| John S Stuart 13.05.2013 14:34 |
You Take My Life Queen Demo: http://www.yourlisten.com/channel/content/16982183/You%20Take%20My%20Life I know I have been sounding a lot like Cassandra of late; but hey you pays your money... Simply put; the phrase "reverse engineering" was first coined by UFOlogists to explain the rapid advances in computer (and other electrical hardware) after the New Mexico Roswell UFO incident. They believe a UFO crash landed in America in 1947 (with shed-loads of advanced futuristic hi-tech equipment) and that US scientists have been figuring out how it works ever since... ta.. dah.. reverse engineering! There have always been Queen mash-ups and fan-mixes, but since the leak of 24 track masters, "Guitar Hero" game stems, and 5.1 surround mixes, these have allowed a bigger creative palette than ever before. This is all fun until someone starts to distribute these remixes as genuine, and now there is a deeper and darker edge creeping into this grey domain. Video tape audio being syphoned-off onto 7" reel - to - reel tape, and the tape selling on ebay as a genuine "master tape". (It must be genuine - it's on reel - to - reel). Fan Mixes being turned into 7" and 12" acetates. All made-to-order by our middle Eastern and Asian friends. Again turning up on ebay at silly prices. This for example is FAKE: http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/QUEEN-ACETATE-Seven-Seas-Of-Rhye-alternate-version-MEGA-RARE-/390580025005?nma=true&si=U6hcg3GVOYTXteO%252FWJgZ2gxYBpo%253D&orig_cvip=true&rt=nc&_trksid=p2047675.l2557. The above "You Take My Life" demo is a fake. (I have shared it here for educational purposes!). It is made from bits of "Love Of My Life" (5.1 divided into 5 x mono tracks) cut and edited to some second rate musicians, and Freddie's "F*CK" - is also from another out-take. (No prizes for getting it right). BUT it is being passed off as genuine by those who should know better. Beware faked acetates: A genuine acetate weighs two or three times the weight of a normal record (It's the aluminium centre that does it). The plastic is brittle and related more to an old 78 RPM single than an LP; and finally it should be dull and never, ever, look new. Beware of "unreleased" studio audio tracks which have previously been released as masters, stems or 5.1 versions. Beware of previously released albums or video concerts as retro (Cartridges or tapes). These are so easy to make. If trading, buying, selling (or even investing) always ask for a reduced quality MP3 sample first. The quality may be p*ss-poor; but at least it should identify some "unique" factor. If all the disc has to offer is a time-extension only - It's fake. Finally; beware of sheep in wolves clothing... If something is too good to be true, it usually is. http://www.queenconcerts.com/queenzone/1346154.html |
| brunogorski 13.05.2013 15:39 |
Nice post, John. :) |
| Supersonic_Man89 14.05.2013 04:50 |
That demo sounds genuinely quite good :P I didn't recognise it was lifted from LOML, although the Freddie 'Bohemian Rhapsody' F*CK gave it away. |
| FriedChicken 14.05.2013 04:55 |
Of course it's fake. I made this in 30 minutes about 8 years ago using Melodyne. I wonder why this is passed off as a 'demo' since it's clearly not Queen sounding and horribly badly recorded :D |
| FriedChicken 14.05.2013 05:02 |
And no, not proud about it... |
| Sam99 14.05.2013 06:28 |
Thank you for this education, I don't edit tracks myself and am unaware of the process of doing this so this post is very useful should I see something like his for sale. |
| people on streets 14.05.2013 07:53 |
John S Stuart wrote: This for example is FAKE: http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/QUEEN-ACETATE-Seven-Seas-Of-Rhye-alternate-version-MEGA-RARE-/390580025005?nma=true&si=U6hcg3GVOYTXteO%252FWJgZ2gxYBpo%253D&orig_cvip=true&rt=nc&_trksid=p2047675.l2557. Beware faked acetates: A genuine acetate weighs two or three times the weight of a normal record (It's the aluminium centre that does it). The plastic is brittle and related more to an old 78 RPM single than an LP; and finally it should be dull and never, ever, look new. Beware of "unreleased" studio audio tracks which have previously been released as masters, stems or 5.1 versions. If trading, buying, selling (or even investing) always ask for a reduced quality MP3 sample first. The quality may be p*ss-poor; but at least it should identify some "unique" factor. If all the disc has to offer is a time-extension only - It's fake. Finally; beware of sheep in wolves clothing... If something is too good to be true, it usually is. http://www.queenconcerts.com/queenzone/1346154.htmlSo... You say Sikke sold a fake acetate? Curious to hear shadysenator1979's / ghostwithasmile's reaction... |
| Ghostwithasmile is BACK! 14.05.2013 09:17 |
Here it is PEOPLE ON STREETS : I find this very insulting. The thing is real : * Greg compared this one with Brian his own acetates, because this has a different label , is the claim this isn't real. So this means that the test versions handed out to the artists are excatly the same as the ones made for other pruposes? * Some high class collectors including JSS asked me for the file and told me he was very interested in this ebay lot. And now he claims this one is a fake. * this item features a unique version of the song, which cannot be made by amateurs , queen keeps on playing extra verses... This is without the "I like to be the seaside ending" which could be meant as a standalone track.And this appears on Reel to Reel as wel.... * I recieved emails that my Sheffiled acetate is a fake as well : this one I bought in person of Sheffield, there is no doubt. * See the first topic in Greg his topic "sikke's acetates" * Why in heaven sake would a evil man which is aiming to gain money out of pirates and bootlegs spent his time and effort in making a costy acetate with the risk to gain maybe 100 pounds knowing this will take a lot of time and effort. Knowing he can't be pooring out acetates : people will know and think it is suspicous when one person is flooding the market with rare acetates ! * See point above : why would use words like "rejected alternate version" , "take 5 rejected" etc.etc. * Nobody told assumed it is a fake , while pictures of this one where on my facebook for 1 year or so... No people loved it.... People wanted to buy it. * It has been in my collection since 1999 I bought it at a auction house. While unpakcing boxes with Queen I noticed I have 2 of these the one sold and the same on Trident label. * Why is it a radio acetate : who knows why ? Why are the BBC sessions cut on Acetate they have the reels of the sessions.... ohhhh wait I just found out that the BBC aceates are all fakes !! * It is a acetate all the point JSS mentioned in his topic count for this being genuine , he forgot 1 thing : the specifc smell of acetates.... The older they become the thinner it's sent will be. You have to be experienced for this. Well I hope this makes sence. The biggest fake acetate is Hangman : * this one does NOT excist ! This has been confirmed by QPL employees. * Why cut a acetate of a not going to be single release ? (curious point !) * A picture showing a trident aceate with "angman" written on it can easily be made. Further I have to react to the Reel tape point in JSS his topic. The one I sold is the one shared here for free to celebrate Bob W. his birthday. I paid $ 800,- for it back then , knowing uploading it would make it only a piece of memorbilia and dlete it's value. And not a exciting piece of possible content. Btw this is the March show of Rainbow, not the November one of the VHS. As you know there are no VHS releases of the march show. And it is genuine. Further one the reveresed /ufo story : this makes no sence at all. And sound like a explanation of my daughter after watching 2 hours the History Channel (ancinet aliens) this kind of engeneering was done way before 1947 : during the World Wars, and even in dark ages , finding out how to built trebuchets. |
| John S Stuart 14.05.2013 09:29 |
This is what Gary Taylor wrote on Queenzone: __________________________________ Myself and GB have been talking and GB came up with the following: BM has over 140 acetates,from all studios, inc many from EMI from the early period. None of them look like this. I think it's trying way way too hard to look important and rare. There would be no reason to press acetates FOR RADIO ONLY. I've never encountered that, and for very good reason. That is precisely the sort of thing that the man on the street 'thinks' might appear on an acetate, but that's not the case. If this were a white label test pressing, then that might be more convincing. No acetate has a reason to have FOR RADIO on it - not at that stage. If an acetate pressing is deemed to be good, then the proper vinyl test pressing would be made (still without FOR RADIO on it), and then if the (label-les) test pressing is good, only then would the main mass pressing (with proper label) go ahead, and promo's too, with things like FOR RADIO ONLY on them. So I really think it's not real. Why doesn't it look anything like any other EMI acetate we have from this period? Like I say, it's cynically trying hard to look significant and valuable and rare. No acetate I've ever seen has all that stuff printed on it, at that very early stage. But the average Jo would imagine all of those things... I'm just surprised they didn't also hand write 'return to Roy' or 'Brian's re-edit' on it, just so that it has the full house!!!! Sorry but I'm sceptical. If I'm wrong, this would be the ONLY acetate I've seen from EMI that looks remotely like this. Finally.... final nail in the coffin, in my opinion... is the SEASONS of Rhye, rather than SEAS.... again, someone is trying to be clever and fool people, probably because they went to the LOndon Stormtroopers exhibition and saw Brian's (100% real) 'Here I am' acetate... where it should have been 'Now I'm Here'. Whoever you are out there, with your Seven Seasons Of Rhye... you don't fool me! [Finally acetates are specifically made for one or two plays only. They b*gger-up very quickly - far moreso than a "normal" or "regular" record. (Again because of both process and purpose). I thought Everyone knew that acetates deteriorate with playing. After a half-dozen or so plays it would resemble a Frisbee more than any record. So why would one be made for radio - when the purpose of a radio promo is that the disc is supposed to be constantly played?] |
| John S Stuart 14.05.2013 09:30 |
It feels like I am on trial every time I visit here. Some truths are self-evident. Gravity is one such truth. If I come home from work and a child has told me he dropped a hammer in the kitchen and that it fell upwards and landed on the ceiling; I do not need a lesson on quantum physics from his father; rather the kid is a liar. (Straight up!). Likewise; those who have handled acetates, collected acetates, (dissected worthless acetates to see how it is physically made) know a thing or two about... acetates. I am not saying anyone passed this on as part of a deliberate deception, I am saying it is very easy to be conned. This mail was a prevention of the latter, and not an accusation. http://www.discomusic.com/forums/showthread.php/30816-Warning-Counterfeit-bootleg-vinyl |
| dudeofqueen 14.05.2013 11:45 |
John, you're bashing your head against a wall here mate. Some individuals desperately want / need to be thought of by the wider community as 'important' and 'of value'. In doing so they fashion great stories and descriptions of their collections in the hope that some one is lured in and they can build up their own collection through duplicitous means. GT isn't fooled, that's obvious. Plenty of people here are jealous of others; this is what we have here. You tried to educate and have, sadly, been chopped up for it. If I were *you*, I'd clear off out of here, but I know *you* see the value of the minority....... Ce sera...... |
| Rogers Untidy Bottom 14.05.2013 13:14 |
Sigh. Handbags at dawn. See what I meant in the other thread about how competitive "Fanthology" members are? |
| dudeofqueen 14.05.2013 13:32 |
"Roger's", But why are you emphasising that; surely the competition amongst them drives the desire to find the next and best rarities? Those rarities may eventually leak - they may not. If they do then we're all better off with them. If they don't, then we're no worse off, but, rest assured, the recordings are there and they are safe for the time being. I'd love to be a member of 'Fanthology' or The Hub - or whatever - but don't have the material *they need* to share........ QPL and the band members themselves aren't bothered about collectors - they never have been. Brian and Roger even less so now that they have the cash cow that is the WWRY musical and a management team whose only concern is the status quo being maintained. I'm just struggling to understand, really, what the purpose of your initial post was in that other thread for you to then appear here stoking the fires again; you knew, surely, that you'd be lighting the touch-paper for 'Fanthology' members and opening yourself up to the ridicule you faced when you left under your previous monicker....... Odd, indeed. |
| Rogers Untidy Bottom 14.05.2013 13:47 |
I've surfed QZ for years after being ridiculed back in 2004. I had debated with myself about whether to rejoin after my 4-minute SSOR claim was proven uncategorically true, correct and accurate. I decided I wanted to join and share some of my stories. I must admit I don't feel ridiculed so far since my return. |
| Negative Creep 14.05.2013 14:44 |
Seems to be an element of deflection here surely. Is it seriously being suggested someone has recently been creating new mixes using any of the 5.1 mixes/multitrack leaks then getting them pressed up on aceate and then made them look old? If anyone has any ideas of doing anything like that, good look finding somewhere physically able to press them up for you - that's all I can say to that. And good luck selling them on eBay, seeing as it is incredibly easy for buyers to get their money back on things that are not as described. |
| vicspec 14.05.2013 16:21 |
ghostwithasmile wrote: The biggest fake acetate is Hangman : * this one does NOT excist ! This has been confirmed by QPL employees. * Why cut a acetate of a not going to be single release ? (curious point !) * A picture showing a trident aceate with "angman" written on it can easily be made. -------- So the acetate with a studio version Hangman does not exist? But John S Stuart has been on these forums for years defending his claim of ownership of just such an acetate. While we're on the topic.. what were Greg Brook's last comment about the status of this particular holy grail? Can he confirm a studio version of hangman does exist on JSS's acetate or are we all just to take JSS on his word...? |
| people on streets 14.05.2013 20:57 |
ghostwithasmile wrote: Here it is PEOPLE ON STREETS :why are you shouting at me? I just asked JSS if he was saying your acetate was a fake. I don't think it's a fake. JSS seems to think that. |
| The Real Wizard 14.05.2013 22:00 |
Rogers Untidy Bottom wrote: Sigh. Handbags at dawn. See what I meant in the other thread about how competitive "Fanthology" members are?Perhaps there is a discrepancy as to who is a fanthology member and who isn't. As far as I can see there is no such competition here. |
| Gaabiizz 15.05.2013 00:57 |
Thanks for this info. |
| Double-U 16.05.2013 03:30 |
Yes, the main reason for me not bidding higher on the SSOR acetate was the fact of the 12" size and so it was with the "Fat Bottomed Girls" acetate. I have no idea about the labels on acetates and there look a like during the years. So as a virgin in this type of collecting, it's hard not to be fooled. Here I read a lot of arguments that are able to convince me on both sides. In the end you have to ask yourself how much you're willing to pay for items like these. I don't think ebay will offer any help if you're fooled with wrong or faked contents. I mean how should they now if this is a real demo of Queen or not when we're hardly able to do so (see the start of this discussion). All you can do is to believe that the thing you bought is genuine or worth the money for a better sleep at night (as I did after buying a carpet in Esfahan for a lot of money) or to offer it to someone else or on ebay after saving the content on tape or digital or whatever. Maybe ebay is the easiest way to buy acetates without bigger circumstances but it is the easiest way to be fooled, too. It's a hard life. It's seems to be easy to fake records indeed. In my favourite record store in my home town the owner showed me faked coloured vinyls of various albums from the early and middle 90's. For example Pink Floyds "Devision Bell" or "Mellon Collie and the Infinite Sadness" from the Smashing Pumpkins. The records are looking genuine thin and the sleeves are only suspicious because of the paper. On ebay you can't feel the paper or handle the weight of the record. kind regards, W. |