Stelios 20.09.2009 11:10 |
Well i can think so many occasions when Freddie's homosexuality or flamboyance could have made the other members uncomfortable, taking notice that especially in the beginning they wanted to fit in the rock -world. From the name QUEEN , to the adaptation of the mustache, to the on-stage over the top capmness, to the actual truth that he had a different sexuality from the other 3.Of course Roger, Brian and John are not your everyday individuals copying with homophobia like the stupid majority of youngsters, especially those days. But still when egos and artistic differences came within, i wonder if that friction never touched that area of Freddie's sexuality even as a joke. Any incidents you know, would be very use full. |
ok.computer 20.09.2009 12:37 |
Is this what passes for a post on Queenzone....? |
PauloPanucci 20.09.2009 14:01 |
?????????????????? |
john bodega 20.09.2009 14:01 |
Why do you think they took 4 different limos? It's very well documented that the 3 others absolutely hated Freddie and that his homosexuality caused HUGE frictions. Well; isn't that what you wanted to hear? Heh... |
beautifulsoup 20.09.2009 14:25 |
ok.computer wrote: Is this what passes for a post on Queenzone....? Are you asking about your post...or the one previous to your post? [img=/images/smiley/msn/tounge_smile.gif][/img] |
Mr Mercury 20.09.2009 14:54 |
If Brian, Roger and John did have a problem with Freddie's sexuality, then they would have left straight away. So in my opinion it was never a problem for them. And anyway, Freddie's initial image was more of an androgynous look, championed by the likes of David Bowie's Ziggy Stardust persona. |
david (galashiels) 20.09.2009 17:30 |
well no one told me,fred was gay..so much for good mates. |
rhyeking 20.09.2009 18:19 |
You didn't need to post this twice. And from all accounts, both before and after Freddie's death, that he was gay never seemed to be an issue. Freddie's stage persona was mostly an act, fashioned out of '70s gender-bending (David Bowie, Lou Reed, etc.) with an aim to get noticed and make an impact. He was pretty shy and interverted in real life, so they say, with the exception of loving a good party (who doesn't?). Roger and Brian knew Freddie before they formed Queen, both as friends, fellow musicians, and with he and Roger working at a clothing store together. By the time Smile broke up and they formed Queen, I'm sure there were few surprises or "uncomfortable" moments like you describe. Maybe they didn't know he was gay at first, but he was their friend and as such, they probably just rolled with it. I've had friends come out of the closest and it's never been uncomfortable (for me anyway). They don't stop being the person they were and most times they're happier after they make that discovery or accept that fact (neither of which I can imagine is easy). As for John, who arrived after Queen came together, I'm sure the same was true. Queen, as a band name, covers many things. It's a short, simple, memorable name. It's royal meaning is known in many countries and languages. Yes, it also has gay connotations (drag queen, flamboyant person, etc.) and I'm sure the band were aware of them, but it all ties into the image they were trying to carve, something memorable and in-your-face. A new band in the '70s, fighting for radio and TV attention will employ every trick in the book! Most of the disagreements I've read about were music-related, in the studio, fighting over the direction a song should take, or about lyrics or individual parts of a song. I doubt it ever got so personal as you imply with your question. If it did, obviously they learned to get over it, or past it, because they worked together for over 20 years. |
Stelios 20.09.2009 18:38 |
I see you all took it very lightly.You see in my country it would probably be still an issue.And to be honest i can still see a barrier in the rock world and homosexuality (unfortunately), were you probably don't. And you are right. I wanted to hear vicious stories about Brian saying that his fagot- mustache ruined the mystique of the Prophet-like songs, Roger calling Delilah a Fairies song, and John running naked and hiding before Freddie jumps all over him...and in a way he still is(hiding)! |
Micrówave 20.09.2009 19:32 |
Freddie was sooooooooooo gay that he covered up for the other guys. Brian was a closet unisexual. John was asexual. And Roger... well... he was just Roger. |
Marknow 20.09.2009 19:39 |
STELIOS wrote: I see you all took it very lightly.You see in my country it would probably be still an issue.And to be honest i can still see a barrier in the rock world and homosexuality (unfortunately), were you probably don't. And you are right. I wanted to hear vicious stories about Brian saying that his fagot- mustache ruined the mystique of the Prophet-like songs, Roger calling Delilah a Fairies song, and John running naked and hiding before Freddie jumps all over him...and in a way he still is(hiding)! There is no way your from Greece if you think homosexuality is an issue there. Everyone in Greece is gay, even the fish!! |
Dusta 20.09.2009 22:41 |
And, even those, according to Roger(one of the documentaries, I think, though I'm not certain as to which one), were not between Freddie and the others, but, mostly between Roger and Brian. Roger has said that Freddie was, contrary to popular belief, a joy to work with, and most often the one to find a way through the disagreement to a solution. And, I don't believe he mentioned Freddie's gayness at all.
rhyeking wrote: Most of the disagreements I've read about were music-related, in the studio, fighting over the direction a song should take, or about lyrics or individual parts of a song. I doubt it ever got so personal as you imply with your question. If it did, obviously they learned to get over it, or past it, because they worked together for over 20 years. |
Zander05 21.09.2009 00:57 |
Falling somewhere on the LGBTQIA spectrum and being open about it always has potential to make or break a music career. It seems to me, for some odd reason, mainstream music media hasn't really opened its doors to queer musicians and artists until said acts establish their fanbase and bring in tons of money. SOME examples of some artists who didn't come out until they became popular: - Melissa Etheridge - Billie Joe Armstrong of Green Day - Dee Palmer of Jethro Tull - Rob Halford of Judas Priest Freddie was out, but not "out." His sexual orientation was, at best, implied but vague enough to the public to leave people debating about it to this day (as if it really matters). And I think because there was no official yes or no, it couldn't do too much damage to Queen (that is, until 1984 when we Americans couldn't handle a music video where guys dressed in drag). As far as his band mates' opinions on the subject, clearly they didn't have an issue if they worked with him for 20 years. I will stop here because I could easily make this personal, but I don't particularly want to. |
john bodega 21.09.2009 08:20 |
Micrówave wrote: And Roger... well... he was just Roger."Hey quick, Freddie, what's that moving in the bushes?" "Roger come back! Oh honestly, you'd fuck anything with two legs". "Who's counting, Freddie?". |
tjleone 21.09.2009 09:49 |
Billie Joe Armstrong of Green Day Was he gay? He's married and fathered 2 children. |
PauloPanucci 21.09.2009 11:54 |
Mr Mercury wrote: If Brian, Roger and John did have a problem with Freddie's sexuality, then they would have left straight away. So in my opinion it was never a problem for them. And anyway, Freddie's initial image was more of an androgynous look, championed by the likes of David Bowie's Ziggy Stardust persona.yeahp... if they didn't like freddie's sexual opinion, they wouldn't have turned "Queen" |
Zander05 21.09.2009 12:00 |
tjleone wrote: Billie Joe Armstrong of Green Day Was he gay? He's married and fathered 2 children. In 1995 he came out as bisexual. To me, the "married with kids" excuse isn't a very good one. In the US, at least, same-sex marriage is legal in a number of states, and there's still domestic partnership in the states where it's not. Also, plenty of people cheat on their spouses, or have otherwise negotiated an open-marriage where one or both spouses can have other relationships. And anyone can have kids - whether through adoption, artificial insemination, or "the old-fashioned way." |
catqueen 21.09.2009 14:54 |
QueenPaulo wrote: ?????????????????? It was a joke. Seems that jokes sometimes don't translate very well! :) |
tjleone 21.09.2009 19:41 |
To me, the "married with kids" excuse isn't a very good one Yeah that's true. Rock Hudson comes to mind. |
Crisstti 02.10.2009 19:04 |
I get the impression it might have caused some problems. - I'm pretty sure Brian is not all that open minded about it. He made a comment on his soapbox about Jim's book or about the Freddie's Loves documentary (or about both), I think answering to comments someone sent him about it, that sounded to me more than a little homophobic. So, considering that, I find it quite probable that they had some problems about that. - It seems pretty clear to me that by the late 70's, eary 80's they were having some problems. That was exactly the time when Freddie came out and had boyfriends and was living a pretty promiscuous lifstyle. - Brian dislikes Don't Stop me Now, which has clear gay references (and consider Freddie's jacket in the video). - Brian said in an interview how he "had a go" at Freddie for the lyrics of Body Language, because they were too clearly gay, and therefore didn't represent all of them, saying he tried to write songs in a way in which they didn't clearly refer to a waman so that Freddie could feel them when singing them as well (I'm not reading the interview now so it's by memory). Them having stayed together doesn't mean the others didn't care about Freddie's sexuality. Just that they didn't care that much, or just dealt with it. |
Zander05 02.10.2009 19:56 |
Crisstti wrote: I get the impression it might have caused some problems. - I'm pretty sure Brian is not all that open minded about it. He made a comment on his soapbox about Jim's book or about the Freddie's Loves documentary (or about both), I think answering to comments someone sent him about it, that sounded to me more than a little homophobic. So, considering that, I find it quite probable that they had some problems about that. - It seems pretty clear to me that by the late 70's, eary 80's they were having some problems. That was exactly the time when Freddie came out and had boyfriends and was living a pretty promiscuous lifstyle. - Brian dislikes Don't Stop me Now, which has clear gay references (and consider Freddie's jacket in the video). - Brian said in an interview how he "had a go" at Freddie for the lyrics of Body Language, because they were too clearly gay, and therefore didn't represent all of them, saying he tried to write songs in a way in which they didn't clearly refer to a waman so that Freddie could feel them when singing them as well (I'm not reading the interview now so it's by memory). Them having stayed together doesn't mean the others didn't care about Freddie's sexuality. Just that they didn't care that much, or just dealt with it. I'd like to preface this by saying I don't know Brian May. And it would be presumptuous of me to think that he isn't capable of being squicked out by "the gay" as loads of straight men are prone to do from time to time. I'd imagine in general, he doesn't give a damn one way or the other what someone's sexual orientation is, but still - he's human. - I haven't read Brian's comments on the book or documentary. I'm as queer as a three dollar bill but even I didn't like them because they were invading Freddie's privacy. I love his singing, but I don't need to know what he did in bed and who he did it with! If that happened to be his opinion too, that wouldn't be the least bit homophobic - more like "I don't need to know details of my colleague's sex life!" - What problems might there have been specifically? Can you give an example... a real one, and not a mere speculation? (I'm trying to be harsh here, I swear!) - Okay, Freddie wore leather back in the day. So what? I'm so sick of the stereotype that leather is something only gay men are into wearing (or doing, if you consider the word "leather" a euphemism for kink/BDSM)! And maybe Brian doesn't like Don't Stop Me Now because he just doesn't like it? Feel free to post a link or something if there's an interview where Brian says something along the lines of, "I didn't like the song Don't Stop Me Now because it's so blatantly gay and I'm so uber heterosexual and now people are totally going to think I like guys omg!!!" Not every member of Queen liked each other's work. - I don't really like Body Language either, but it got on the album anyway. Sort of like how Gimme The Prize got on the A Kind Of Magic album (I'm not being petty, I really dislike that song... with the exception of the opening solo). |
Crisstti 02.10.2009 20:50 |
Zander05 wrote:Crisstti wrote: I get the impression it might have caused some problems. - I'm pretty sure Brian is not all that open minded about it. He made a comment on his soapbox about Jim's book or about the Freddie's Loves documentary (or about both), I think answering to comments someone sent him about it, that sounded to me more than a little homophobic. So, considering that, I find it quite probable that they had some problems about that. - It seems pretty clear to me that by the late 70's, eary 80's they were having some problems. That was exactly the time when Freddie came out and had boyfriends and was living a pretty promiscuous lifstyle. - Brian dislikes Don't Stop me Now, which has clear gay references (and consider Freddie's jacket in the video). - Brian said in an interview how he "had a go" at Freddie for the lyrics of Body Language, because they were too clearly gay, and therefore didn't represent all of them, saying he tried to write songs in a way in which they didn't clearly refer to a waman so that Freddie could feel them when singing them as well (I'm not reading the interview now so it's by memory). Them having stayed together doesn't mean the others didn't care about Freddie's sexuality. Just that they didn't care that much, or just dealt with it.I'd like to preface this by saying I don't know Brian May. And it would be presumptuous of me to think that he isn't capable of being squicked out by "the gay" as loads of straight men are prone to do from time to time. I'd imagine in general, he doesn't give a damn one way or the other what someone's sexual orientation is, but still - he's human. - I haven't read Brian's comments on the book or documentary. I'm as queer as a three dollar bill but even I didn't like them because they were invading Freddie's privacy. I love his singing, but I don't need to know what he did in bed and who he did it with! If that happened to be his opinion too, that wouldn't be the least bit homophobic - more like "I don't need to know details of my colleague's sex life!" - What problems might there have been specifically? Can you give an example... a real one, and not a mere speculation? (I'm trying to be harsh here, I swear!) - Okay, Freddie wore leather back in the day. So what? I'm so sick of the stereotype that leather is something only gay men are into wearing (or doing, if you consider the word "leather" a euphemism for kink/BDSM)! And maybe Brian doesn't like Don't Stop Me Now because he just doesn't like it? Feel free to post a link or something if there's an interview where Brian says something along the lines of, "I didn't like the song Don't Stop Me Now because it's so blatantly gay and I'm so uber heterosexual and now people are totally going to think I like guys omg!!!" Not every member of Queen liked each other's work. - I don't really like Body Language either, but it got on the album anyway. Sort of like how Gimme The Prize got on the A Kind Of Magic album (I'm not being petty, I really dislike that song... with the exception of the opening solo). I'd like to say I'm not trying to badmouth Brian. I love him, 'cause he loves animals and is a vegetarian and he certainly seems like a lovely person. And I love his music as well. But I do get the impression that he had some issues with Freddie being (so overtly) gay. I'm not saying that much of an issue, anyway. - Brian's comments are here somewhere in this forum. Someone posted them. I don't think you can find them on his website because they're from some years ago and you can only find there staff from a pair of years ago or something. But will try to find the post here. I guess Brian's comments could be read as him being upset about invation of Freddie's privacy, but it was not really the impression I got. I actually don't have a problem with Jim's book, I don't think it goes into too much detail about anything... though I haven't read the ending of it. The documentary doesn't bother me either, though I guess I can see why it would bother other people. In any case, if anything about Freddie's private life would be offensive, what could be said about a biography or a movie about him?. - Since I began to read about them, and read interviews and all, I got the impression theyw eren't as close around that time as before. Am I the only to think that...?. One example I can think of now, is Freddie saying in an interview (from 1984 I think) answering a question about what did each of them do in the band, and he says something about each of them, and then says that they leave the wardrove to him, and the adds "and writing the hits". The interviewer laughs and he says "it's true". Now, that is indeed mainly true, but it seems like a rude thing to say... Also, in some interview from (I believe) 1980, in Argentina, they ask him why he seems to be more on his own and not hang out with the other band members, and he answers something like "we're a band, not a family". Will try to think of some other example (or to find links to these ones...). - Hey, I'm not talking about leather :). I'm talking about the T-shirt he wore in that video, which has the logo of a gay sex club of the time... Manschaft maybe?, will try to look it up (I notice I said jacket instead of T shirt, by bad. Consider that my fiirst language isn't English :)). No, Brian hasn't said why he doesn't like Don't Stop me Now (as far as I know). - Brian said he didn't like that the lyrics of Body Language were so overtly gay (he called it a gay ode or something similar), and that he had a go at Freddie because of that. I think from that alone one can assume he wasn't all that comfortable about Freddie being gay, and infer that maybe some of the above isses had to do with it. I know it's speculative. I'll try to find the interview, but I might not have time today. |
Angeline 03.10.2009 01:11 |
Crisstti wrote: I get the impression it might have caused some problems. - I'm pretty sure Brian is not all that open minded about it. He made a comment on his soapbox about Jim's book or about the Freddie's Loves documentary (or about both), I think answering to comments someone sent him about it, that sounded to me more than a little homophobic. So, considering that, I find it quite probable that they had some problems about that. - It seems pretty clear to me that by the late 70's, eary 80's they were having some problems. That was exactly the time when Freddie came out and had boyfriends and was living a pretty promiscuous lifstyle. - Brian dislikes Don't Stop me Now, which has clear gay references (and consider Freddie's jacket in the video). - Brian said in an interview how he "had a go" at Freddie for the lyrics of Body Language, because they were too clearly gay, and therefore didn't represent all of them, saying he tried to write songs in a way in which they didn't clearly refer to a waman so that Freddie could feel them when singing them as well (I'm not reading the interview now so it's by memory). Them having stayed together doesn't mean the others didn't care about Freddie's sexuality. Just that they didn't care that much, or just dealt with it. Um...I disagree with pretty much everything you have said. And find most of it offensive. Brian defends DSMN on his soapbox actually. |
Saif 03.10.2009 06:36 |
Actually, Angeline, Brian has expressed distaste for the song in the past. Either he's changed his opinion or he's only defending its popularity(or something). Anyway, contrary to Crisstti's opinion, he hated the song apparently because it was not "rock enough"(not verbatim). In my opinion, he's just butthurt over the fact that his only input on the studio version is the guitar solo. And the interview Crisstti's talking about regarding Body Language...nowhere did Brian condemn Freddie for using homoerotic overtones. He was uncomfortable with the suggestive lyrics in general, which I myself find too sleazy. There's nothing gay about the lyrics anyway, only the video could be construed that way. Besides, 'gay' rhymes with Brian May, so I bet he's totally gay(happy) with Freddie being gay. :P |
catqueen 04.10.2009 09:37 |
There are several songs Brian says publically he doesn't like, and there are several Roger doesn't like. It could be to do with a million things - music, lyrics, way it was recorded, produced, marketed, being sick on the day it was recorded, etc, etc, etc. If Brian had such an issue with Freddie's homosexuality, why did he let him 'eat' the guitar and rub against him? In one concert Brian looks uncomfortable, but it seems like it was something else was wrong. In the audio commentary about Body Language, i got the impression that it was more like 'ho hum... slight embarrassment... yikes, was it really this camp?!' and that the main problem he had with it was that Freddie was coming under a lot of pressure to make a 'gay' video, rather then that Freddie actually particularly wanted to make it. Also, it was so different from their other videos, and was not necessarily the direction they were going in at the time. But that's just my opinion. Regarding conflict, in an article in Q magazine, March 2008, he talks about conflict in the band. "We were lucky in that we always got along well as people and we never fought on the road. We didn't see eye to eye in the studio and that was when things got tense. We would fight over every note of the songs and all of us left the group at some point during the recordings... "Freddie was very flamboyant, but I had absolutely no idea he was gay. It was only in the '80s that he started bringing men backstage who had that particulat Adonis look... He was into his hair, his clothes. We all were, but he definately led the way with regard to preening." |
dragon-fly 04.10.2009 13:23 |
I don't think Brian particularly had problem with Freddie being gay. The reason for argument was music and all the process connected with it. Otherwise, he wouldn't agree to wear a dress in I Want To Break Free! |
Soapy Gonad 04.10.2009 14:20 |
I think that Freddie turned gay because he listened to Hot Space. Before that he liked to pump women. The same thing happened to me when I listened to Hot Space. I left my wife and kids and started to touch men's cloth. Had it not been for FLASSH SOUNDTRACKS I think I would still be in the Faroah IslANDS with the piece in my bottom. HAHAHAH!!!111!! Only joking Qwenzones! I bloody love the Invisible Man, which i am right in thinking is about Freddie's final illnesses. |
PauloPanucci 04.10.2009 16:16 |
Soapy Gonad wrote: I think that Freddie turned gay because he listened to Hot Space. Before that he liked to pump women. The same thing happened to me when I listened to Hot Space. I left my wife and kids and started to touch men's cloth. Had it not been for FLASSH SOUNDTRACKS I think I would still be in the Faroah IslANDS with the piece in my bottom. HAHAHAH!!!111!! Only joking Qwenzones! I bloody love the Invisible Man, which i am right in thinking is about Freddie's final illnesses. HAHA[img=/images/smiley/msn/thumbs_down.gif][/img] you're very funny[img=link |
Crisstti 06.10.2009 12:15 |
Angeline wrote:Crisstti wrote: I get the impression it might have caused some problems. - I'm pretty sure Brian is not all that open minded about it. He made a comment on his soapbox about Jim's book or about the Freddie's Loves documentary (or about both), I think answering to comments someone sent him about it, that sounded to me more than a little homophobic. So, considering that, I find it quite probable that they had some problems about that. - It seems pretty clear to me that by the late 70's, eary 80's they were having some problems. That was exactly the time when Freddie came out and had boyfriends and was living a pretty promiscuous lifstyle. - Brian dislikes Don't Stop me Now, which has clear gay references (and consider Freddie's jacket in the video). - Brian said in an interview how he "had a go" at Freddie for the lyrics of Body Language, because they were too clearly gay, and therefore didn't represent all of them, saying he tried to write songs in a way in which they didn't clearly refer to a waman so that Freddie could feel them when singing them as well (I'm not reading the interview now so it's by memory). Them having stayed together doesn't mean the others didn't care about Freddie's sexuality. Just that they didn't care that much, or just dealt with it.Um...I disagree with pretty much everything you have said. And find most of it offensive. Brian defends DSMN on his soapbox actually. There's nothing offensive about what I said. What exactly do you think is offensive, and to whom?. |
Crisstti 06.10.2009 12:22 |
Saif wrote: Actually, Angeline, Brian has expressed distaste for the song in the past. Either he's changed his opinion or he's only defending its popularity(or something). Anyway, contrary to Crisstti's opinion, he hated the song apparently because it was not "rock enough"(not verbatim). In my opinion, he's just butthurt over the fact that his only input on the studio version is the guitar solo. And the interview Crisstti's talking about regarding Body Language...nowhere did Brian condemn Freddie for using homoerotic overtones. He was uncomfortable with the suggestive lyrics in general, which I myself find too sleazy. There's nothing gay about the lyrics anyway, only the video could be construed that way. Besides, 'gay' rhymes with Brian May, so I bet he's totally gay(happy) with Freddie being gay. :P Brian's guitar solo is so great, I don't see why'd he'd have a problem with that being his input. Maybe he wanted to do a longer or different solo and Freddie didn't let him :). I'm not really saying conclusively that Brian disliked it for it's gay lyrics or Freddie's t-shirt in the video, I said it's especulation, based on Brian's comments about Body language and the post I mentioned in his soapbox. Brian did say he had a problem with the lyrics of Body Language for them being to gay. I'm very much sure. I'm sorry to say something like that without providing a quote, but I've been really busy... I actually don't think the lyrics are gay, not in a clear way anyway (maybe Freddie changed them because of Brian?), and much less do I see anything gay about the video... aren't cleary many women in it?. |
Crisstti 06.10.2009 12:23 |
catqueen wrote: There are several songs Brian says publically he doesn't like, and there are several Roger doesn't like. It could be to do with a million things - music, lyrics, way it was recorded, produced, marketed, being sick on the day it was recorded, etc, etc, etc. If Brian had such an issue with Freddie's homosexuality, why did he let him 'eat' the guitar and rub against him? In one concert Brian looks uncomfortable, but it seems like it was something else was wrong. In the audio commentary about Body Language, i got the impression that it was more like 'ho hum... slight embarrassment... yikes, was it really this camp?!' and that the main problem he had with it was that Freddie was coming under a lot of pressure to make a 'gay' video, rather then that Freddie actually particularly wanted to make it. Also, it was so different from their other videos, and was not necessarily the direction they were going in at the time. But that's just my opinion. I'm not sure I understand what you're saying. Are you saying Freddie was being pressured to make a gay video?, by whom?. |
Crisstti 06.10.2009 12:25 |
dragon-fly wrote: I don't think Brian particularly had problem with Freddie being gay. The reason for argument was music and all the process connected with it. Otherwise, he wouldn't agree to wear a dress in I Want To Break Free! Well, Body Language was in 1980 (or 81?) and I want to break free was in 1984, so maybe he was more comfortable about it by then... |
Crisstti 06.10.2009 12:28 |
Crisstti wrote:catqueen wrote: There are several songs Brian says publically he doesn't like, and there are several Roger doesn't like. It could be to do with a million things - music, lyrics, way it was recorded, produced, marketed, being sick on the day it was recorded, etc, etc, etc. If Brian had such an issue with Freddie's homosexuality, why did he let him 'eat' the guitar and rub against him? In one concert Brian looks uncomfortable, but it seems like it was something else was wrong. In the audio commentary about Body Language, i got the impression that it was more like 'ho hum... slight embarrassment... yikes, was it really this camp?!' and that the main problem he had with it was that Freddie was coming under a lot of pressure to make a 'gay' video, rather then that Freddie actually particularly wanted to make it. Also, it was so different from their other videos, and was not necessarily the direction they were going in at the time. But that's just my opinion.I'm not sure I understand what you're saying. Are you saying Freddie was being pressured to make a gay video?, by whom?. Also, I don't think Brian had "such an issue" with it. But to some degree he did. Also, in Brian's Howard Stern interview, he seems uneasy when Howard asks him some staff about Freddie being gay. |
Crisstti 06.10.2009 12:52 |
OK, here it is: http://queen.musichall.cz/en/interviews/brian-may-guitar-world-magazine-98.html GW: In today's world, people are more tolerant of the gay lifestyle. But what was it like early on, with Freddie being a gay man in the macho world of Seventies rock? MAY: Early on, it didn't exist. Or if it did, we never saw it. And I don't think Freddie was aware of it, either. He was very much with us. In the early days, we used to share rooms, so I would have known! Freddie had some gorgeous girls. So I don't think the subject ever came up. It's odd, isn't it, to think of that? And it was only later on...I couldn't really pin down the exact time, but I remember there was a point where we realized that Freddie was leading a bit of a different social life than us. He'd just go off on his own and say, "See you later." So gradually he was venturing off into other areas. He was encouraged by certain people who sort of brought him out, I guess. One of whom was our personal manager at the time. [pauses] How far do I want to get into this? He was a pretty over the top kind of person, and I think Freddie found himself in places where he wouldn't naturally had gotten to if that sort of door hadn't been forcibly opened for him. Do you know what I'm saying? I think he would have drifted into finding himself in a more gradual way if it hadn't suddenly exploded in on him. So there was a period in his life when he was seemingly completely blown away by it all. I can remember the Mott the Hoople tour [April 1974] was the first time I ever experienced sex on a grand scale. And it was almost really not my decision. It kind of happened to me, you know? I felt like I had no control. I think in a corresponding way, in a gay direction, that's what happened to Freddie a bit later on. But it didn't really change our relationship with him very much. Because we were always very close in the studio. And when we spoke of, you know, love stories in the studio, there was no distinction. You could be in love with whoever you wanted to be and the song would still make sense. But from Jazz album onwards, it would always cross my mind. Because I would be writing words for Freddie to sing. And it became a little game for me to write stuff for him which would make sense whichever way he saw it. GW: So your writing acquired a kind of... MAY: Yeah, another dimension. In fact, I can remember having a go at Freddie because some of the stuff he was writing was very definitely on the gay side. I remember saying, "it would be nice if this stuff could be universally applicable, because we have friends out there of every persuasion." It's nice to involve people. What it's not nice to do is rope people out. And I felt kind of roped out by something that was very overtly a gay anthem, like "Body Language"[Hot Space, 1982]. I thought it was very hard to take that in the other way. It's hard to talk about this. But there you go. |
mike hunt 08.10.2009 03:12 |
Crisstti wrote: OK, here it is: http://queen.musichall.cz/en/interviews/brian-may-guitar-world-magazine-98.html GW: In today's world, people are more tolerant of the gay lifestyle. But what was it like early on, with Freddie being a gay man in the macho world of Seventies rock? MAY: Early on, it didn't exist. Or if it did, we never saw it. And I don't think Freddie was aware of it, either. He was very much with us. In the early days, we used to share rooms, so I would have known! Freddie had some gorgeous girls. So I don't think the subject ever came up. It's odd, isn't it, to think of that? And it was only later on...I couldn't really pin down the exact time, but I remember there was a point where we realized that Freddie was leading a bit of a different social life than us. He'd just go off on his own and say, "See you later." So gradually he was venturing off into other areas. He was encouraged by certain people who sort of brought him out, I guess. One of whom was our personal manager at the time. [pauses] How far do I want to get into this? He was a pretty over the top kind of person, and I think Freddie found himself in places where he wouldn't naturally had gotten to if that sort of door hadn't been forcibly opened for him. Do you know what I'm saying? I think he would have drifted into finding himself in a more gradual way if it hadn't suddenly exploded in on him. So there was a period in his life when he was seemingly completely blown away by it all. I can remember the Mott the Hoople tour [April 1974] was the first time I ever experienced sex on a grand scale. And it was almost really not my decision. It kind of happened to me, you know? I felt like I had no control. I think in a corresponding way, in a gay direction, that's what happened to Freddie a bit later on. But it didn't really change our relationship with him very much. Because we were always very close in the studio. And when we spoke of, you know, love stories in the studio, there was no distinction. You could be in love with whoever you wanted to be and the song would still make sense. But from Jazz album onwards, it would always cross my mind. Because I would be writing words for Freddie to sing. And it became a little game for me to write stuff for him which would make sense whichever way he saw it. GW: So your writing acquired a kind of... MAY: Yeah, another dimension. In fact, I can remember having a go at Freddie because some of the stuff he was writing was very definitely on the gay side. I remember saying, "it would be nice if this stuff could be universally applicable, because we have friends out there of every persuasion." It's nice to involve people. What it's not nice to do is rope people out. And I felt kind of roped out by something that was very overtly a gay anthem, like "Body Language"[Hot Space, 1982]. I thought it was very hard to take that in the other way. It's hard to talk about this. But there you go. It's obvious from interviews that brian had a problem with freddie's sexuality. I remember brian commenting on the video "crazy little thing" that he was uncomforable with boys being in the video, I don't think songs like don't stop me now, get down make love and body language are really that gay. A straight man could have sang those songs, and none of us would think nothing about it,....except that he loves writing about sex. |
mike hunt 08.10.2009 03:22 |
those black leather Jackets were worn by brian as well. I wear one of those jackets and I'm far from gay. I don't get what the Jacket in the "don't stop me now video" has to do with anything. Same with the mustache thing. People refer to the 80's freddie as the gay look. In the 80's that look was very popular with straight men also. The Burt reynolds look. most straight rockers had that look in the 80's. the stache with the leather Jacket. |
john bodega 08.10.2009 08:09 |
If this doesn't expose the subjectivity of the issue, I don't know what does. Brian's interview there is as liberal and respectful of both sides as can be ... how can anyone think he has a gay problem there?? He might be prudish, but homophobic? No way. I think the Crazy Little Thing video needed less shitty dancers - period. Who cares what sex they were? And if he said he had a problem with the Body Language video, he's lying - look at the way he snaps his fingers. He's loving the 80's right there. |
catqueen 08.10.2009 14:31 |
Crisstti wrote:Crisstti wrote:Brian didn't explicitly say that, but it sounded like it in the commentary. He said something along the lines taht he thinks a lot of Freddie's friends were expecting him to do a song/video like that and implied that there may have been some pressure to do a 'gay' video. Whether it was pressure or encouragement I don't know! :) Like i said, i havent listened to the commentary in a while, but that is what i remember from it, because to be honest, i didn't really think about it being particularly gay. I mean, obviously a person's identity affects the way they portray or interpret something, but i didn't think it was anything more then that. And that interview quote is interesting, but Brian is a fairly analytical type of person, who seems to think a lot and try to figure out exactly what and why he thinks and feels what he doew, so imo, the only reason he could be taken as homophobic in that interview is because he has given hte issue some thought, so it sounds a bit stiff or something. I don't think he is at all homophobic. I guess like Zebonka said, he may be more prudish/reserved then homophobic, I think he sounds like this when he talks about parties, drugs, sex, etc, I don't think it had too much to do with just homosexuality. And if he was homophobic, why would he change lyrics to make them more inclusive. (please dont say "for money!" :) )catqueen wrote: There are several songs Brian says publically he doesn't like, and there are several Roger doesn't like. It could be to do with a million things - music, lyrics, way it was recorded, produced, marketed, being sick on the day it was recorded, etc, etc, etc. If Brian had such an issue with Freddie's homosexuality, why did he let him 'eat' the guitar and rub against him? In one concert Brian looks uncomfortable, but it seems like it was something else was wrong. In the audio commentary about Body Language, i got the impression that it was more like 'ho hum... slight embarrassment... yikes, was it really this camp?!' and that the main problem he had with it was that Freddie was coming under a lot of pressure to make a 'gay' video, rather then that Freddie actually particularly wanted to make it. Also, it was so different from their other videos, and was not necessarily the direction they were going in at the time. But that's just my opinion.I'm not sure I understand what you're saying. Are you saying Freddie was being pressured to make a gay video?, by whom?. Also, I don't think Brian had "such an issue" with it. But to some degree he did. Also, in Brian's Howard Stern interview, he seems uneasy when Howard asks him some staff about Freddie being gay. |
mooghead 08.10.2009 16:15 |
mike hunt wrote: most straight rockers had that look in the 80's. the stache with the leather Jacket. Photos please |
goinback 08.10.2009 16:27 |
As a gay guy, I have to say it probably would have been nice for Freddie to have done some songs that were totally for gay people...though Brian was worried about "roping off" straight people. The thing is, gay people are always roped off from obvious straight songs and always have to reinterpret them, so it would be nice to sometimes say, "Sorry, this song ISN'T 'universal' necessarily...it's definitely about a gay relationship." But in the time Queen were recording their songs, it obviously would have not helped their careers, especially with the flack from just the IWTBF video. So what Brian said at the time about having to make songs "universal" isn't totally "politically correct" to me, yet he was unfortunately totally right at the time that it was a necessary way of having to write songs in the '80s to sell records. |
mike hunt 09.10.2009 10:24 |
mooghead wrote:mike hunt wrote: most straight rockers had that look in the 80's. the stache with the leather Jacket.Photos please why do I need photo's?...lol. I lived it!...I was a 80's child.......I know a lot of rockers and straight men had the stache and leather Jacket, it was a popular look back then. You want photo's?....maybe not rockers, but popular straight men of that era who had staches Just like freddie. "burt reynolds".......tom selleck (spelling?) and baseball player keith hernandez. No one ever say's they had a gay look |
mike hunt 09.10.2009 10:38 |
Zebonka12 wrote: If this doesn't expose the subjectivity of the issue, I don't know what does. Brian's interview there is as liberal and respectful of both sides as can be ... how can anyone think he has a gay problem there??He might be prudish, but homophobic? No way. I think the Crazy Little Thing video needed less shitty dancers - period. Who cares what sex they were? And if he said he had a problem with the Body Language video, he's lying - look at the way he snaps his fingers. He's loving the 80's right there. I don't think brian, roger and John were homophobic, but maybe a little uneasy at times....nothing's wrong with that. The crazy video had some gay looking dudes, but don't forget the hot blond freddie was having fun with. It was a good video for it's time. |
Saif 09.10.2009 10:46 |
mike hunt wrote:mooghead wrote:why do I need photo's?...lol. I lived it!...I was a 80's child.......I know a lot of rockers and straight men had the stache and leather Jacket, it was a popular look back then. You want photo's?....maybe not rockers, but popular straight men of that era who had staches Just like freddie. "burt reynolds".......tom selleck (spelling?) and baseball player keith hernandez. No one ever say's they had a gay lookmike hunt wrote: most straight rockers had that look in the 80's. the stache with the leather Jacket.Photos please Ron Jeremy has a 'stache too! |
mike hunt 09.10.2009 11:01 |
and as far as the leather Jacket?...every rock musician and rock fan wore one of those at one time or another. going to a party in the eighties we all wore one of those, everyone of us. always put on someone else's Jacket cos we all had the same Type of jacket. And yes, a lot of us had staches too. My only point is that I don't get this whole "gay look" thing. Like now, a lot of gay men shave their heads, but it's not "the gay" look. Because a lot of straight men shave their heads too. look at any old photo of any rocker from the 80's and chances are they have the leather jacket on, but freddie does it, then all a sudden it's the "gay look.".... Shit makes me laugh. Halford's another story, his look was gay. With that leather hat and spikes. straight me rarely wore that. |
Saif 09.10.2009 11:39 |
mike hunt wrote: and as far as the leather Jacket?...every rock musician and rock fan wore one of those at one time or another. going to a party in the eighties we all wore one of those, everyone of us. always put on someone else's Jacket cos we all had the same Type of jacket. And yes, a lot of us had staches too. My only point is that I don't get this whole "gay look" thing. Like now, a lot of gay men shave their heads, but it's not "the gay" look. Because a lot of straight men shave their heads too. look at any old photo of any rocker from the 80's and chances are they have the leather jacket on, but freddie does it, then all a sudden it's the "gay look.".... Shit makes me laugh. Halford's another story, his look was gay. With that leather hat and spikes. straight me rarely wore that. Funny thing is that the Halford look is now the Heavy Metal look. Every metal concert I go to has some retards dressed up in studded leather jackets and spiked gauntlets. Manowar are also kind of to blame for propagating this. Don't even ask about the Black Metal look! It's worse than KISS times thousand. They wear "corpse-paint"(think KISS gone awry), wear machine gun ammo belts for photo-shoots and take part in LARP(Live-Action Role Playing) in their music videos. |
mike hunt 09.10.2009 12:00 |
lol, your right!...halford did invent the spikes and the leather hat movement for metal, especially in the early to mid eighties.....that's ok for back then, but too see those retards still out there in 2009 is pretty funny. Manowar is another story, corny, funny, and manowar are straight men?...But freddie had that gay look?...forget about what bruce dickinson used too wear in the mid eighties. No one accuses him of having that gay look. |
Dusta 10.10.2009 00:45 |
Saif wrote:mike hunt wrote:Ron Jeremy has a 'stache too!mooghead wrote:why do I need photo's?...lol. I lived it!...I was a 80's child.......I know a lot of rockers and straight men had the stache and leather Jacket, it was a popular look back then. You want photo's?....maybe not rockers, but popular straight men of that era who had staches Just like freddie. "burt reynolds".......tom selleck (spelling?) and baseball player keith hernandez. No one ever say's they had a gay lookmike hunt wrote: most straight rockers had that look in the 80's. the stache with the leather Jacket.Photos please ...and Ron Guidry... |
Crisstti 10.10.2009 21:50 |
I would like to say that Brian DID say he had a problem with the gay lyrics of Body Language (which many said he hadn't said). So I was right ;). SO the answer to the original question is yes, they had at least on that ocation a problem because of the others (or just Brian) havin been uncomfortable with Freddie's sexuality. Brian's quote cannot be interpreted otherwise. he said he was uncomfortable with the lyrics of Body Language (called it a gay anthem), and that he had a go at Freddie about it. |
Crisstti 10.10.2009 21:52 |
mike hunt wrote: It's obvious from interviews that brian had a problem with freddie's sexuality. I remember brian commenting on the video "crazy little thing" that he was uncomforable with boys being in the video, I don't think songs like don't stop me now, get down make love and body language are really that gay. A straight man could have sang those songs, and none of us would think nothing about it,....except that he loves writing about sex. Well, "I wanna make a supersonic man out of you" it's undoubtly a gay reference. |
Crisstti 10.10.2009 21:58 |
catqueen wrote:
Crisstti wrote:Crisstti wrote: I'm not sure I understand what you're saying. Are you saying Freddie was being pressured to make a gay video?, by whom?. Also, I don't think Brian had "such an issue" with it. But to some degree he did. Also, in Brian's Howard Stern interview, he seems uneasy when Howard asks him some staff about Freddie being gay.Brian didn't explicitly say that, but it sounded like it in the commentary. He said something along the lines taht he thinks a lot of Freddie's friends were expecting him to do a song/video like that and implied that there may have been some pressure to do a 'gay' video. Whether it was pressure or encouragement I don't know! :) Like i said, i havent listened to the commentary in a while, but that is what i remember from it, because to be honest, i didn't really think about it being particularly gay. I mean, obviously a person's identity affects the way they portray or interpret something, but i didn't think it was anything more then that. And that interview quote is interesting, but Brian is a fairly analytical type of person, who seems to think a lot and try to figure out exactly what and why he thinks and feels what he doew, so imo, the only reason he could be taken as homophobic in that interview is because he has given hte issue some thought, so it sounds a bit stiff or something. I don't think he is at all homophobic. I guess like Zebonka said, he may be more prudish/reserved then homophobic, I think he sounds like this when he talks about parties, drugs, sex, etc, I don't think it had too much to do with just homosexuality. And if he was homophobic, why would he change lyrics to make them more inclusive. (please dont say "for money!" :) ) He would change them because he wanted Freddie to be able to feel them when he sang them. So he said he had a problem about Freddie not doing the same for him. I do wonder however if he wasn't just racionalizing the fact that maybe he just didn't want the band to do gay lyrics. Because', you know, Freddie could easily have answered to him "I have no problem with singing songs which are overtly straight. Have been doing it for years. You write your songs how you want and I'll write mine how I want". Also, he says they have "friends" f every tendency out there (is he talking about fans?) and that he doesn't want them to feel roped out. Well, he doesn't seem to have had a problem, before Freddie started writing "gay" songs, with their gay audience feeinlg roped out. |
Crisstti 10.10.2009 22:02 |
mike hunt wrote: those black leather Jackets were worn by brian as well. I wear one of those jackets and I'm far from gay. I don't get what the Jacket in the "don't stop me now video" has to do with anything. Same with the mustache thing. People refer to the 80's freddie as the gay look. In the 80's that look was very popular with straight men also. The Burt reynolds look. most straight rockers had that look in the 80's. the stache with the leather Jacket. I just made a mistake when I wrote "jacket". I meant Freddie's shirt in that video. Which has the logo of a New ork gay sex club. Who knows if the others were aware of that though. About Freddie's 80's look being a "gay look" though, it definetly was. Brian himself says it in an interview. The interviewer asks him something like "it must have been hard for rock fans to see Freddie with his more stereotypical gay look in the 80's", and Brian sasy something like "yeah, but it shouldn't". So he accepted the interviewer's statement that it was a gay look. |
Crisstti 10.10.2009 22:09 |
About Freddie's t-shirt, the name of the club was Mineshaft. Links: link link |
mike hunt 11.10.2009 00:44 |
Crisstti wrote:mike hunt wrote: those black leather Jackets were worn by brian as well. I wear one of those jackets and I'm far from gay. I don't get what the Jacket in the "don't stop me now video" has to do with anything. Same with the mustache thing. People refer to the 80's freddie as the gay look. In the 80's that look was very popular with straight men also. The Burt reynolds look. most straight rockers had that look in the 80's. the stache with the leather Jacket.I just made a mistake when I wrote "jacket". I meant Freddie's shirt in that video. Which has the logo of a New ork gay sex club. Who knows if the others were aware of that though. About Freddie's 80's look being a "gay look" though, it definetly was. Brian himself says it in an interview. The interviewer asks him something like "it must have been hard for rock fans to see Freddie with his more stereotypical gay look in the 80's", and Brian sasy something like "yeah, but it shouldn't". So he accepted the interviewer's statement that it was a gay look. ok, I didn't know about the shirt thing!....If freddie had the gay look in the 80's, then why didn't keith hernandez, burt reynolds, tom selleck, ron guidry get accused of having the gay look?....I'm not starting an argument over this. I'm just curious why all those straight men didn't have that "gay look" but freddie did. I'm trying too upload a pic of keith hernandez in the 80's, he looked a lot like freddie in the 80's. I Just want too know the difference of why keith never looked gay, but freddie did? |
Crisstti 11.10.2009 19:10 |
About the shirt, considering Brian's attitude about the lyrics of Body Language (I don't really see seem as that clearly gay, much less a "gay anthem"), I think it's pretty logical to say that Freddie's shirt in the video of Don't Stop me Now may have been the reason for his dislike of the song (not to mention that the lyrics of this song are more clearly gay than those of Body Language). I don't think it's a far out conjecture at all. About Freddie's 80's look, I'm not very sure how those other guys looked :). But I do think Tom Selleck had a similar look?. I cannot really say why Freddie's look would have been considered gay and theirs not. Don't know. |
Zander05 12.10.2009 00:15 |
I think it's pretty logical to say that Freddie's shirt in the video of Don't Stop me Now may have been the reason for his dislike of the song (not to mention that the lyrics of this song are more clearly gay than those of Body Language)." Not to be rude or anything, but that's the dumbest fucking thing I've ever heard. And me being me (read, "big, flaming queer"), I've heard a LOT of dumb crap from a LOT of people. This enters my Top Three though. Congratulations, I guess! Seriously, you think that Brian couldn't possibly dislike a song for any other reason than Freddie's choice of clothing? REALLY??? .... Seriously?! I have brain damage from a pre-existing birth defect, but you've just made it worse. |
mike hunt 12.10.2009 01:29 |
who cares if brian doesn't like don't stop me now, he's allowed not to like a song. I'm sure freddie didn't like a few of brians good songs too. |
Crisstti 12.10.2009 14:28 |
Zander05 wrote: Not to be rude or anything, but that's the dumbest fucking thing I've ever heard. And me being me (read, "big, flaming queer"), I've heard a LOT of dumb crap from a LOT of people. This enters my Top Three though. Congratulations, I guess! Seriously, you think that Brian couldn't possibly dislike a song for any other reason than Freddie's choice of clothing? REALLY??? .... Seriously?! I have brain damage from a pre-existing birth defect, but you've just made it worse. You seem to have a reading comprehension problem, darling. Of course there could be other reasons. I said it MAY be the reason. Look "may" up. Thank you. Oh, I also happened to mention the lyrics. |
Crisstti 12.10.2009 14:32 |
Further: "MAY: Yeah, another dimension. In fact, I can remember having a go at Freddie because some of the stuff he was writing was very definitely on the gay side. I remember saying, "it would be nice if this stuff could be universally applicable, because we have friends out there of every persuasion." It's nice to involve people. What it's not nice to do is rope people out. And I felt kind of roped out by something that was very overtly a gay anthem, like "Body Language"[Hot Space, 1982]. I thought it was very hard to take that in the other way. It's hard to talk about this. But there you go." Saying "some of the stuff" clearly implies Brian is talking about more than one song. What another song could he be refering to, apart from Body Language?. Don't Stop me Now is the obvious answer. |
TheRobin 19.12.2009 06:18 |
Crisstti wrote: Further: "MAY: Yeah, another dimension. In fact, I can remember having a go at Freddie because some of the stuff he was writing was very definitely on the gay side. I remember saying, "it would be nice if this stuff could be universally applicable, because we have friends out there of every persuasion." It's nice to involve people. What it's not nice to do is rope people out. And I felt kind of roped out by something that was very overtly a gay anthem, like "Body Language"[Hot Space, 1982]. I thought it was very hard to take that in the other way. It's hard to talk about this. But there you go." Saying "some of the staff" clearly implies Brian is talking about more than one song. What anotehr song could he be refering to, apart from Body Language?. Don't Stop me Now is an obvious answer. I can understand where Brian is coming from in that quote, and I'm probably the LAST person on Earth who someone would call homophobic. Brian is saying that with some songs Freddie had (MAYBE) presented to the band were, as he said "on the gay side". Brian's problem is that the songs Freddie presented had no consideration for anything else with the band other than the "gay subject". Now Queen is 3/4 straight, if you have a song that is only about a "gay subject" it wouldn't be so democratic and everything would just be weird. Imagine you're Brian, Roger, or John and are playing a song where Freddie is talking about visiting gay clubs and dancing all over guys (this is ONLY AN EXAMPLE!), it'd be extremely awkward because you wouldn't dance all over guys being a straight man (I'm actually female but I'm only using an example). The "some of the stuff" part could have been discarded songs that the band refused to play, or Freddie realizing that he wasn't thinking of what the band would think about the unknown songs. Now, some songs may have been edited, like Body Language to tune down the gay hints, to make the rest of the band feel more included and have some say the direction of the song was going to take. NOW, why would ANYONE think the band might have disliked Freddie for his sexuality? I'm talking about the older posts in this topic. I don't think his sexuality influenced one single iota in the way the other guys perceived him. Brian and Freddie were best friends! Roger and Freddie were best friends! John and Freddie were best friends! The band were his best friends so why should something so minimal and pointless as one's sexuality make a difference in a friendship? It's ridiculous some of you would even think that. And Chrisstti, I never figured Don't Stop Me Now to be about anything gay. In an earlier post you said something about him saying, "I wanna make a supersonic man outta you." He says the same thing later about a woman. Anyways, I think the song is about using cocaine. It's obvious he's talking about getting high! FFS he calls himself an out of control satellite, a tiger who defies the law of gravity, a shooting star, and a race car! And if you wanna have a good time just call him and he'll throw a party and supply you with drugs. WHAT FUN! To put it all together, there wasn't a "Gay Issue" within Queen. I highly doubt any member was homophobic, how weird is it to have your best friend be gay and you're homophobic - it doesn't make sense. Probably the only "problem" which seems very minor, was the overtly gay material in a couple of songs that the rest of the band would have had a, rightfully so, problem with seeing as they're straight! It'd be just as weird to make a song about having sex with lots and lots of women, Freddie wasn't straight and they wouldn't want to isolate, or "rope out" as Brian says, any group of people. They kept it pretty general IMO. Wow, did I write a book there or what? |
pittrek 19.12.2009 07:10 |
Oh my God, are you trying to say that Freddie was ... ,,, gay ?????? |
Sebastian 19.12.2009 07:46 |
Don't Stop Me Now: I think Brian loves the song but hates the video (so do I BTW), as it happens with A Hard Life. Regarding Howard Stern: Dr May may (no pun intended) have avoided those sorts of questions because he didn't want them to be twisted. Remember that in showbiz, anything you say can be used against you. This very thread proves that! Regarding the documentary: He felt outraged about how Freddie's private life was being exposed; as a man who suffered a lot from media gossip, he surely related to it. He also complained about people slamming Michael Jackson without any proof (allegedly), and about the Townshend thing. He's surely a bloke with principles. Body Language: I don't think it's a gay issue. Besides the song being shite, Doc could've been concerned about losing their universal appeal. It's a shame he didn't apply that same rule to himself: it's a bit unfair (IMO) that the lads only played Teo Torriatte in Japan, as I'm sure loads of people in Europe, Oceania, Africa and the Americas would've enjoyed it too, even if speaking another language (wasn't it the whole point of Love of My Life?). By the way, a man who wrote 'tried to be a son and daughter rolled into one' and 'I want you to be a woman' wouldn't be homophobic IMO. I think it's been also established that the band sometimes felt uncomfortable about Fred's flamboyance, but it wasn't related to his sexuality per se. He could've been heterosexual and still worn those clothes, and they'd have felt ridiculous in the same amount. |
john bodega 19.12.2009 10:06 |
If I were Brian I'd be less mad about the gay thing and more mad that I had to snap my fingers like a douche .... |
TheRobin 19.12.2009 19:06 |
Zebonka12 wrote: If I were Brian I'd be less mad about the gay thing and more mad that I had to snap my fingers like a douche .... [img=/images/smiley/msn/omg_smile.gif][/img] But why!? LOL! They all looked so hot in that video! I watched it just last night, almost had a heart attack. |
Crisstti 20.12.2009 22:57 |
TheRobin wrote:Crisstti wrote: Further: "MAY: Yeah, another dimension. In fact, I can remember having a go at Freddie because some of the stuff he was writing was very definitely on the gay side. I remember saying, "it would be nice if this stuff could be universally applicable, because we have friends out there of every persuasion." It's nice to involve people. What it's not nice to do is rope people out. And I felt kind of roped out by something that was very overtly a gay anthem, like "Body Language"[Hot Space, 1982]. I thought it was very hard to take that in the other way. It's hard to talk about this. But there you go." Saying "some of the staff" clearly implies Brian is talking about more than one song. What anotehr song could he be refering to, apart from Body Language?. Don't Stop me Now is an obvious answer.I can understand where Brian is coming from in that quote, and I'm probably the LAST person on Earth who someone would call homophobic. Brian is saying that with some songs Freddie had (MAYBE) presented to the band were, as he said "on the gay side". Brian's problem is that the songs Freddie presented had no consideration for anything else with the band other than the "gay subject". Now Queen is 3/4 straight, if you have a song that is only about a "gay subject" it wouldn't be so democratic and everything would just be weird. Imagine you're Brian, Roger, or John and are playing a song where Freddie is talking about visiting gay clubs and dancing all over guys (this is ONLY AN EXAMPLE!), it'd be extremely awkward because you wouldn't dance all over guys being a straight man (I'm actually female but I'm only using an example). The "some of the stuff" part could have been discarded songs that the band refused to play, or Freddie realizing that he wasn't thinking of what the band would think about the unknown songs. Now, some songs may have been edited, like Body Language to tune down the gay hints, to make the rest of the band feel more included and have some say the direction of the song was going to take. NOW, why would ANYONE think the band might have disliked Freddie for his sexuality? I'm talking about the older posts in this topic. I don't think his sexuality influenced one single iota in the way the other guys perceived him. Brian and Freddie were best friends! Roger and Freddie were best friends! John and Freddie were best friends! The band were his best friends so why should something so minimal and pointless as one's sexuality make a difference in a friendship? It's ridiculous some of you would even think that. And Chrisstti, I never figured Don't Stop Me Now to be about anything gay. In an earlier post you said something about him saying, "I wanna make a supersonic man outta you." He says the same thing later about a woman. Anyways, I think the song is about using cocaine. It's obvious he's talking about getting high! FFS he calls himself an out of control satellite, a tiger who defies the law of gravity, a shooting star, and a race car! And if you wanna have a good time just call him and he'll throw a party and supply you with drugs. WHAT FUN! To put it all together, there wasn't a "Gay Issue" within Queen. I highly doubt any member was homophobic, how weird is it to have your best friend be gay and you're homophobic - it doesn't make sense. Probably the only "problem" which seems very minor, was the overtly gay material in a couple of songs that the rest of the band would have had a, rightfully so, problem with seeing as they're straight! It'd be just as weird to make a song about having sex with lots and lots of women, Freddie wasn't straight and they wouldn't want to isolate, or "rope out" as Brian says, any group of people. They kept it pretty general IMO. Wow, did I write a book there or what? A few things: I can understand what Brian was saying as well. But I really don't think it was fair to Freddie. I mean, it wasn't just up to Brian to decide that the songs had to represent them all. It appears he thought that's how it should be so he wrote songs that could be applied either way, but that wasn't just his decision to make. If Freddie wanted to write a song with romantic and/or sexual lyrics referring to men, I think he had a right to, and he must not have felt fine to have Brian (and maybe someone else in the band) tell him he shouldn't. I don't know if you're referring to me, but I certainly haven't said the band "disliked Freddie because of his sexuality". I don't think anyone has said that, actually. Brian and Freddie best friends?. That just wasn't that way. I'm not saying they weren't friends, but they certainly weren't best friends. According to everyone close to Freddie who has been asked about it, Freddie did not socialize with Brian outside of the band. The only band member with whom he socialized outside of the band was Roger. I'm a huge Beatles fan, and the difference is noticeable. the Beatles were best friends. They'd hang out all the time outside from the band. They'd be in each others houses, go on vacations together, spend New Year together. That wasn't the case with Queen (I'm not saying Freddie's sexuality had anything to do with that, by the way). Of course Don't Stop Me Now has gay references. (I'd actually say the whole song is about that, but I guess that's more open to discussion.) I find it surprising that people will say otherwise. English isn't my native language, but how could a line like "I'm a sex machine ready to reload, like an atom bomb, about to explode" not be about sex?. Add to that the "I wanna make a supersonic man out of you" (yes, he says woman one time, I'd say that's an example of a concession to Brian) and the shirt Freddie is wearing in the video (I already posted a link), and I think it's really clear what he's talking about. All the lines you refer to could very well refer to having sex. And the line about the car, remember he says "like Lady Godiva". If you read the link I posted about the shirt, that seems to me to be referring to that club as well. In any case, whether Brian had some homophobic feelings he was rationalizing or whether he was sincerely just concerned about "roping people out", the fact remains that by his own account, they did have a problem because of Freddie's sexuality. |
Crisstti 20.12.2009 23:08 |
Sebastian wrote: Don't Stop Me Now: I think Brian loves the song but hates the video (so do I BTW), as it happens with A Hard Life. Regarding Howard Stern: Dr May may (no pun intended) have avoided those sorts of questions because he didn't want them to be twisted. Remember that in showbiz, anything you say can be used against you. This very thread proves that! Regarding the documentary: He felt outraged about how Freddie's private life was being exposed; as a man who suffered a lot from media gossip, he surely related to it. He also complained about people slamming Michael Jackson without any proof (allegedly), and about the Townshend thing. He's surely a bloke with principles. Body Language: I don't think it's a gay issue. Besides the song being shite, Doc could've been concerned about losing their universal appeal. It's a shame he didn't apply that same rule to himself: it's a bit unfair (IMO) that the lads only played Teo Torriatte in Japan, as I'm sure loads of people in Europe, Oceania, Africa and the Americas would've enjoyed it too, even if speaking another language (wasn't it the whole point of Love of My Life?). By the way, a man who wrote 'tried to be a son and daughter rolled into one' and 'I want you to be a woman' wouldn't be homophobic IMO. I think it's been also established that the band sometimes felt uncomfortable about Fred's flamboyance, but it wasn't related to his sexuality per se. He could've been heterosexual and still worn those clothes, and they'd have felt ridiculous in the same amount. Don't Stop Me Now: Maybe, but what do you base that on?. I like the video, by the way (and love the song). Howard Stern: I haven't actually listened to the interview, just read a transcript. Listening to his voice would be helpful. Oh, I'm not twisting Brian's words at all. I actually bothered to look for the exact quote and link (which took very long), so that you all could see and judge by yourselves. I think what he says is very clear. The documentary: Sure Brian is a person with principles. One of the reasons I like him a lot. The issue of how right or wrong is to talk (do a documentary, a book, etc.) about someone is a complex issue, no doubt. A whole discussion in itself. But I would like to point out that, unlike the case of Michael Jackson and Peter Townshend, no one was saying anything bad about Freddie in that documentary. I didn't see anyone accusing him of anything. I tried to find what Brian said about it, but couldn't. I do seem to remember that he didn't seem just concerned about the privacy issue... but that's just how I remember it. Body Language: If he was concerned about them losing their universal appeal, that means that Freddie's sexuality was an issue in relation to that. Brian says it very clearly in that interview. I don't see the big deal. |
GratefulFan 21.12.2009 13:15 |
The gayest thing about Body Language was the men standing around snapping their fingers in what one had to conclude was a bathhouse. Lyrically, if anything, it sounds like he's talking about a woman. I suppose conceptually - once one witnessed men standing around snapping their fingers in a bathhouse - one might equate the term 'body language' with gaydar. I found 'Get Down Make Love' lyrically and atmospherically gayer by a magnitude. |
Crisstti 22.12.2009 13:59 |
GratefulFan wrote: The gayest thing about Body Language was the men standing around snapping their fingers in what one had to conclude was a bathhouse. Lyrically, if anything, it sounds like he's talking about a woman. I suppose conceptually - once one witnessed men standing around snapping their fingers in a bathhouse - one might equate the term 'body language' with gaydar. I found 'Get Down Make Love' lyrically and atmospherically gayer by a magnitude. Oh, I agree. But it's Brian who called Body Language a "gay anthem", so he either disagrees with us or the lyrics were somewhat changed from Freddie's original idea. |