QueenZone discussion #1188835

princetom wrote: Mr. Bad guy most likely was for the money, not for the music...it's just a bunch of songs...

princetom wrote: some of the songs were worth of further treatment. the album's done in a hurry. just pop. that's all.

Grantcdn1 wrote: Why was Mr. Bad Guy a flop??? Simple:  BECAUSE BRIAN AND ROGER WEREN'T INVOLVED (funnily enough it is the same argument people use when they complain about the limited success Brian and Roger have had with Cosmos Rocks) - Queen always said that the group was always better together than individually.... also funnily enough....he tried to get a guitarist to sound like Brian And seriously....it lacked drums...it lacked guitar...it lacked variety....most Queen fans still wanted a rock album His vocals are great as expected on most tracks.... People have often said on here that Freddie WAS Queen....and Queen was all about Freddie... but lets face it, if Freddie left in 73 and tried to be an Elton John, David Bowie, Gary Glitter, etc....he wouldn't have made it unless he found some really good musicians and musical partners like Brian and Roger to help him hone his skills and write songs skillfully....if he didn't he would have run out of chances and we would have never known about him. I also agree with Serry's substitution comments....can't see why She Blows Hot and Cold was left off it, (and the remakes, and left off the Made in Heaven album - it would have been the closest thing to a rocker on that one)

  MmP wrote: Of course, the results in terms of music are not Freddie's best. But I wonder why it failed even with Freddie's putting effort on it. He was a great composer, it's rare not to see even one good hit. When you have Freddie's talent at least one good song has to come out of it and eventually become a hit but I don't really see it there. There are great songs  Mr Bad Guy, Made In Heaven, I Was Born To Love You,  Man Made Paradise. But no hit song at all, really strange to me. And even more strange is that great songs have came up from people mixes! We all know the 3 or 4 from Living on My Own that are great but: Fooling Around and My Love Is Dangerous remixes are just miles better than the originals!. I don't know what Freddie tried to do with this album but rarely s seemed to struggle. He seems to have something but did not quite got there enough a perfect probe of this: Let's Turn It On (which seems more like a good project of song, with great idea but not there at all). By the wat My Love Is Dangerous Jeff Lord-Alge remix it's just marvellous, even more if you comparte it with the original track, which seems a demo actually...

louvox wrote:  Who the hell wanted to hear an outdated disco/techno/dance offering that sound flat, inspired & badly recorded. 

Simon Brown wrote: Oh, and the drummer should be shot. Must be some of the most emotionless limp-dicked drumming ever commited to record.

Zebonka12 wrote:

Simon Brown wrote: Oh, and the drummer should be shot. Must be some of the most emotionless limp-dicked drumming ever commited to record.

No way, that award goes to "Face Dances" by The Who.  Kenney Jones is a totally competent drummer but if there's one guy that doesn't sound like he 'gets' The Who, it was him.  Case in point; Zak Starkey shows up and the music is fun to listen to again.

Yara wrote: One thing is saying that Mr. Bad Guy sucks. It's ok. Claiming that Freddie couldn't go much far on his own is a different story. And as a claim it's quite unfair. It's nice to accept such version of the facts because then we can accept Brian and Roger's failures much easier - not even Queen fans know much about their solo work, let alone non-Queen fans. But things are not that simple. Freddie didn't have the time to develop a solo career. He got ill and got aware of his illness about the mid-80's and from then on his health condition declined quite fast. Even so, Barcelona was way more successful as a project and as a way of projecting him as an artist than the solo stuff by Brian and Roger - Barcelona gradually became a very well-known project among Queen fans and non-Queen fans alike. Some people remember Freddie mainly from Live Aid and Barcelona. Barcelona is genuinely creative and inventive. It was something original and explored a much more different soundscape than Roger and Brian's solo albums.  I realized the extent of Freddie's creativity when I got the Freddie box set. He was such a promising solo artist. He left a lot of interesting material and even his songs from Mr. Bad Guy had a lot of potential - set to proper arrangements, I think some songs are definitely good. The amount of demos he left shows how versatile an artist he was.  So I can fully agree with the argument that Mr. Bad Guy was a flop. But I can't by no means agree with the conclusion some are tempted to draw from it: Freddie without Queen couldn't go much far either. That's not true - he could. Barcelona proved it. And he barely had the time to develop a solo career.      

  Yara wrote: One thing is saying that Mr. Bad Guy sucks. It's ok. Claiming that Freddie couldn't go much far on his own is a different story. And as a claim it's quite unfair. It's nice to accept such version of the facts because then we can accept Brian and Roger's failures much easier - not even Queen fans know much about their solo work, let alone non-Queen fans. But things are not that simple. Freddie didn't have the time to develop a solo career. He got ill and got aware of his illness about the mid-80's and from then on his health condition declined quite fast. Even so, Barcelona was way more successful as a project and as a way of projecting him as an artist than the solo stuff by Brian and Roger - Barcelona gradually became a very well-known project among Queen fans and non-Queen fans alike. Some people remember Freddie mainly from Live Aid and Barcelona. Barcelona is genuinely creative and inventive. It was something original and explored a much more different soundscape than Roger and Brian's solo albums.  I realized the extent of Freddie's creativity when I got the Freddie box set. He was such a promising solo artist. He left a lot of interesting material and even his songs from Mr. Bad Guy had a lot of potential - set to proper arrangements, I think some songs are definitely good. The amount of demos he left shows how versatile an artist he was.  So I can fully agree with the argument that Mr. Bad Guy was a flop. But I can't by no means agree with the conclusion some are tempted to draw from it: Freddie without Queen couldn't go much far either. That's not true - he could. Barcelona proved it. And he barely had the time to develop a solo career.      

Zebonka12 wrote:  I think Mr. Bad Guy stands as a solid reminder that *at that time*, Freddie would've been no good without Queen.  Earlier than that, or later (if he hadn't had AIDS), who knows what he would have been capable of. The record shows that his first solo album wasn't very good, for whatever reason.  It had interesting ideas, but so did TCR.  It's not Brian/Roger fan jealousy to say that Freddie didn't do so well on his own because on his first album that was true.  And on his second album there was a lot more collaborating going on. I think, at least in the 80's, that Freddie benefited more from creating with others than he did by himself.

Holly2003 wrote: As for Barcelona, it's not Queen but it's not a solo artist efort either: it's as much a Monserrat album as it is Fred's.

Holly2003 wrote: MrBad Guy still sucks though :p 

Yara wrote:

  Zebonka12 wrote:  I think Mr. Bad Guy stands as a solid reminder that *at that time*, Freddie would've been no good without Queen.  Earlier than that, or later (if he hadn't had AIDS), who knows what he would have been capable of. The record shows that his first solo album wasn't very good, for whatever reason.  It had interesting ideas, but so did TCR.  It's not Brian/Roger fan jealousy to say that Freddie didn't do so well on his own because on his first album that was true.  And on his second album there was a lot more collaborating going on. I think, at least in the 80's, that Freddie benefited more from creating with others than he did by himself.

Holly2003 wrote: Hmm... amazing how two people can view the same thing and come to opposite conclusions. For me, the mix, production, and over-use of synths really overwhelms any positive aspects. Some songs are okay, some catchy, but there's nothing particualrly special about anything. I haven't listened to the album for as long as I can remember. Really can't stand that 80s sound. As for Barcelona, it's not Queen but it's not a solo artist efort either: it's as much a Monserrat album as it is Fred's.

Grantcdn1 wrote: Freddie was an amazing talent but he also needed the great minds of others to let him shine....that is way I have not been particularly impressed with his solo material...some of Mr Bad Guy was pretty good....Barcelona was better due to collaboration...when I listen to the Freddie Box set though I think...there are some interesting ideas but he needed to get some in the hands of someone like Brian,Roger, even Mike Moran etc... Similarly with Brian...he sounded way better with Cozy Powell than some crappy programmed drum machine...and with a vocalist like Freddie he could be great...

mike hunt wrote: barcelona's not a solo album?....that means back to the light isn't a brian may solo album, it's a brian + cozy album. Don't try to be smart, you Just make yourself look dumb.

shazamrock wrote:

  mike hunt wrote: barcelona's not a solo album?....that means back to the light isn't a brian may solo album, it's a brian + cozy album. Don't try to be smart, you Just make yourself look dumb.

Barcelona is not a solo album.  Freddie may have co-written and produced the entire thing, but, even if one wants to conveniently ignore Montserrat in the artist listing, by definition, this album of duets is not a solo album. It is a solo project with regards to the Queen umbrella, but not as an album in its own right.

mike hunt wrote:

  Holly2003 wrote: Hmm... amazing how two people can view the same thing and come to opposite conclusions. For me, the mix, production, and over-use of synths really overwhelms any positive aspects. Some songs are okay, some catchy, but there's nothing particualrly special about anything. I haven't listened to the album for as long as I can remember. Really can't stand that 80s sound. As for Barcelona, it's not Queen but it's not a solo artist efort either: it's as much a Monserrat album as it is Fred's.

your trying too be cute now,  barcelona's not a solo album?....that means back to the light isn't a brian may solo album, it's a brian + cozy album. Don't try to be smart, you Just make yourself look dumb.

  Holly2003 wrote:  

      mike hunt wrote:      

              Holly2003 wrote:       Hmm... amazing how two people can view the same thing and come to opposite conclusions. For me, the mix, production, and over-use of synths really overwhelms any positive aspects. Some songs are okay, some catchy, but there's nothing particualrly special about anything. I haven't listened to the album for as long as I can remember. Really can't stand that 80s sound. As for Barcelona, it's not Queen but it's not a solo artist efort either: it's as much a Monserrat album as it is Fred's.      

your trying too be cute now,  barcelona's not a solo album?....that means back to the light isn't a brian may solo album, it's a brian + cozy album. Don't try to be smart, you Just make yourself look dumb.

You should start your own forum, then you won't have to listen to anyone else's opinions.

mike hunt wrote:

      Holly2003 wrote:      

              mike hunt wrote:              

                              Holly2003 wrote:               Hmm... amazing how two people can view the same thing and come to opposite conclusions. For me, the mix, production, and over-use of synths really overwhelms any positive aspects. Some songs are okay, some catchy, but there's nothing particualrly special about anything. I haven't listened to the album for as long as I can remember. Really can't stand that 80s sound. As for Barcelona, it's not Queen but it's not a solo artist efort either: it's as much a Monserrat album as it is Fred's.              

your trying too be cute now,  barcelona's not a solo album?....that means back to the light isn't a brian may solo album, it's a brian + cozy album. Don't try to be smart, you Just make yourself look dumb.

You should start your own forum, then you won't have to listen to anyone else's opinions.

now that's an idea, I still say back to the light and barcelona are equally solo albums.  This debate is nonsense anyway. Who really gives a rats ass.  like anyone really cares you think Mr. bad guy sucks. Never mind that freddie solo (lover of life) did better on the charts than TCR did. How old is freddie's solo stuff?...decades old, and it out sold 3 so called legends new stuff.  By the way, the great pretender was awsome. Perfectly sung and did pretty well on the charts.  Thank you very much!

Angeline wrote: I completely agree that Barcelona IS a solo album.  Mike Moran, as a classically trained musician may have brought Freddie's piano compositions to live but they were at the core, Freddie all over.  Oh and Mr. Rice through in the odd lyric, but come on - to deny that the creation was Freddie's is either to be unfair or just facetious. Also Monserrat just sang (apart from maybe, Ensueno) and in my opinion her voice ruined songs like Golden Boy (no blame at her feet just think the mix of styles didn't gel) How can you say that isn't a solo effort? Who (apart from maybe Trent Reznor) plays all the instruments on their solo albums?  Elton didn't even write most of his lyrics and usually had an orchestra.  Also considering how pedantic Freddie was with song's arrangements he was much more involved in album production that may other artists whose work would be considered a 'solo' project.

whitequeen2 wrote: Answer why anything does't sell well is marketing. Personnally I believe that Queen was not properly promoted.

mike hunt wrote: I agree, that's all cabelle did was sing what freddie wrote for her,  so that means back to the light and another world wern't solo albums. Cozy played drums. Brian didn't write the lryics to "too much love will kill you" and brian had help writng some other songs on the album.

shazamrock wrote: Agreed.  :)

Yara wrote: No, no, no, no, sir. ; -))) I reignited this argument and I'm the one entitled to say when it's over.

      Queen On Ice wrote:               I beg to differ - for one thing, the Tribute Concert was '92, but after two massive no.1s with CLLTC and the Smash AOBTD, Queen were fairly well known in the US way before 93.               AOBTD was in the top five best selling singles in the US for quite a while from what I have read in the past.              

rhyeking wrote: The '80s was a decade of MTV one hit wonders in the US, matched only by '50s. Every week people were listening for the next big hit. When that hit came, it lasted a week and then grew stale. It wasn't an era in pop music where too many artists or bands could survive with long-term careers unless they went all out and embraced the synth-pop sounds or went in the direction of big hairband power ballads. For every Michael Jackson and Madonna, there were hundreds of wannabes and we had to suffer through it. It was a horribly self-concious decade, but sadly not very self-aware. Self-awareness would come in the '90s. When you hear "Retro '80s" on the radio and you think, "Gee, there was some decent music in the '80s," what you're hearing is a fraction of the crap that was flooding the airwaves. Some good music came out, but 97% of what we saw on MTV (or in Canada on Much Music) and heard on the radio was garbage and it has not survived. It's not available on iTunes or CD because sweet Jesus, it was seriously bad. So, that's why Queen never had too many real hits in the US after The Game, compared to their UK chart numbers. You could almost say they were too good for the market. Every now and then they'd dent the charts with something like "Radio Ga Ga," but because they didn't commit to warping their sound to be trendy, they didn't do much business here. Capitol Records didn't do much to help, so they ditched CR in 1990 and went with Hollywood Records, who did a whackload of promotion and re-issues in 1991. With that climate, in 1985, enter Freddie with a solo project, which is well-produced and very pop-oriented, but with not a lot of promotion, no tour and a sound born out of the gay dance clubs of New York, and yeah, the album won't do much. Is the album dated? Sure, but no more so than Sheer Heart Attack is very '70s dated. But hey, '70s classic rock is in vogue right now, so no one cares. Remember the early '90s, when Grunge ruled the land? You were looked down upon for listening to anything older than 1987. '70s rock was old foggie music and if you tried to put a Duran Duran album on, forget it! You'd be a beaten to a pulp on general principal. If you don't think trends in music exist, ask yourself how much Michael Jackson you've heard since his death, played with impunity on the radio and on TV. Now, how much did you hear just before he died? Not much, because since his death he's gone from a creepy, rich celebrity with a possibly unhealthy attitude towards children to a tragic pop god who we all choose to remember in his Thriller glory days! Maybe a release of the FM + MJ demos will give Mr Bad Guy some much deserved retroactive appreciation in the public consciousness. Who knows...

Queen On Ice wrote: Forgive me, but as a public forum, even as the thread starter, you surely cannot in all seriousness 'declare a thread closed'. If people feel they want to continue to contibute to a a thread then it is their perogative Yara. That is how it works. Sometimes threads are brought back from years ago, one or two  recently have been here on QZ. I am not being disrespectful, I am just pointing this out. If you really insist that you want no more replies in your thread (a concept I find, frankly, a bit strange), then you need to ask the moderating team to lock it. :)

Yara wrote:

Queen On Ice wrote: Forgive me, but as a public forum, even as the thread starter, you surely cannot in all seriousness 'declare a thread closed'. If people feel they want to continue to contibute to a a thread then it is their perogative Yara. That is how it works. Sometimes threads are brought back from years ago, one or two  recently have been here on QZ. I am not being disrespectful, I am just pointing this out. If you really insist that you want no more replies in your thread (a concept I find, frankly, a bit strange), then you need to ask the moderating team to lock it. :)

I feel so humiliated. I expected people to be more sympathetic to my plight. OK - if a thread is more important to you than a human being, yes!, that's the issue, so be it. Go on with the thread and destroy my honor and self-esteem. (an absent-minded Yara caressing the blade of a sharp knife next to the bosom) :-)))