Hangman_96 27.04.2012 08:43 |
Four explosions have shaken the Ukrainian city of Dnepropetrovsk injuring at least 29 people. The blasts struck a series of locations in the city center. Local authorities have begun a terrorist investigation into the incident. Interfax reports that at least ten children were among the wounded. The first explosion went off as a crowded tram pulled into a stop injuring five passengers. Local authorities say it was caused by a bomb planted in a nearby rubbish bin. “The explosion was at a tram stop. The shockwaves smashed the tram’s windows, and the doors buckled on two cars passing by. In one car, the airbags popped out. Police were there in a minute, fire fighters arrived in about five minutes,” writes Master_Tyre, a city web forum user. Forty minutes afterwards a second explosion was reported close to the city’s railway station, wounding seven while the third hit a park injuring one woman. Authorities say that the fourth blast struck near the opera house close to the site of the first explosion. It has been reported that some of the explosions were caused by “incendiary devices” planted in rubbish bins. As a consequence police are systematically removing bins and checking them throughout the city. Authorities have reportedly begun the full evacuation of the Dnepropetrovsk train station causing a stampede of people towards the exits. Local media says sniffer dogs and members of the bomb squad have arrived at the scene after receiving an anonymous call saying there was a threat of an explosion at the station. Train services have stopped running until further notice. Local Ukrainian site vgorode.ua reports widespread panic in the city where people are afraid where the next explosion will occur. Traffic has reportedly ground to a halt in the city center as people flee their offices in an attempt to get home. The city’s police have warned citizens to stay indoors. Interior troops have been deployed in the city. Telephone networks are down in the city after being inundated with calls of people fearing for the safety of their friends and family. Some news agencies have also suggested authorities may have shutdown networks to curtail possible terrorist activity. It is unclear exactly how many explosions have hit the city with some local media outlets reporting up to ten. Ukrainian president Viktor Yankovich has announced the creation of a group of specialists that will investigate the blasts. Moscow will assist in the probe, Russia’s Foreign Ministry said. “Our best investigators and detectives will be looking into the incident,” said Yankovich. Local media reported the first arrests in connection with the explosions, citing the Interior Ministry. But a senior security official denied the reports, saying he was unable to confirm the information about the suspects. Ukraine is set to host the Euro 2012 football championship in June. Matches will be held in Kiev, Donetsk, Kharkiv and Lviv. Authorities have already vowed to guarantee security for the event. UEFA says it will not cancel the upcoming championship, or change its location. “This event does not change UEFA's confidence in the security measures that have been developed by the authorities in view of UEFA EURO 2012, and which will ensure a smooth and festive tournament,” an official statement read. link |
Saint Jiub 27.04.2012 16:28 |
The ex-PM's hometown was the target. She is imprisoned, reportedly beaten by guards and on hunger strike. The opposition accuses the current PM, a bitter rival of the ex-PM, of orchestrating this chaos to divert attention from the ex-PM. Meanwhile EU leaders are considering boycotting June soccer matches in Ukraine. |
david (galashiels) 27.04.2012 18:27 |
excuse my stupidity but,is the ukraine subject to this on a regular basis(ie the same as northern island although quieter now).its something i or we dont see on the news here. is the ukraine troubled with these kinds of acts before. |
Hangman_96 28.04.2012 06:17 |
david (galashiels) wrote: excuse my stupidity but,is the ukraine subject to this on a regular basis(ie the same as northern island although quieter now).its something i or we dont see on the news here. is the ukraine troubled with these kinds of acts before.Well, kinda. We'd had such accidents before. |
YourValentine 30.04.2012 04:21 |
When the UEFA championship was given to Poland and the Ukraine, there was a lot of hope for a democratic way of the Ukraine. Now with Viktor Janukowitschs in power the Ukraine seems to be on a way towards a dictatorship with the controversial trial of Julia Timoschenko and the dubious circumstances of treating/not treating her health problems in prison only being a prominemt symptom. German President Gauck and Czech President Klaus already cancelled scheduled visits to the country and European politicians plan to boycot the games because they do not want to be photographed with Janukowitsch. It is very sad that the eagerly awaited championship is overshadowed by these severe human rights violations. |
pittrek 30.04.2012 05:49 |
YourValentine wrote: When the UEFA championship was given to Poland and the Ukraine, there was a lot of hope for a democratic way of the Ukraine. Now with Viktor Janukowitschs in power the Ukraine seems to be on a way towards a dictatorship with the controversial trial of Julia Timoschenko and the dubious circumstances of treating/not treating her health problems in prison only being a prominemt symptom. German President Gauck and Czech President Klaus already cancelled scheduled visits to the country and European politicians plan to boycot the games because they do not want to be photographed with Janukowitsch. It is very sad that the eagerly awaited championship is overshadowed by these severe human rights violations.Unfortunately OUR president didn't cancel it even when he was requested to do so :-( |
thomasquinn 32989 30.04.2012 05:50 |
I agree that the way Timoschenko is treated is below all standards of human decency. However, I increasingly get the idea that people believe she is innocent of the charges against her simply because the people charging her are such bastards. It doesn't work like that - I don't know if all charges are true, but abuse of power and corruption certainly are. As you might remember, the EU complained about that when she was in office, but we've all forgotten since she left... |
Hangman_96 30.04.2012 12:54 |
Everybody here knows that Timoschenko is innocent. She's been thrown to jail for nothing. Yanukovych and his pals are the only ones who must be arrested for stealing money and committing crimes. Having been a president for the past two years, he has done nothing good to our country. He's only stolen lots of money and destroyed the country. The way Timoschenko is treated is probably the worst you could ever find. If Yanukovych hadn't won two years ago, our country wouldn't have been that fucking bad now. That's why lots of crimes are committed here. |
YourValentine 01.05.2012 03:47 |
I do not know if Julia Timoschenko is innoocent. I am pretty sure the trial was a politically motivated farce, though. It throws a big shadow over the joy we feel about the championship. I do not agree with people who want to move the games away from the Ukraine because the people of the Ukraine are not to blame. I do believe that our politicians must boycot and not grace this quasi-dictator with their presence. Bad news for Angela Merkel who loves to see the national team play :-) |
thomasquinn 32989 01.05.2012 04:18 |
What disgusts me utterly, is that we can feign outrage over this, but we totally ignore the complete dictatorship in Belarus. In the Ukraine, there is a politically motivated trial of one politician who may or may not be guilty. In Belarus, a neo-fascist dictator is oppressing his people and torturing them by the thousands. Where is your outrage now, Lostman? You obviously don't have a clue. |
Hangman_96 01.05.2012 04:28 |
thomasquinn 32989 wrote: What disgusts me utterly, is that we can feign outrage over this, but we totally ignore the complete dictatorship in Belarus. In the Ukraine, there is a politically motivated trial of one politician who may or may not be guilty. In Belarus, a neo-fascist dictator is oppressing his people and torturing them by the thousands. Where is your outrage now, Lostman? You obviously don't have a clue.What clue are you talking about? To be honest, I didn't get it. You want to say that I'm wrong when I say that Yanukovych is guilty because he's ruined the Ukraine? Or am I wrong when I say that Timoschenko is innocent? Actually, I get it as Belarus is doing worse than Ukraine. Right? If you came to live in the Ukraine for about a few weeks, you would say something completely different. |
thomasquinn 32989 01.05.2012 13:43 |
I'm saying you're wrong when you say that Timoschenko is innocent - she's as corrupt as all the rest of the bunch, as goes for most countries. And yes, Belarus is doing considerably worse than Ukraine. You're posting on QueenZone, and you aren't in jail yet, are you? That alone proves you're not in Belarus. |
Hangman_96 01.05.2012 14:10 |
Nobody can prove who's guilty and who's not. Having said that, why are Yanukovych and his band not in jail? If Timoschenko is thrown in jail for stealing money (as everybody says), why Yanukovych isn't? This again proves how bad the Ukraine's position is. |
thomasquinn 32989 02.05.2012 07:03 |
@Lostman: Because Yanukovych is in office, and Timoschenko is not. Had she been in office, we'd now be complaining about how badly Yanukovych is being treated in prison. You seem obsessed with how bad things are in your country. That's a luxury issue - people in Holland, in England, in Germany, in the US complain too, but we (and you) still have it a hell of a lot better than an estimated 80% of the world's population. When was the last time you were threatened with imminent starvation? When did cholera last decimate your village? How often do armed mobs plunder your hometown? Are drug dealers murdering thousands every year? Has there been a war near your home in your lifetime? If you answered any of the above with 'no', count your blessings. It means you're not in Mexico, Iraq, Afghanistan, Iran, Somalia or any of a host of other countries were people are actually dying by the thousands. We in Europe have nothing serious to complain about. |
YourValentine 02.05.2012 07:03 |
thomasquinn 32989 wrote: I'm saying you're wrong when you say that Timoschenko is innocent - she's as corrupt as all the rest of the bunch, as goes for most countries. And yes, Belarus is doing considerably worse than Ukraine. You're posting on QueenZone, and you aren't in jail yet, are you? That alone proves you're not in Belarus. How can you blame Lostman for criticising his own government and not Belarus instead? That makes no sense. Also, the fact that he is not in jail does not disprove his opinion at all. Certainly, many politicians in any country deserve to be prosecuted for corruption but there is a huge difference between a trial following legal principles and a politically motivated spectacle with subsequent jail conditions which are totally inacceptable. It is true that the public usually takes more notice when a prominent person is affected. Funny recent incident with Lukashenko: http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/worldnews/europe/belarus/9122050/Better-to-be-a-dictator-than-be-gay-declares-Belarus-leader.html |
Holly2003 02.05.2012 07:15 |
Well there you go -- don't complain about anything, including terrorist explosions that injured 28 people, including 10 kids, because somewhere, somehow, others have it worse than you do. Lord save me from keyboard moralists. |
john bodega 02.05.2012 11:31 |
Don't you dare complain about the keyboard moralists on this forum. You have no idea how bad it is on other sites. |
Holly2003 02.05.2012 12:29 |
Sorry, after previous poor experiences with "dares" I now only respond to double and triple dares -- and the occasional "oh go on, what harm could it do". |
john bodega 02.05.2012 23:19 |
"We in Europe have nothing serious to complain about." I'm glad to hear it. I'm getting sick of all that whinging at the Breivik trial. |
Hangman_96 03.05.2012 06:37 |
thomasquinn 32989 wrote: @Lostman: Because Yanukovych is in office, and Timoschenko is not. Had she been in office, we'd now be complaining about how badly Yanukovych is being treated in prison. You seem obsessed with how bad things are in your country. That's a luxury issue - people in Holland, in England, in Germany, in the US complain too, but we (and you) still have it a hell of a lot better than an estimated 80% of the world's population. When was the last time you were threatened with imminent starvation? When did cholera last decimate your village? How often do armed mobs plunder your hometown? Are drug dealers murdering thousands every year? Has there been a war near your home in your lifetime? If you answered any of the above with 'no', count your blessings. It means you're not in Mexico, Iraq, Afghanistan, Iran, Somalia or any of a host of other countries were people are actually dying by the thousands. We in Europe have nothing serious to complain about.I wasn't saying that my country has the worst status in the world. I was just saying that our lives have become worse since Yanukovych became President. And no, I'm not obsessed with that kind of thing and am not complaining. I have a right to air opinions about my country, since I'm an inbred inhabitant of Ukraine, who sees all these things much better than anyone else. |
thomasquinn 32989 03.05.2012 08:59 |
Zebonka12 wrote: "We in Europe have nothing serious to complain about." I'm glad to hear it. I'm getting sick of all that whinging at the Breivik trial.He's on trial, isn't he? It's not like some warlord is letting him have another go. People need to put things in perspective. A single mass-murderer has committed a grievous crime, but he's on trial and as far as I'm aware no European cities are ablaze yet, no war has erupted here and I haven't seen battallions of Breiviks taking to the streets. The thing that people here don't seem to understand is that the only thing that gives terrorists power is attention. If we don't allow them to scare us, they are powerless. That's one of the reasons why we've lost the War on Terror GWB got us involved in - we're slowly becoming the oppressive dictatorships the terrorists paint us to be. Just look at how we've sacrificed civil liberties for a false sense of security. Yes, a bombing is a heinous crime, but that's got little to do with the guilt or innocence of Timoschenko, which is what I originally remarked about. |
thomasquinn 32989 03.05.2012 09:00 |
Holly2003 wrote: Well there you go -- don't complain about anything, including terrorist explosions that injured 28 people, including 10 kids, because somewhere, somehow, others have it worse than you do. Lord save me from keyboard moralists.If you'd learn to read, and to read things in context, you might have a clearer view of life and the world than you do now. |
YourValentine 03.05.2012 10:00 |
thomasquinn 32989 wrote: The thing that people here don't seem to understand is that the only thing that gives terrorists power is attention. If we don't allow them to scare us, they are powerless. That's one of the reasons why we've lost the War on Terror GWB got us involved in - we're slowly becoming the oppressive dictatorships the terrorists paint us to be. Just look at how we've sacrificed civil liberties for a false sense of security.
But in your previous post you say that Lostman should not criticise the dictatorship in his country because he is not in jail yet. Are you even thinking before you post? There is always a worse country and a worse regime - that should not prevent us from fighting against any kind of oppression in our own countries ever. |
GratefulFan 03.05.2012 10:07 |
thomasquinn 32989 wrote: If you'd learn to read, and to read things in context, you might have a clearer view of life and the world than you do now.LOL. How old are you Thomas? 24? 25? The hallmark of far too much of your 'wisdom' is shallowness and the parroting of superficial facts for which the necessary correction rate hovers around 50%. A clear view of life and the world requires not only knowledge but experience, empathy and humility. And common sense. You point out the insidious nature of some kinds of social breakdown in virtually the same breath as pointing out that there are no 'cities ablaze'. You couldn't make it up. |
GratefulFan 03.05.2012 10:08 |
YourValentine wrote: But in your previous post you say that Lostman should not criticise the dictatorship in his country because he is not in jail yet. Are you even thinking before you post? There is always a worse country and a worse regime - that should not prevent us from fighting against any kind of oppression in our own countries ever.There's an example of common sense for you Thomas. |
thomasquinn 32989 03.05.2012 10:20 |
I am indeed saying that, and despite what you seem to imply, it is not contradictory. I do not intend to launch into bemoanings of civil liberties taken away - that time has passed, since everybody knows it already; however, I will cite these things when I point out the results of giving in to fear, to conspiracy theories (which, as you probably noticed, I did in the above post). As you might also have noticed, I did not bring any of this up before this point, because it frankly has nothing to do with the topic at hand, which is that petty issues like what may or may not be a political trial and single terrorist attacks are allowed to serve as covers for deeper social problems, like the rampant corruption in the whole of the western world, as well as most other places, and the increasingly violent and polarized nature of society (in comparison to the period we had before). I do say that we should not be complaining as much as we are, because we really don't have so much to complain about. Because the issues we do have are comparatively small, both in number and in kind (can you imagine someone starving in Somalia worrying about immigration, budget deficits or failing banks, or corruption?), we should not complain so much about them, but attempt, as individuals in our own little way, to improve these flaws, as they really are only minor scratches in what is otherwise probably the most humane and wealthy society that ever existed so far (which is not to say that we cannot hope for gradual improvement over the coming centuries). People are all too swift in believing they are powerless. It doesn't take a thousand to make a difference, it takes one person with an idea. If you can see that something is wrong, that is because you can imagine how it could be right. The Ukraine is not corrupt because Timoschenko is on trial, Timoschenko is on trial because the Ukraine is corrupt. We should fight the corruption, but at the same time, we should remember that the question of Timoschenko's guilt is entirely unrelated to the question of the Ukraine's corruption problems, and that is the original point I was trying to make all along, before we got bogged down: I don't believe her to be a saint just because she is being martyred; that, to me, requires a little more. |
thomasquinn 32989 03.05.2012 10:33 |
GratefulFan wrote: the parroting of superficial facts for which the necessary correction rate hovers around 50%.Merely out of interest, who am I parroting? |
Holly2003 03.05.2012 10:48 |
Holly2003 wrote: thomasquinn 32989 wrote: Holly2003 wrote: Well there you go -- don't complain about anything, including terrorist explosions that injured 28 people, including 10 kids, because somewhere, somehow, others have it worse than you do. Lord save me from keyboard moralists. If you'd learn to read, and to read things in context, you might have a clearer view of life and the world than you do now. Obviously I can't be as omnipotent as you seem to believe you are. I think that's clear enough. |
Holly2003 03.05.2012 10:52 |
thomasquinn 32989 wrote: I am indeed saying that, and despite what you seem to imply, it is not contradictory. I do not intend to launch into bemoanings of civil liberties taken away - that time has passed, since everybody knows it already; however, I will cite these things when I point out the results of giving in to fear, to conspiracy theories (which, as you probably noticed, I did in the above post). As you might also have noticed, I did not bring any of this up before this point, because it frankly has nothing to do with the topic at hand, which is that petty issues like what may or may not be a political trial and single terrorist attacks are allowed to serve as covers for deeper social problems, like the rampant corruption in the whole of the western world, as well as most other places, and the increasingly violent and polarized nature of society (in comparison to the period we had before). I do say that we should not be complaining as much as we are, because we really don't have so much to complain about. Because the issues we do have are comparatively small, both in number and in kind (can you imagine someone starving in Somalia worrying about immigration, budget deficits or failing banks, or corruption?), we should not complain so much about them, but attempt, as individuals in our own little way, to improve these flaws, as they really are only minor scratches in what is otherwise probably the most humane and wealthy society that ever existed so far (which is not to say that we cannot hope for gradual improvement over the coming centuries). People are all too swift in believing they are powerless. It doesn't take a thousand to make a difference, it takes one person with an idea. If you can see that something is wrong, that is because you can imagine how it could be right. The Ukraine is not corrupt because Timoschenko is on trial, Timoschenko is on trial because the Ukraine is corrupt. We should fight the corruption, but at the same time, we should remember that the question of Timoschenko's guilt is entirely unrelated to the question of the Ukraine's corruption problems, and that is the original point I was trying to make all along, before we got bogged down: I don't believe her to be a saint just because she is being martyred; that, to me, requires a little more.Just as a matter of interest Thomas, when you're not berating Lostman and everyone else who doesn't spend every waking moment weeping over the plight of everyone from Somalia to East Timor, what concrete things are you doing to help? |
thomasquinn 32989 03.05.2012 10:53 |
Holly2003 wrote:Have you noticed that I don't post in most topics? That's because I don't have anything to contribute to the topics I don't know anything about. I'm not omnipotent, I just don't flaunt what I don't know unless it's a concrete answer I'm looking for.thomasquinn 32989 wrote:Obviously I can't be as omnipotent as you seem to believe you are. I think that's clear enough.Holly2003 wrote: Well there you go -- don't complain about anything, including terrorist explosions that injured 28 people, including 10 kids, because somewhere, somehow, others have it worse than you do. Lord save me from keyboard moralists.If you'd learn to read, and to read things in context, you might have a clearer view of life and the world than you do now. |
Holly2003 03.05.2012 10:58 |
thomasquinn 32989 wrote:Well you obvioulsy think that I don't have as clear of view of "life" as you do. That despite the fact you've never met me and don't know my life experiences or qualifications. That's a lot of hubris on your part Thomas.Holly2003 wrote:Have you noticed that I don't post in most topics? That's because I don't have anything to contribute to the topics I don't know anything about. I'm not omnipotent, I just don't flaunt what I don't know unless it's a concrete answer I'm looking for.thomasquinn 32989 wrote:Obviously I can't be as omnipotent as you seem to believe you are. I think that's clear enough.Holly2003 wrote: Well there you go -- don't complain about anything, including terrorist explosions that injured 28 people, including 10 kids, because somewhere, somehow, others have it worse than you do. Lord save me from keyboard moralists.If you'd learn to read, and to read things in context, you might have a clearer view of life and the world than you do now. |
thomasquinn 32989 03.05.2012 11:02 |
Holly2003 wrote:Well, for a start I do volunteer work for two mornings per week, in education programs for children, I help pay for a yearly medical expedition to East Asia (two months each summer, a team of seven specialist surgeons and a varying number of nurses provide free medical treatment, medicines and basic medical education. They provide their labor free of charge, three nearby hospitals provide most of the medicines, and a local charity, which I donate money to every two months, pays for the other expenses). Finally, I help with an annual free music festival, which might not technically be charity, but does make life nicer.thomasquinn 32989 wrote: I am indeed saying that, and despite what you seem to imply, it is not contradictory. I do not intend to launch into bemoanings of civil liberties taken away - that time has passed, since everybody knows it already; however, I will cite these things when I point out the results of giving in to fear, to conspiracy theories (which, as you probably noticed, I did in the above post). As you might also have noticed, I did not bring any of this up before this point, because it frankly has nothing to do with the topic at hand, which is that petty issues like what may or may not be a political trial and single terrorist attacks are allowed to serve as covers for deeper social problems, like the rampant corruption in the whole of the western world, as well as most other places, and the increasingly violent and polarized nature of society (in comparison to the period we had before). I do say that we should not be complaining as much as we are, because we really don't have so much to complain about. Because the issues we do have are comparatively small, both in number and in kind (can you imagine someone starving in Somalia worrying about immigration, budget deficits or failing banks, or corruption?), we should not complain so much about them, but attempt, as individuals in our own little way, to improve these flaws, as they really are only minor scratches in what is otherwise probably the most humane and wealthy society that ever existed so far (which is not to say that we cannot hope for gradual improvement over the coming centuries). People are all too swift in believing they are powerless. It doesn't take a thousand to make a difference, it takes one person with an idea. If you can see that something is wrong, that is because you can imagine how it could be right. The Ukraine is not corrupt because Timoschenko is on trial, Timoschenko is on trial because the Ukraine is corrupt. We should fight the corruption, but at the same time, we should remember that the question of Timoschenko's guilt is entirely unrelated to the question of the Ukraine's corruption problems, and that is the original point I was trying to make all along, before we got bogged down: I don't believe her to be a saint just because she is being martyred; that, to me, requires a little more.Just as a matter of interest Thomas, when you're not berating Lostman and everyone else who doesn't spend every waking moment weeping over the plight of everyone from Somalia to East Timor, what concrete things are you doing to help? |
Holly2003 03.05.2012 13:05 |
Sheesh, that's about as much/little as I do, and I'm a lazy ass with two of my own kids to look after. I would've thought someone who lectures us as stridently as you do MIGHT just do a bit more than that. I mean, what about Belarus! Somalia! Mexico! Egypt! Somalia again! That place is fucked up! |
thomasquinn 32989 04.05.2012 08:26 |
Sure, if you want to take a cheap jab rather than make a real argument, be my guest. I do not feel that I am not pulling my weight. Incidentally, taking into account that I spend 8-10 hours a week on charity / volunteer work already, when would you expect me to actually work for my living, as I apparently don't meet your standards for a good amount of volunteering? |
Holly2003 05.05.2012 07:10 |
Settle down Thomas, I'm just yanking your chain. There's very little point in discussing serious politics on a forum such as this, especially about countries none of us have any influence over whatsoever. We can have influence where we live though, and rather than internet rants, it's more useful to do something in your own country where you can make a difference. That's why I find your political posturing so overblown. Its all pointless. I mean, Queenzone?! Really? Too funny. |