QueenZone discussion #1233658
Singles Box III - Missing guitar...?
| rhyeking 13.06.2010 00:37 |
Okay, I need some expert confirmation... The version of "Who Wants To Live Forever" which appears to be on the new Singles Collection III boxed set is at first glance the Single Version. Since this version is harder to come by, as it wasn't on Hits II, Classic Queen, Absolute Greatest or any other release besides the single and the video, I have a copy lifted from the Video Hits 2 DVD which sounds great. Now, here's the issue: The version on the Singles III box is missing a very noticable guitar wail, compared to every other version I possess. The "wail" in question appears at the following times on the following versions: Album Version - 3:18 Video Hits II DVD version - 3:19 Karaoke Mix - 3:19 Singles III Version - NO GUITAR after the chorus at about 3:19 I'd like to know from someone with the actual original single, who can confirm whether or not the ORIGINAL single has the guitar wail at about 3:19. If the original single contains this guitar wail, the version just issued on the Singles III box is an error. |
| Jam Monkey 13.06.2010 04:13 |
I have just listened to the 7" and 12" and both are missing the guitar wail at that point in the song, so it would appear the box set has the correct single version; and the video version is different. It would be interesting to see if the videos are the Flix II VHS and Laser discs are the same is the DVD. Very well spotted. I, like most people, always thought the single and video versions were the same. |
| Believe In Yourself 13.06.2010 04:24 |
For those who want to compare. I made a short compilation of both versions. The first clip is the 2010 Singles Collection version, without the first guitar wail, the second is the original version, including both guitar wails. |
| rhyeking 13.06.2010 09:32 |
Believe In Yourself, are the clips you posted: 1) 2010 Singles Collection/Original Single Version + 2) Album Version ? I ask simply for the purpose of clarity, whether you're confirming Jam Monkey's observations. It's sounds like you are, I just like being 100% certain. Thanks, both of you for your insight. |
| Believe In Yourself 13.06.2010 10:27 |
I'm sorry for not making myself clear enough. The first one is a clip I made from the 2010 Singles collection. The second one is a clip from the 1986 video version (from youtube) I checked all of my versions of WWTLF on CD, but none of them has the 4:00 min edit (the 1992 re-issue has the album version). I do have the original 7" and 12' singles from 1986, but I can't play them, because I don't have a record player at the moment. According to ultimatequeen.co.uk and The Queen Vault the 7" version and the video version are exactly the same. link Who Wants To Live Forever (Single Edit) 4:00 Written by Brian May Appears on: UK Who Wants To Live Forever 7" vinyl, UK Who Wants To Live Forever 12" vinyl This is an edit that takes quite a bit from the album mix. The long 2 minute outro and the "who waits forever anyway" parts are omitted here altogether. In it's place is the who wants to live forever chorus part until it fades out at 4:00. The audio from the single version is also used in the video. So, at first I also thought the video version was the same as the original 7" edit. But after reading Jam Monkey's post, this appears not to be true. I have no reason to doubt Jam Monkey, but maybe others, who can play the original vinyl versions can confirm Jam Monkey's observation? Well, after all, my contributions are quite useless, aren't they? ;) take care, John |
| Adam Unger (QueenVault.com) 13.06.2010 10:39 |
It looks like I may be wrong... the singles collection 3 seems to have the correct version. I will have to check my Greatest Flix 2 tape vs. Greatest Video Hits 2 DVD to see if the video versions are the same. |
| Wilki Amieva 13.06.2010 10:53 |
As far as I know, the 7" and the original VHS single had the same version, but that was certainly different to the GVH2 (and GF2?) versions. |
| bigV 13.06.2010 10:54 |
So suddenly it appears we have a whole new version of the track? Very interesting discovery indeed :) V. |
| rhyeking 13.06.2010 12:26 |
I have no reason to doubt Jam Monkey's confirmation, as he appears to have checked the original 1986 7" and 12" singles. Therefore, we are left with the following: The ORIGINAL Single Version does NOT contain the guitar wail at 3:19. This version was accurately reproduced on the recently released 2010 Singles Collection III boxed set. All other known versions DO feature this guitar bit after the "Who wants to live forever" chorus, including: Album Version Karaoke Mix Greatest Video Hits II DVD Classic Queen VHS (I checked) Greatest Hits II Edit It's not surprising, when you think about it, the Karaoke Mix is actually the Video Version, as it was the companion CD for the Laserdisc and DVD releases out of Japan, which feature all the video versions (The Invisible Man, Friends Will Be Friends, etc.) |
| Jam Monkey 13.06.2010 13:12 |
It's amazing it's taken this long for someone to spot it. I've always found it fancinating that we have all these different versions with only minnor differences. You would expect remixes and edits etc, but there are many examples like this of only tiny differences between versions. It's long been my ambiton to collect all the Queen items with different versions on, and I am almost there; but it is a very frutrating and expensive hobby. |
| clayko 13.06.2010 13:33 |
I have one of those South American DVD bootlegs of 'Greatest Flix II'. I just listened to it, and the guitar wail IS included in that version. Just like on 'Greatest Video Hits 2'. |
| GT 13.06.2010 13:51 |
I really didn't think anyone would spot this. I'm impressed it got spotted in under a week of it's release. So there is another 'first' on these 'Singles Collection' boxes then, if only a small thing.....not all bad then eh? |
| rhyeking 13.06.2010 14:29 |
Yup, another first! Well, this is the first time the 1986 Single Version has seen a re-release, so it's no wonder no one spotted it until now. A Kind Of Magic = Album Version 7" & 12" = Single Version Greatest Hits II = Hits II Edit Classic Queen - Album Version Greatest Karaoke Hits CD = Karaoke Video Mix Absolute Greatest = Hits II Edit Single Collection III = Single Version Greatest Flix II = Video Version Classic Queen = Video Version Greatest Karaoke Hit DVD = Karaoke Video Mix Greatest Video Hits II = Video Version |
| Believe In Yourself 13.06.2010 14:43 |
I checked out good old Discogs to find some releases with WWTLF The Dutch 7"/CDS re-release from 1992 has the 5:17 album version: link The New-Zealand Cass-single from 1986 has both the single version and the album version: link The Australian 7" of Pain is so close to pleasure from 1986 has the 7" edit of WWTLF as B-side link |
| Adam Unger (QueenVault.com) 13.06.2010 15:50 |
While we are at it.... The version of Hang On In There that appears on singles box 3 isn't the same one that appears on the original I Want It All CD single; instead it is the album version. |
| Believe In Yourself 13.06.2010 16:02 |
Adam Unger (QueenVault.com) wrote: While we are at it.... The version of Hang On In There that appears on singles box 3 isn't the same one that appears on the original I Want It All CD single; instead it is the album version. -------------------------- I suppose you "turned it up insanely loud to hear it" ? ;) |
| Adam Unger (QueenVault.com) 13.06.2010 16:43 |
I did... the neighbors aren't happy. |
| rhyeking 13.06.2010 17:50 |
I have the US "I Want It All" cassette single and when I turn it up, I all I hear is ridiculous hiss at the very end, so I trust all those who reliably inform me that the CD single allows this difference to be heard in all its glory. |
| cmi 14.06.2010 01:00 |
Which is the difference between Hang On In There on CD single and CD album ? |
| Vali 14.06.2010 04:17 |
CMI wrote: Which is the difference between Hang On In There on CD single and CD album ? ***** I'd suggest you check Adam's excellent site, link, anytime you're in need of such info: Hang On In There (Single Edit) 3:43 Written by Queen Appears on: I Want It All 7" vinyl, I Want It All 12" vinyl, I Want It All CD single A little known edit, probably because no one bothered to listen for it. The entire track is the same as the "album version," except for the last few seconds. The single edit version fades out slightly earlier and is missing a final guitar chord. You'll have to turn it up insanely loud to hear it though. |
| Adam Unger (QueenVault.com) 14.06.2010 04:40 |
I think the Hang On In There version was first mentioned on Jason's Queen Trainspotter's Website. |
| brians wig 14.06.2010 05:34 |
GT wrote: I really didn't think anyone would spot this. I'm impressed it got spotted in under a week of it's release. So there is another 'first' on these 'Singles Collection' boxes then, if only a small thing.....not all bad then eh? ----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------- We have also spotted the ommission of the US single edits of "Liar" and "It's Late" though. Yes, I know they probably don't fit the remit of the Singles Boxset (top 40 hits), but due to their very nature of being heavily edited and therefore a MAJOR difference to their album counterparts, it's still a shocking ommission. Maybe they could be included in box set number 4 as a bonus CD just to keep us happy? |
| Vali 14.06.2010 06:10 |
brians wig wrote: ... the US single edits of "Liar" and "It's Late" (... ) Maybe they could be included in box set number 4 as a bonus CD just to keep us happy? **************************** You're asking too much, I guess ! We won't get a booklet, so your suggestion looks quite ... utopic :) |
| Wiley 14.06.2010 12:44 |
Ok, THIS FIND ALONE puts the whole "10 min per disc, booklet-less, 50 USD per set" Single boxes series under a new perspective Now where's my checkbook? :) |
| rhyeking 14.06.2010 14:36 |
Viewed a different way, buying these sets gets you: From Hot Space: 1) Staying Power 2) Back Chat (Single Re-Mix) 3) Body Language 4) Put Out The Fire 5) Life Is Real 6) Calling All Girls 7) Las Palabras De Amor 8) Cool Cat 9) Under Pressure + Soul Brouther That's 8 of the 11 album tracks ("Dancer" and "Action This Day" are absent, "Back Chat is the remix) From The Works: 1) Radio Ga Ga 2) Tear It Up 3) It's A Hard Life 4) Man On The Prowl 5) Machines 6) I Want To Break Free (Single Mix) 7) Keep Passing The Open Windows 8) Hammer To Fall (Headbanger's Edit) 9) Is This The World We Created? + I Go Crazy +Thank God It's Christmas That's 7 of 9 album tracks (the two absent are single versions, but in a way, the entire album is here) From A Kind Of Magic: 1) One Vision (Single Version) 2) A Kind Of Magic 3) One Year Of Love 4) Pain Is So Close To Pleasure (Single Remix) 5) Friends Will Be Friends 6) Who Wants To Live Forever 7) Gimme The Prize 8) Don't Lose Your Head 9) Princes Of The Universe + Forever +A Dozen Red Roses For My Darling +Blurred Vision That's 7 of 9 album tracks (again, though all songs are accounted for, just with two single versions) I'm not saying this should convince people to buy the box sets who don't want to, I'm just pointing out that a by-product of these sets is almost 3 complete remastered albums. And the remasters here do sound great! |
| Holly2003 15.06.2010 10:23 |
This is part of a review of the new and completely unnecessary Oasis singles collection. I thought of Queen when I read it. "One can and must reserve special criticism for the truly talented who choose commercial gain over artistic endeavour, when everyone from Prince to Johnny Cash and (yes, indeed) The Beatles realised that it was possible to combine both ventures." |
| cmsdrums 16.06.2010 07:28 |
rhyeking wrote: Viewed a different way, buying these sets gets you: From Hot Space: 1) Staying Power 2) Back Chat (Single Re-Mix) 3) Body Language 4) Put Out The Fire 5) Life Is Real 6) Calling All Girls 7) Las Palabras De Amor 8) Cool Cat 9) Under Pressure + Soul Brouther That's 8 of the 11 album tracks ("Dancer" and "Action This Day" are absent, "Back Chat is the remix) From The Works: 1) Radio Ga Ga 2) Tear It Up 3) It's A Hard Life 4) Man On The Prowl 5) Machines 6) I Want To Break Free (Single Mix) 7) Keep Passing The Open Windows 8) Hammer To Fall (Headbanger's Edit) 9) Is This The World We Created? + I Go Crazy +Thank God It's Christmas That's 7 of 9 album tracks (the two absent are single versions, but in a way, the entire album is here) From A Kind Of Magic: 1) One Vision (Single Version) 2) A Kind Of Magic 3) One Year Of Love 4) Pain Is So Close To Pleasure (Single Remix) 5) Friends Will Be Friends 6) Who Wants To Live Forever 7) Gimme The Prize 8) Don't Lose Your Head 9) Princes Of The Universe + Forever +A Dozen Red Roses For My Darling +Blurred Vision That's 7 of 9 album tracks (again, though all songs are accounted for, just with two single versions) I'm not saying this should convince people to buy the box sets who don't want to, I'm just pointing out that a by-product of these sets is almost 3 complete remastered albums. And the remasters here do sound great! In that case, why not just buy the original full albums for a hell of a lot less money?!! I haven't got the singles boxes, so can anyone confirm who does the remastering on these? For the tracks that also appear on Absolute Greatest are they the Bob Ludwig remasters from AG? If not, have all the tracks on the singles sets been remastered yet again by someone else? Brian has openly said that the Bob Ludwig masters are the best available, so if that's the case and these don't appear on the singles boxes, are buyers of the boxes being 'fobbed off' with inferior sounding remasters??? |
| rhyeking 16.06.2010 09:15 |
I believe the Singles Collections were remastered by Peter Mew, at Abbey Road. They sound much clearer than the Hollywood Records 1991 remasters (which themselves sound pretty great compared to the original releases). I've not had time to sit down and compare each new remaster that comes along. The albums I've own for almost 20 years are prmarily the 1991 HR re-issues (Queen to The Miracle), with the subsequent original releases that followed being bought as they hit the shelves (Innuendo to The Cosmos Rocks, including all the Hits collections and live albums), along with things like the 30th Anniversary "Opera" set. Maybe if someone with a copy of each release of a particular album, like "A Night At The Opera," could provide us with a decent review of each one's "improved" sound, release by release, we could have an idea of which is The Best Remaster. |
| joesilvey 16.06.2010 10:21 |
yes, Peter Mew did the remastering for the Singles Collections at Abbey Road studios. They are NOT the same masters that appear on AG or previous Japan 2001 reissues. These are NEW (2009-2010) masters. As i said in a previous post, the AG tracks are louder overall - seemingly meant for general consumption (iTunes crowd, earbud / iPod listening). The Singles Collection masters are NOT compressed for loudness. They sound almost like vinyl to me, actually. not quite as warm, but not thin or sterile at ALL. They sound fresh and alive. They beg to be played on a great stereo at a good volume level. I'm in the U.S., and I've gotten each box for only about $50 (incl. shipping) from Amazon.co.uk... and I'm not a completist. If these didn't sound better than versions I already have, i wouldn't have bothered buying them. personally, i also like having various remastered versions. that process is an art - different people add different amounts of EQ, compression, and limiting that bring out different nuances of these songs. but overall, i have to say Peter Mew's work on the Singles collections is probably the best remastering to date, and since it keeps a lot of the dynamic range (wide scope of soft to loud) i suspect it is the most true to the band's original work... |
| cmsdrums 16.06.2010 14:54 |
joesilvey wrote: As i said in a previous post, the AG tracks are louder overall - seemingly meant for general consumption (iTunes crowd, earbud / iPod listening). The Singles Collection masters are NOT compressed for loudness. They sound almost like vinyl to me, actually. not quite as warm, but not thin or sterile at ALL. They sound fresh and alive. They beg to be played on a great stereo at a good volume level. but overall, i have to say Peter Mew's work on the Singles collections is probably the best remastering to date, and since it keeps a lot of the dynamic range (wide scope of soft to loud) i suspect it is the most true to the band's original work... That's excellent info - thanks. This is just the type of confirmation (or otherwise) that I was after, and seems very promising that the main things wrong with previous versions (too loud, no scope for the dynamic range etc..) seems to have been addressed. It does make me wonder why they remaster EVERY single time a collectin is released - logic tells us though that the next 'Best Of..' compilation will be remastered AGAIN, because it wil include album versions of some hits, and not the single mixes on the singles boxes. Cheers |