 |
Sympathy's not just feeling bad for a person with a terminal illness. It's also things like 'woahhhh they had to fight everyone in the music business to get it released!', as opposed to 'yeah, they released it and the record company approved it.' This, again, is showbiz, people like heroic Messianic stories of death and resurrection, of people opposing it, of the song being rescued from the deadly realms of not even being album filler to a triumphal beatification as a masterpiece of unparalleled proportions. People dig that shit, and that's why the same story's been told to death about songs, films, etc. The Eagles say the same about Hotel California ... nobody wanted it as a single except for Henley, the label deemed it too long, they wanted them to edit it, but they were firm and then they had the last laugh. Livin' on a Prayer was almost discarded (or was it YGLABN?), Yesterday was a leftover from earlier years with a reworked title and new lyrics... granted, some parts of some of those stories are more likely true, but they've been edited and carefully rehearsed to fit the rule of cool and make them sound more impressive. That doesn't make Bo Rhap or any of those songs any less of a masterpiece, but they're masterpieces for what they really are, not for what PR (and I don't mean Paul Rodgers) make them appear to be for a gullible public. |
| brENsKi 13.10.2013 03:38 |
k-m wrote: Other bands, like the Beatles might have tried classical arrangements, but no-one pushed it so far and as bravely as them. Paranoid Android is the closest thing that comes to my mind, but it happened years after the Queen single.and what about Deep Purple's "concerto for group and orchestra" ???? does that not push the classical arrangement thing enough for you? or do you conveniently forget that BECAUSE it predates Bo Rhap by FIVE years and kinda makes your argument void? Purple dabbled in and out of bach and beethoven loads...but YOu also ignore that. the Toys - A Lover's Concerto - top5 hit 1965!!!! was a Bach minuet the beatles - eleanor rigby carole king - tapestry the move - night of fear the nice - america and if you want to really think about this properly...Manfred Mann's Earthband released a whole album of classical influenced/arranged music "solar fire" in 1973 - two years BEFORE Bo Rhap....with a single "Joybringer" reaching the UK top 10... and how about John Mile's "Music"...just a couple of months AFTER Bo Rhap - a huge hit ...and much more classically arranged than Bo Rhap same applies to eric carmen - all by myself (one of the most world-wide known songs of all time) is a Rachmaninov arrangement - yes that SAME Rachmaninov that Freddie loved so much!!! |
| dysan 13.10.2013 04:24 |
Sparks stuck out a couple of hit singles that could've layed the groundwork for BR - This Town Ain't Big Enough and Get In The Swing. I agree with the posts above that Queen certainly weren't the first, but certainly the best at the over the top. |
| brENsKi 13.10.2013 04:35 |
..and let's not forget Focus...who brought classical arrangements and symphonic rock to the masses for 5 consecutive albums and two UK/USA/Europe hit singles BEFORE Bo/Rhap/ANATO was released. Moving Waves & Focus 3 are excellent albums which some of the "queen pushed the boundaries first" brigade, would do well to listen to |
| Sebastian 13.10.2013 06:23 |
Jaws was the first blockbuster IIRC. But it doesn't mean it was the first film. Eagles' GH was the first platinum album IIRC, but it doesn't mean it was the first album ever. Bo Rhap was the first (and possibly only) No 1 hit single to feature a ballad section, an opera section and a rock section, but it doesn't mean, at all, that it was the first piece combining (or in this case, alternating) popular and art music. Not even the first Queen piece to do so. Same with the whole video thing... |
| splicksplack 13.10.2013 08:25 |
Not quite the same thing but I always says saw similarities in the video if not the song of... 1. I Don't Like Mondays by the Boomtown Rats. The 'tell me why' choral backing vocal bits always sounded like a nod to the BR middle section. And in the video they arranged themselves in the same diamond shape as the operatic bit in BR. 2. Country House by Blur. Not only the same diamond formation but also using the kalaidoscope camera effect on the middle choral-like "Blow, blow me out, I am so sad, I don't know why" |
| Sheer Brass Neck 13.10.2013 09:47 |
Regardless of what pre-dated BR, the lot of them combined had less impact than BR, at the time and historically. Not that polls mean anything but pretty sure few of the examples listed would be in the top 1000 songs of all times. BR is the top or near the top in multiple territories nearly 40 years after its release. It wasn't just the structure, the execution was amazing and unlike anything the overwhelming majority of the public had heard. Maybe that's why they were so adamant that it had to be released as a single? Otherwise it be like Good Company: amazing, groundbreaking but ultimately obscure to all but die hard fans. |
| pittrek 13.10.2013 11:28 |
What about Manowar's Achilles - Agony & Ecstasy in 8 parts? Amazing song |
| brENsKi 13.10.2013 12:23 |
Sheer Brass Neck wrote: Regardless of what pre-dated BR, the lot of them combined had less impact than BR, at the time and historically. Not that polls mean anything but pretty sure few of the examples listed would be in the top 1000 songs of all times. .but NONE of that ^^^ is what the OP was asking. which makes the "examples" you dismiss even more important. the OP was stating an unawareness of anything BEFORE Bo Rhap that touched on the territory |
| k-m 13.10.2013 13:26 |
brENsKi wrote:No need to get excited there. I thought the OP asked specifically about an "operatic theme", not just a classical arrangement. Regardless, I still cannot recall a well-known song before Rhapsody which would borrow from opera so extensively. Won't argue about the Deep Purple concerto, as I never listened to it and have no intention to.k-m wrote: Other bands, like the Beatles might have tried classical arrangements, but no-one pushed it so far and as bravely as them. Paranoid Android is the closest thing that comes to my mind, but it happened years after the Queen single.and what about Deep Purple's "concerto for group and orchestra" ???? does that not push the classical arrangement thing enough for you? or do you conveniently forget that BECAUSE it predates Bo Rhap by FIVE years and kinda makes your argument void? Purple dabbled in and out of bach and beethoven loads...but YOu also ignore that. the Toys - A Lover's Concerto - top5 hit 1965!!!! was a Bach minuet the beatles - eleanor rigby carole king - tapestry the move - night of fear the nice - america and if you want to really think about this properly...Manfred Mann's Earthband released a whole album of classical influenced/arranged music "solar fire" in 1973 - two years BEFORE Bo Rhap....with a single "Joybringer" reaching the UK top 10... and how about John Mile's "Music"...just a couple of months AFTER Bo Rhap - a huge hit ...and much more classically arranged than Bo Rhap same applies to eric carmen - all by myself (one of the most world-wide known songs of all time) is a Rachmaninov arrangement - yes that SAME Rachmaninov that Freddie loved so much!!! |
| GuitarMay 13.10.2013 13:43 |
Really, maybe in the originallity and audacity in write, compose, make clip video, chorus, this music in global planet earth is unique and ain't don't create nothing something like this ! |
| brENsKi 13.10.2013 15:17 |
k-m wrote:firstly, i wasn't getting excited.brENsKi wrote:No need to get excited there. I thought the OP asked specifically about an "operatic theme", not just a classical arrangement. Regardless, I still cannot recall a well-known song before Rhapsody which would borrow from opera so extensively. Won't argue about the Deep Purple concerto, as I never listened to it and have no intention to.k-m wrote: Other bands, like the Beatles might have tried classical arrangements, but no-one pushed it so far and as bravely as them. Paranoid Android is the closest thing that comes to my mind, but it happened years after the Queen single.and what about Deep Purple's "concerto for group and orchestra" ???? does that not push the classical arrangement thing enough for you? or do you conveniently forget that BECAUSE it predates Bo Rhap by FIVE years and kinda makes your argument void? Purple dabbled in and out of bach and beethoven loads...but YOu also ignore that. the Toys - A Lover's Concerto - top5 hit 1965!!!! was a Bach minuet the beatles - eleanor rigby carole king - tapestry the move - night of fear the nice - america and if you want to really think about this properly...Manfred Mann's Earthband released a whole album of classical influenced/arranged music "solar fire" in 1973 - two years BEFORE Bo Rhap....with a single "Joybringer" reaching the UK top 10... secondly, it was YOUR reference to classical arrangements (see above) - that i was replying to, and my points were accurate. thirdly, your last statement says more about you than anything else. you love Bo Rhap for the same reason that you have "no intention of listening to" Purple's "concerto" ...stunning |
| AlbaNo1 13.10.2013 15:34 |
Id have thought Stairway to Heaven would have been an influence too, in terms of having three sections ,a ballady start culminating in a hard rock finale. |
| Sebastian 13.10.2013 15:46 |
Sheer Brass Neck wrote: Regardless of what pre-dated BR, the lot of them combined had less impact than BR.Nobody's debating that. Bo Rhap is a masterpiece and all that, but it's not the only masterpiece and it's not the first song to be 'different'. Russia's the world's largest country, but that doesn't mean Russia's the whole world; the femur's the human body's largest bone, but that doesn't mean it's the only bone, nor it means the whole human body's just the femur. Sheer Brass Neck wrote: Not that polls mean anything but pretty sure few of the examples listed would be in the top 1000 songs of all times.Those polls are usually made by and for ignorant tossers anyway. Sheer Brass Neck wrote: It wasn't just the structure, the execution was amazing and unlike anything the overwhelming majority of the public had heard.Yes but the same can be said about nearly every good song ever. Russia's the world's largest country, but that doesn't mean Russia's the whole world; the femur's the human body's largest bone, but that doesn't mean it's the only bone, nor it means the whole human body's just the femur. Sheer Brass Neck wrote: Maybe that's why they were so adamant that it had to be released as a single?They released it as a single because it had hit potential, simple as that. Sheer Brass Neck wrote: Otherwise it be like Good Company: amazing, groundbreaking but ultimately obscure to all but die hard fans.Millions of people bought the album so they heard the song at least once. And not all of them were die-hard fans. |
| Sheer Brass Neck 13.10.2013 19:11 |
Sebastian wrote:What's with the Russia fetish :)Sheer Brass Neck wrote: Regardless of what pre-dated BR, the lot of them combined had less impact than BR.Nobody's debating that. Bo Rhap is a masterpiece and all that, but it's not the only masterpiece and it's not the first song to be 'different'. Russia's the world's largest country, but that doesn't mean Russia's the whole world; the femur's the human body's largest bone, but that doesn't mean it's the only bone, nor it means the whole human body's just the femur.Sheer Brass Neck wrote: Not that polls mean anything but pretty sure few of the examples listed would be in the top 1000 songs of all times.Those polls are usually made by and for ignorant tossers anyway.Sheer Brass Neck wrote: It wasn't just the structure, the execution was amazing and unlike anything the overwhelming majority of the public had heard.Yes but the same can be said about nearly every good song ever. Russia's the world's largest country, but that doesn't mean Russia's the whole world; the femur's the human body's largest bone, but that doesn't mean it's the only bone, nor it means the whole human body's just the femur.Sheer Brass Neck wrote: Maybe that's why they were so adamant that it had to be released as a single?They released it as a single because it had hit potential, simple as that.Sheer Brass Neck wrote: Otherwise it be like Good Company: amazing, groundbreaking but ultimately obscure to all but die hard fans.Millions of people bought the album so they heard the song at least once. And not all of them were die-hard fans. |
| Sheer Brass Neck 13.10.2013 19:25 |
brENsKi wrote:Good catch Brenski, I got into the middle of the post and missed the OPs point, I am rightfully chastened :)Sheer Brass Neck wrote: Regardless of what pre-dated BR, the lot of them combined had less impact than BR, at the time and historically. Not that polls mean anything but pretty sure few of the examples listed would be in the top 1000 songs of all times. .but NONE of that ^^^ is what the OP was asking. which makes the "examples" you dismiss even more important. the OP was stating an unawareness of anything BEFORE Bo Rhap that touched on the territory |
| Sebastian 13.10.2013 19:28 |
Sheer Brass Neck wrote: What's with the Russia fetish :)It's the largest country in the world, so it's good for analogies. I could've used any other, but by using Russia I make my point far clearer. |
| brENsKi 14.10.2013 03:08 |
Sheer Brass Neck wrote:cheers fella. (i think) :-)brENsKi wrote:Good catch Brenski, I got into the middle of the post and missed the OPs point, I am rightfully chastened :)Sheer Brass Neck wrote: Regardless of what pre-dated BR, the lot of them combined had less impact than BR, at the time and historically. Not that polls mean anything but pretty sure few of the examples listed would be in the top 1000 songs of all times. .but NONE of that ^^^ is what the OP was asking. which makes the "examples" you dismiss even more important. the OP was stating an unawareness of anything BEFORE Bo Rhap that touched on the territory |
| Sheer Brass Neck 14.10.2013 07:32 |
^^^ No snark in my post, I missed the point of the thread and lost the plot. Not the first time, won't be the last :) |
| k-m 14.10.2013 14:46 |
brENsKi wrote:I was simply referring to what someone wrote earlier about the Beatles and "classical arrangements". Still, Eleanor Rigby was no Bo Rhap and neither was A Day in the Life (no matter how much I like both songs). Won't go into the DP thing. Simply not my cup of tea. Anyway, I gave my answer to the OP's question, you can disagree, that's fine. It's only rock n roll!k-m wrote:firstly, i wasn't getting excited. secondly, it was YOUR reference to classical arrangements (see above) - that i was replying to, and my points were accurate. thirdly, your last statement says more about you than anything else. you love Bo Rhap for the same reason that you have "no intention of listening to" Purple's "concerto" ...stunningbrENsKi wrote:No need to get excited there. I thought the OP asked specifically about an "operatic theme", not just a classical arrangement. Regardless, I still cannot recall a well-known song before Rhapsody which would borrow from opera so extensively. Won't argue about the Deep Purple concerto, as I never listened to it and have no intention to.k-m wrote: Other bands, like the Beatles might have tried classical arrangements, but no-one pushed it so far and as bravely as them. Paranoid Android is the closest thing that comes to my mind, but it happened years after the Queen single.and what about Deep Purple's "concerto for group and orchestra" ???? does that not push the classical arrangement thing enough for you? or do you conveniently forget that BECAUSE it predates Bo Rhap by FIVE years and kinda makes your argument void? Purple dabbled in and out of bach and beethoven loads...but YOu also ignore that. the Toys - A Lover's Concerto - top5 hit 1965!!!! was a Bach minuet the beatles - eleanor rigby carole king - tapestry the move - night of fear the nice - america and if you want to really think about this properly...Manfred Mann's Earthband released a whole album of classical influenced/arranged music "solar fire" in 1973 - two years BEFORE Bo Rhap....with a single "Joybringer" reaching the UK top 10... |
| brENsKi 14.10.2013 17:04 |
k-m wrote: Won't argue about the Deep Purple concerto, as I never listened to it and have no intention to. k-m wrote: Won't go into the DP thing. Simply not my cup of tea. ,it's odd that you know you don't like it - even tho you've never heard it, and have no intention of listening to it. i'm happy for you that you are content within your own small "listening universe" i'd respect your comments if you'd said that you have heard the album and hate it, but at least you've opted not to argue about it. if you get time give the DP and Manfred Mann albums a listen - you may be surprised |
| k-m 15.10.2013 09:58 |
brENsKi wrote:You see, just because I don't fancy listening to DP, you immediately brand my "listening universe" as small. That's why I don't want to go any further into this.k-m wrote: Won't argue about the Deep Purple concerto, as I never listened to it and have no intention to.k-m wrote: Won't go into the DP thing. Simply not my cup of tea. ,it's odd that you know you don't like it - even tho you've never heard it, and have no intention of listening to it. i'm happy for you that you are content within your own small "listening universe" i'd respect your comments if you'd said that you have heard the album and hate it, but at least you've opted not to argue about it. if you get time give the DP and Manfred Mann albums a listen - you may be surprised |
| M-train 18.10.2013 17:20 |
I guess BR is in a category all its own, as in a rock, opera tragedy. I was thinking the closest I have heard to rock, and opera mixed was David Bowie's, "Warszawa". link Which is operatic, but not a operatic tragedy like BR. And, of course Klaus Nomi who didn't write anything [that I know of], but did mix rock, and opera into one, different class of music. Klaus was working on an opera which was not finished before he died, called, "Za Bak Daz", for which the song Valentines day was recorded......... link |
| M-train 22.10.2013 16:05 |
I thought this was interesting. I was doing a bit of karaoke to BR, and two words caught my attention. Of course when we sing to the radio we often never fully know, or can understand the words of what we are singing. With karaoke we can actually see the words which was the reason for this reply. First word........Scaramouche as in "scaramouche, scaramouche, can you do the fandango". Which means: " a roguish clown character of the Italian commedia dell'arte who wears a black mask and, sometimes, glasses." link The other word: Bismillah. As in "Bismillah, let him go, Bismillah, let him go". Which means. "It is sometimes translated as "In the name of God, the Most Gracious, the Most Merciful". link So now you know. |