| mike hunt 29.07.2009 03:39 |
I started thinking about this after hearing an interview with rob halford claiming that priest along with sabbath were the first bands to play metal. Sabbath was obviously the first true metal band, but priest?...the first priest record in 1974 was a rock/blues album that had no impact on the metal world, it wasn't until 1976 that priest released their first real metal album. By that time Queen already had their share of heavy songs like orge battle, great king rat, and stone cold crazy which were some of the heaviest music of it's day. Makes me Question why Queen arn't mentioned more as an influence on metal music?.... |
| pittrek 29.07.2009 03:45 |
mike hunt wrote: I started thinking about this after hearing an interview with rob halford claiming that priest along with sabbath were the first bands to play metal. Sabbath was obviously the first true metal band, but priest?...the first priest record in 1974 was a rock/blues album that had no impact on the metal world, it wasn't until 1976 that priest released their first real metal album. By that time Queen already had their share of heavy songs like orge battle, great king rat, and stone cold crazy which were some of the heaviest music of it's day. Makes me Question why Queen arn't mentioned more as an influence on metal music?.... Because most of the people know Queen as a pop band, since they know only the 80's stuff. I always say that Queen started as a heavy metal band, even when some people look strangely only me. BTW Sabbath and heavy metal ? BS were also a great blues band in the beginning, the same as Judas Priest, they just went heavier and heavier with each album |
| mike hunt 29.07.2009 04:04 |
my only issue with rob halford is when he say's priest along with sabbath were the first metal bands. I idolized priest as a kid, and still consider them my second favorite band of all time, but rob is full of himself sometimes. Bands like maiden, priest, metallica, anthrax, among others were influenced by queen, but the general public and media still don't bring them up as a big influence in that type of music. I think they had a bigger impact on metal than the average Joe realizes. |
| pittrek 29.07.2009 04:10 |
Definitely. Just watch ANY documentary about ANY heavy metal band where they talk about their influences. They mention Queen and they mention them with real respect |
| Micrówave 29.07.2009 04:47 |
mike hunt wrote: I started thinking about this after hearing an interview with rob halford claiming that priest along with sabbath were the first bands to play metal. Sabbath was obviously the first true metal band, but priest?...the first priest record in 1974 was a rock/blues album that had no impact on the metal world, it wasn't until 1976 that priest released their first real metal album. By that time Queen already had their share of heavy songs like orge battle, great king rat, and stone cold crazy which were some of the heaviest music of it's day. Makes me Question why Queen arn't mentioned more as an influence on metal music?.... Because when Queen came out, Heavy Metal was already in full swing. Jimi Hendrix's debut album, Are You Experienced (1967), was the first true Metal, I think. Purple Haze is identified by some as the first heavy metal hit. In 1968, the sound that would become known as heavy metal began to coalesce. That January, the San Francisco band Blue Cheer released a cover of Eddie Cochran's classic "Summertime Blues," from their debut album Vincebus Eruptum, that many consider the first true heavy metal recording. The same month, Steppenwolf released its self-titled debut album, including "Born to Be Wild," which refers to "heavy metal" in the lyrics. |
| Saif 29.07.2009 05:26 |
Micrówave wrote:I don't think any of the records you mentioned are metal at all. Hendrix and Steppenwolf were hard rock. Blue Cheer was IMO proto-punk/psychedelic rock. I know bands like Deep Purple and Led Zeppelin were considered metal by many in those days but even then there was a noticeable difference between their sound and that of a real metal band like Black Sabbath. Black Sabbath introduced the use of tritone, down-tuning, stuff like that... And as much as I love Queen, I don't see how the influenced Iron Maiden. True, Queen is a huge influence on progressive metal and power metal and also some heavy metal and thrash bands, maybe even melodic death metal. But Iron Maiden never admitted to nor showed any influence of Queen in their music. The only thing remotely connected to Queen in their music is their use of the Keep Yourself Alive riff during early tours which they often played at the end(or was it the beginning?) of their song "Sanctuary"(it goes "give me sanctuary from the law"...something like that). I know Bruce Dickinson is a big Queen fan and he mentioned that he cried when he first heard Who Wants To Live Forever. He also recorded an operatic cover of Bohemian Rhapsody with Montserrat Caballe on one of his solo albums but keep in mind that most of Maiden's music is written by Steve Harris, who isn't probably as big a Queen fan as Bruce. So the influence is null at best.mike hunt wrote: I started thinking about this after hearing an interview with rob halford claiming that priest along with sabbath were the first bands to play metal. Sabbath was obviously the first true metal band, but priest?...the first priest record in 1974 was a rock/blues album that had no impact on the metal world, it wasn't until 1976 that priest released their first real metal album. By that time Queen already had their share of heavy songs like orge battle, great king rat, and stone cold crazy which were some of the heaviest music of it's day. Makes me Question why Queen arn't mentioned more as an influence on metal music?....Because when Queen came out, Heavy Metal was already in full swing. Jimi Hendrix's debut album, Are You Experienced (1967), was the first true Metal, I think. Purple Haze is identified by some as the first heavy metal hit. In 1968, the sound that would become known as heavy metal began to coalesce. That January, the San Francisco band Blue Cheer released a cover of Eddie Cochran's classic "Summertime Blues," from their debut album Vincebus Eruptum, that many consider the first true heavy metal recording. The same month, Steppenwolf released its self-titled debut album, including "Born to Be Wild," which refers to "heavy metal" in the lyrics. |
| thomasquinn 32989 29.07.2009 05:34 |
"Steppenwolf" was described by critics as "metal" ("it's harder than rock; it's metal"), making them the first instance of the application of the name metal. Hendrix was much more blues and soul-oriented than the music we tend to describe as metal is. If we start counting him as metal, then Deep Purple, Led Zeppelin and basically every other hard-rock band is suddenly transformed into "metal". There is never a clear divide between genres, but I would argue against including Hendrix under metal. Steppenwolf I would not include either, but I would mention them and add that the application of the term to them indicates the shifting meaning attached to genre-names. |
| Jjeroen 29.07.2009 07:29 |
For Priest, I think it wasn't as much the music. It was the look of the band. With his black leather and stuff with pinns on, Rob Halfort kind of 'invented' the traditional metal-look. (How awkward, ey? How 'gay' styling became the image of the most masculine musicscene ;-) Definition of Heavy Metal though, goes further then just the musical sound. Of course the term heavy metal was invented much later then when the first -now regarded as- metal albums came out. In hinsight, Sabbath indeed should be the first widely known 'metal' band. In those early days musically they were just heavy r&b (Just like Zeppelin, Purple - who in their turn got their heavy sound from the likes of Hendrix and Cream). But it were the lyrics that made Sabbath different. They were the first to combine heavy riffs with lyrics about the occult, death, desaster, mysticism, Satan, hell, religious extremism, etc. |
| john bodega 29.07.2009 08:48 |
Yuck, genre discussion. A good band is it's own genre, fuck the rest of them! |
| The Real Wizard 29.07.2009 09:24 |
Black Sabbath's Paranoid came out in 1970. This is one of many reasons why Queen aren't considered pioneers of metal. They are known as an incredibly successful pop band. It's the path they chose. But when you change your sound so drastically part way into your career, it can be at the expense of your roots. Were they aware of that possibility at the time, or is it a hindsight thing? Only they know. With or without that popular success, the early Queen albums probably wouldn't be any better known. Consider this... if they had quit after A Day At The Races, would they be legends today, or would they be known for their five albums, perhaps only to a much smaller group of dedicated fans? There wouldn't be any stomp-stomp-clap at sporting events keeping Queen in the minds of tens of thousands of people every night, and there certainly wouldn't be Greatest Hits albums to acquaint new fans with the band so easily. |
| cacatua 29.07.2009 10:45 |
Micrówave wrote: mike hunt wrote: I started thinking about this after hearing an interview with rob halford claiming that priest along with sabbath were the first bands to play metal. Sabbath was obviously the first true metal band, but priest?...the first priest record in 1974 was a rock/blues album that had no impact on the metal world, it wasn't until 1976 that priest released their first real metal album. By that time Queen already had their share of heavy songs like orge battle, great king rat, and stone cold crazy which were some of the heaviest music of it's day. Makes me Question why Queen arn't mentioned more as an influence on metal music?....Because when Queen came out, Heavy Metal was already in full swing. Jimi Hendrix's debut album, Are You Experienced (1967), was the first true Metal, I think. Purple Haze is identified by some as the first heavy metal hit. In 1968, the sound that would become known as heavy metal began to coalesce. That January, the San Francisco band Blue Cheer released a cover of Eddie Cochran's classic "Summertime Blues," from their debut album Vincebus Eruptum, that many consider the first true heavy metal recording. The same month, Steppenwolf released its self-titled debut album, including "Born to Be Wild," which refers to "heavy metal" in the lyrics. I always thought that Steppenwolf's heavy metal thunder referred to the heavy metal of Harley motorcycles and the thunder of their exhaust! |
| PauloPanucci 29.07.2009 13:03 |
Yeahh.. i think jimi H. did 1º h.metal!! the people today have a bad image about havy metal!! |
| Micrówave 29.07.2009 13:24 |
There is no clear definition of Heavy Metal, in the musical sense. Although I don't think "tritone, down-tuning, stuff like that" is the clincher. If anything, Heavy Metal MUST have the use of the guitar as the LEAD driving force. What Hendrix did back in '67 was something so new, so undefined, that it INDEED WAS Heavy Metal. Listen to John and George's guitar... then listen to Jimi's. No, he wasn't playing "Heavy Metal music", but he had invented a sound that became the ignitor to a new genre. No, Mitch Mitchell was not a Heavy Metal drummer, but Ginger Baker was. No one was doing THAT to the bass drum like Ginger was. So I must stand firm in my belief that Jimi Hendrix invented Heavy Metal... it just took a few years and some band evolution before it caught on. With regard to the argument that Jimi, Steppenwolf, etc. are not Heavy Metal, but rather hard rock... I would refer you to Ian Anderson, who is still laughing his head off about that, while Lars Ulrich is still pouting. Zing! |
| ANAGRAMER 29.07.2009 14:04 |
Being old enough to remember the NWOHM (new wave of heavy metal) in late 70's-80's, Queen were kinda 'lumped-in' with them, mainly on the strength of their early work which preceeded the emergence of Iron Maiden. Def Leppard et al By that time, Queen had progressed beyond their 'hard-rock' phase although, as most of us know, there was certainly a token gesture to the genre on each of the albums at that time (Jazz-The Game-even Flash and Hot Space!) In terms of actual influence on these acts, you really didn't hear that in the records made at the time although Joe Elliot/G'nR's/Metallica are cleary fans of the band What does put Queen in the same genre as heavy metal acts is Brian's (sometimes) Hendrix-style approach to solo work even in some of the most pop-oriented Queen work Queen's influence on actual recording artist comes, I think, much later: The Darkness. Jetliner, Extreme, even Scissor Sisters. And today, their work is referenced by current bands if you listen closely enough! |
| lalaalalaa 29.07.2009 15:58 |
I think Stone Cold Crazy was a major influence on thrash. I even consider it to be the first thrash song. |
| L-R-TIGER1994 29.07.2009 19:17 |
Read it somewhere that the album Queen is according to many critics the best heavy metal album of all time,don't know if it is that much,but definitely Queen has a huge influence on the heavy metal we know today. |
| mike hunt 30.07.2009 01:30 |
Saif wrote:And as much as I love Queen, I don't see how the influenced Iron Maiden. True, Queen is a huge influence on progressive metal and power metal and also some heavy metal and thrash bands, maybe even melodic death metal. But Iron Maiden never admitted to nor showed any influence of Queen in their music. The only thing remotely connected to Queen in their music is their use of the Keep Yourself Alive riff during early tours which they often played at the end(or was it the beginning?) of their song "Sanctuary"(it goes "give me sanctuary from the law"...something like that). I know Bruce Dickinson is a big Queen fan and he mentioned that he cried when he first heard Who Wants To Live Forever. He also recorded an operatic cover of Bohemian Rhapsody with Montserrat Caballe on one of his solo albums but keep in mind that most of Maiden's music is written by Steve Harris, who isn't probably as big a Queen fan as Bruce. So the influence is null at best.Micrówave wrote:I don't think any of the records you mentioned are metal at all. Hendrix and Steppenwolf were hard rock. Blue Cheer was IMO proto-punk/psychedelic rock. I know bands like Deep Purple and Led Zeppelin were considered metal by many in those days but even then there was a noticeable difference between their sound and that of a real metal band like Black Sabbath. Black Sabbath introduced the use of tritone, down-tuning, stuff like that...mike hunt wrote: I started thinking about this after hearing an interview with rob halford claiming that priest along with sabbath were the first bands to play metal. Sabbath was obviously the first true metal band, but priest?...the first priest record in 1974 was a rock/blues album that had no impact on the metal world, it wasn't until 1976 that priest released their first real metal album. By that time Queen already had their share of heavy songs like orge battle, great king rat, and stone cold crazy which were some of the heaviest music of it's day. Makes me Question why Queen arn't mentioned more as an influence on metal music?....Because when Queen came out, Heavy Metal was already in full swing. Jimi Hendrix's debut album, Are You Experienced (1967), was the first true Metal, I think. Purple Haze is identified by some as the first heavy metal hit. In 1968, the sound that would become known as heavy metal began to coalesce. That January, the San Francisco band Blue Cheer released a cover of Eddie Cochran's classic "Summertime Blues," from their debut album Vincebus Eruptum, that many consider the first true heavy metal recording. The same month, Steppenwolf released its self-titled debut album, including "Born to Be Wild," which refers to "heavy metal" in the lyrics. maiden was influenced by Queen. Great king rat had that maiden style going before maiden even recorded a record. Also, the phantom of the opera on the first record had to be redone because the producer thought it sounded to much like queen. halford also mentioned that he was influenced by queen2. If you listen to the priest album sad wings of destiny you'll hear that influence. |
| Jjeroen 30.07.2009 05:37 |
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| mike hunt 31.07.2009 10:47 |
lalaalalaa wrote: I think Stone Cold Crazy was a major influence on thrash. I even consider it to be the first thrash song. I don't know about the first thrash song, but it was pretty heavy for it's time. How about orge battle?....Queen were doing the halford style screams before halford was doing it. They should get more credit for that. I think halford was definitely influenced by queen2 and the sceams on those early queen albums. |
| lalaalalaa 31.07.2009 17:41 |
mike hunt wrote:lalaalalaa wrote: I think Stone Cold Crazy was a major influence on thrash. I even consider it to be the first thrash song.I don't know about the first thrash song, but it was pretty heavy for it's time. How about orge battle?....Queen were doing the halford style screams before halford was doing it. They should get more credit for that. I think halford was definitely influenced by queen2 and the sceams on those early queen albums. Well just listen to that riff and those drums. It's at least proto-thrash. |
| mike hunt 31.07.2009 17:58 |
yea, it did have that thrash feel. Especially the riff. If only roger did the double bass drum. |
| lalaalalaa 31.07.2009 18:04 |
mike hunt wrote: yea, it did have that thrash feel. Especially the riff. If only roger did the double bass drum. Well, he can't come up with everything ;) |
| MmP 01.08.2009 00:21 |
I'd rather say that Queen started pretty heavier than people think. At the tme it was a heavy rock band I think, since the terms have changed so much now. What then was heavy, now it's progressive rock. I really don't think Queen early stuff was "heavy" perse, it was pretty different from common rock ar the time. It all ends up in terms according to time. Back then it was heavy, but not heavy metal because it had armonies. Now if you listen it's hard rock. But it's fair to have called it heavy in that time.I agree that may have influenced some musicians that later were called heavy metal. |
| lalaalalaa 01.08.2009 10:35 |
MmP wrote: I'd rather say that Queen started pretty heavier than people think. At the tme it was a heavy rock band I think, since the terms have changed so much now. What then was heavy, now it's progressive rock. I really don't think Queen early stuff was "heavy" perse, it was pretty different from common rock ar the time. It all ends up in terms according to time. Back then it was heavy, but not heavy metal because it had armonies. Now if you listen it's hard rock. But it's fair to have called it heavy in that time.I agree that may have influenced some musicians that later were called heavy metal. So you are saying it can't be heavy metal if it has harmonies? I disagree. I think you can have heavy metal with harmony. |
| MmP 01.08.2009 13:02 |
lalaalalaa wrote:MmP wrote: I'd rather say that Queen started pretty heavier than people think. At the tme it was a heavy rock band I think, since the terms have changed so much now. What then was heavy, now it's progressive rock. I really don't think Queen early stuff was "heavy" perse, it was pretty different from common rock ar the time. It all ends up in terms according to time. Back then it was heavy, but not heavy metal because it had armonies. Now if you listen it's hard rock. But it's fair to have called it heavy in that time.I agree that may have influenced some musicians that later were called heavy metal.So you are saying it can't be heavy metal if it has harmonies? I disagree. I think you can have heavy metal with harmony. Nah, I meant that nowadays heavy metal (pure heavy metal, I think) It's not as melodic as Queen first years. That's why it has no comparison. |
| PauloPanucci 01.08.2009 13:27 |
today we don't have a clean image about Havy metal.... havy metal change a lot sice it was created! |
| believe in yourself 45455 01.08.2009 18:05 |
Queen showed since their beginning that it's okay for a 'hard rocking band' to play more than just one style. While in the 70's other hard rock bands played only rock, blues and ballads. I don't think that metal bands were inspired by Queen to play metal, but I do believe it's mainly Freddie's achievement that metal/rock bands dare to bring some more variation, like harmonies, in their music. It took bands like Metallica and Def Leppard many years to do that! Btw. I saw a documentary about Queen in which Slash said how much they inspired them. He told the same in a documentary about Black Sabbath...and Aerosmith... |
| PauloPanucci 01.08.2009 18:41 |
i think Queen can influency a lot of parts of the musics!!! Queen did each music with a diferent "style",, it means,, it's not just rock... you know???? so Queen can influence a lot of bands and styles!!! |
| SaskQueenFan 04.08.2009 19:52 |
How about the Troggs- Wild Thing... to me that is the definition of a heavy metal song. |
| bhm0129ad 04.08.2009 19:59 |
Queen may have influenced metal to a degree, but in my opinion, it is a good thing that they didn't stick to a hard rock formula full stop. If they had, then like many of those early bands mentioned, their careers would have been very short lived, and there is every chance we would never have heard of them uless we were proper metal heads who looked for EVERYTHING ever released. TYMD was the only real 'rock' tune that was or could be considered a 'hit' by Queen - even 7 seas was not THAT big a hit and is only on GH1 because it was the first 'successful' song. Perhaps the segment in Bo Rhap is more influential than ANY of their album material - that bit gets EVERYONE going, and if they had stuck to just being hard rockers, Bo Rhap would probably not have ever been. Edited just to add, that I STILL consider Queen's Stone Cold Crazy as the greatest rock song ever committed to tape :) |
| lalaalalaa 04.08.2009 21:29 |
Queen was an influence to Metallica (or James Hetfield at least), one of the most successful metal bands around (although I prefer Megadeth) |
| August R. 05.08.2009 04:44 |
bhm0129ad wrote: TYMD was the only real 'rock' tune that was or could be considered a 'hit' by Queen - even 7 seas was not THAT big a hit and is only on GH1 because it was the first 'successful' song. 7SOR reached #10 on UK charts while TYMD didn't even make it to top30. There's a reason why TYMD wasn't on GH and 7SOR was included. |
| bhm0129ad 05.08.2009 19:30 |
August R. wrote:bhm0129ad wrote: TYMD was the only real 'rock' tune that was or could be considered a 'hit' by Queen - even 7 seas was not THAT big a hit and is only on GH1 because it was the first 'successful' song.7SOR reached #10 on UK charts while TYMD didn't even make it to top30. There's a reason why TYMD wasn't on GH and 7SOR was included. Fair point, but TYMD WAS included in GF2 (unlike 7seas) and was a staple at the concerts.I still think that TYMD was influential - there is a Maiden track which has a similar riff - though the title escapes me atm (so much for being an ex Maiden nut LOL) |
| lalaalalaa 05.08.2009 20:25 |
bhm0129ad wrote:August R. wrote:Fair point, but TYMD WAS included in GF2 (unlike 7seas) and was a staple at the concerts.I still think that TYMD was influential - there is a Maiden track which has a similar riff - though the title escapes me atm (so much for being an ex Maiden nut LOL)bhm0129ad wrote: TYMD was the only real 'rock' tune that was or could be considered a 'hit' by Queen - even 7 seas was not THAT big a hit and is only on GH1 because it was the first 'successful' song.7SOR reached #10 on UK charts while TYMD didn't even make it to top30. There's a reason why TYMD wasn't on GH and 7SOR was included. There's also a Maiden track (Mother Russia) similar to Was It All Worth It. |
| bhm0129ad 05.08.2009 21:46 |
According to a youtube video, it was written in 1990, so wether it was influenced by WIAWI is very questionable actually. I have no idea how accurate that information is though. nb, I did not look it up to prove you wrong, but to have a listen, I happened to read that info in the comments bit. |
| lalaalalaa 05.08.2009 22:12 |
bhm0129ad wrote: According to a youtube video, it was written in 1990, so wether it was influenced by WIAWI is very questionable actually. I have no idea how accurate that information is though. nb, I did not look it up to prove you wrong, but to have a listen, I happened to read that info in the comments bit. I already knew about that, but it doesn't always take a long time to write a song. Sometimes it just comes straight to you and you finish it in a day. Maybe they had most of the album done around late 89 or early 90 and wrote Mother Russia after hearing Was It All Worth It. Who knows ;) |
| mike hunt 06.08.2009 00:37 |
I heard the song mother russia, and never heard a Queen influence. |
| mike hunt 06.08.2009 00:40 |
lalaalalaa wrote: Queen was an influence to Metallica (or James Hetfield at least), one of the most successful metal bands around (although I prefer Megadeth) well, If you listen to master of puppets you'll hear some of the guitar sounds have a Queen influence. also, Dave mustain did say he liked Queen. I'm not sure if they influenced him though. |
| lalaalalaa 06.08.2009 14:44 |
mike hunt wrote:lalaalalaa wrote: Queen was an influence to Metallica (or James Hetfield at least), one of the most successful metal bands around (although I prefer Megadeth)well, If you listen to master of puppets you'll hear some of the guitar sounds have a Queen influence. also, Dave mustain did say he liked Queen. I'm not sure if they influenced him though. Mustaine's biggest influence is Led Zeppelin, but I wouldn't be suprised if he liked Queen since when James and him were young they probably enjoyed similar music. |
| lalaalalaa 06.08.2009 14:45 |
mike hunt wrote: I heard the song mother russia, and never heard a Queen influence. I didn't say it was an influence but it sounds similar. The intros of both songs are similar (maybe not influenced but similar). |
| pittrek 06.08.2009 15:15 |
SaskQueenFan wrote: How about the Troggs- Wild Thing... to me that is the definition of a heavy metal song. So that's why it's considered one of the first punk songs, right ? |
| pittrek 06.08.2009 15:15 |
QueenPaulo wrote: today we don't have a clean image about Havy metal.... havy metal change a lot sice it was created! hEavy metal, please :-) |
| pittrek 06.08.2009 15:16 |
lalaalalaa wrote: Queen was an influence to Metallica (or James Hetfield at least), one of the most successful metal bands around (although I prefer Megadeth) I wouldn't say "influence", they (James and Lars at least) are just fans |
| August R. 08.08.2009 07:01 |
pittrek wrote:SaskQueenFan wrote: How about the Troggs- Wild Thing... to me that is the definition of a heavy metal song.So that's why it's considered one of the first punk songs, right ? Punk song? According to who??? (and please, don't say Wikipedia) |
| PauloPanucci 08.08.2009 17:57 |
pittrek wrote:QueenPaulo wrote: today we don't have a clean image about Havy metal.... havy metal change a lot sice it was created!hEavy metal, please :-) sorry...i type wrong!! |
| its_a_hard_life 26994 08.08.2009 21:17 |
THREE WORDS: STONE COLD CRAZY. I believe that song influenced THRASH METAL bands like Metallica and Megadeth etc etc .... I saw Metallica last weekend live at Knebworth (Sonisphere Festival) and they played Stone Cold Crazy in their setlist. They gave a brief speech about how Queen have obviously influenced them, and SCC is a pre-thrash song. |
| mike hunt 09.08.2009 00:53 |
pittrek wrote:lalaalalaa wrote: Queen was an influence to Metallica (or James Hetfield at least), one of the most successful metal bands around (although I prefer Megadeth)I wouldn't say "influence", they (James and Lars at least) are just fans If you listen to the guitar style "Orchestra" in some of kirk hammets guitar tone you'll hear an influence. |
| SaskQueenFan 09.08.2009 14:22 |
pittrek wrote:SaskQueenFan wrote: How about the Troggs- Wild Thing... to me that is the definition of a heavy metal song.So that's why it's considered one of the first punk songs, right ? This song was recorded in the 60's.. conisdered more heavy metal than punk.. if you have read John Densmore's book Riders on the Storm.. he called it heavy metal... punk was purely a 70's creation. |