| StoneColdClassicQueen 25.12.2008 18:34 |
How's everyone's holiday so far? Lash out about crappy presents, drunk relatives knocking over your trees, little kids blowing out candles from your menorah (did i spell it right?), and more in this thread! Hope you all had a safe holiday. |
| Ms. Rebel 25.12.2008 18:57 |
Are you talking about today's day? Mine is actually quite interesting. Oh God, who am I fooling?? It's lame and boring. I'm at home whole day watching Christmas movies. :( |
| Freya is quietly judging you. 25.12.2008 19:42 |
Are we all calling Christmas "holidays" now? How vomit inducingly politically correct. |
| Matias Merçeauroix 25.12.2008 19:46 |
It's holidays here. HERE HERRRRRRR WWWWWW :R |
| StoneColdClassicQueen 25.12.2008 19:54 |
Oh come on now! Here I am trying to make a silly thread so that you guys can share bad holiday experiences and no, when I refer to holidays, it means any holiday you might celebrate. This thread does not discriminate against non-Christmas holidays. I was only trying to take my mind away from my winter break due to the fact that I've had the worst vacation ever. It's nothing but grief, sorrow, drama, and trouble in my house. You know what? I'm not even gonna post today anymore. I should just log off now. Good day. |
| Ms. Rebel 25.12.2008 20:31 |
StoneColdClassicQueen wrote: Oh come on now! Here I am trying to make a silly thread so that you guys can share bad holiday experiences and no, when I refer to holidays, it means any holiday you might celebrate. This thread does not discriminate against non-Christmas holidays. I was only trying to take my mind away from my winter break due to the fact that I've had the worst vacation ever. It's nothing but grief, sorrow, drama, and trouble in my house. You know what? I'm not even gonna post today anymore. I should just log off now. Good day. Fuck 'em. Write about whatever you want. |
| Freya is quietly judging you. 25.12.2008 20:40 |
StoneColdClassicQueen wrote: Oh come on now! Here I am trying to make a silly thread so that you guys can share bad holiday experiences and no, when I refer to holidays, it means any holiday you might celebrate. This thread does not discriminate against non-Christmas holidays. I was only trying to take my mind away from my winter break due to the fact that I've had the worst vacation ever. It's nothing but grief, sorrow, drama, and trouble in my house. You know what? I'm not even gonna post today anymore. I should just log off now. Good day. Silly you, you missed my point. I was simply opposing to the fact that instead of saying "Happy Christmas" people now say "Happy Holidays" so's not to offend non-Christian types. I say offend 'em. "Happy Holidays" sounds stupid, and is just overly politically correct. |
| Sergei. 25.12.2008 23:03 |
My Christmas was quite alright---Present wise, it was good. Cheer wise, not nearly as good. :P I got "Cabaret" and "Immortal Beloved" on DVD! Huzzah! I'll go and watch one of them now. EDIT: Why do all my posts have that annoying arrow? I guess the interwebs don't like me. |
| littlekillerham 26.12.2008 10:56 |
I didnt get any of the record i want, and my younger bro got a bike AND and ipod, making me the only one in me house without an ipod. :( Also, my large present is gonna cost me more money to decorate cuz its a dollhouse, and how am i gonna save up $300 for an ipod and decorate that at the same time. Also, my mom didnt make me shower(good and bad thing), and i havent showered since sunday. :) |
| littlekillerham 26.12.2008 10:57 |
Wtf was so bad about your holidays? |
| littlekillerham 26.12.2008 10:58 |
StoneColdClassicQueen wrote: Oh come on now! Here I am trying to make a silly thread so that you guys can share bad holiday experiences and no, when I refer to holidays, it means any holiday you might celebrate. This thread does not discriminate against non-Christmas holidays. I was only trying to take my mind away from my winter break due to the fact that I've had the worst vacation ever. It's nothing but grief, sorrow, drama, and trouble in my house. You know what? I'm not even gonna post today anymore. I should just log off now. Good day. Really, what waz so bad about ur holidays? How is it the worst vacation ever? |
| magicalfreddiemercury 26.12.2008 11:06 |
Freya is quietly judging you. wrote: Silly you, you missed my point. I was simply opposing to the fact that instead of saying "Happy Christmas" people now say "Happy Holidays" so's not to offend non-Christian types. I say offend 'em. "Happy Holidays" sounds stupid, and is just overly politically correct. I like the idea of "Happy Holidays". I live in a rather diverse area and "Happy Holidays" seems to be a warm and wide greeting to all rather than a very narrow and presumptuous "Merry Christmas". As for how the holdiay was... mine was great. I bought several small things for my 13 year old and one grand gift. Well, that grand gift - a guitar - put the cheesiest grin on her face and a squeal in her voice. Her reaction wiped out any negativity that might have passed our way. It was the last thing she held last night and the first thing in her hands this morning. |
| its_a_hard_life 26994 26.12.2008 12:06 |
I never say "Happy Holidays" I just say "Merry Christmas" :S Anyway... YEAH, MY CHRISTMAS WAS AWESOME. I got loa a a a a a a ads of presents. What was important was spending time with my family, having a laugh, drinking, eating, the videos and pictures. MEMORIES. Bring on the New Year!!!! Paaaaaaaartaaaaaaaayyy all night long. [img=/images/smiley/msn/devil_smile.gif][/img] |
| Ms. Rebel 26.12.2008 18:24 |
its_a_hard_life wrote: I never say "Happy Holidays" I just say "Merry Christmas" |
| Raf 26.12.2008 19:21 |
Freya is quietly judging you. wrote:StoneColdClassicQueen wrote: Oh come on now! Here I am trying to make a silly thread so that you guys can share bad holiday experiences and no, when I refer to holidays, it means any holiday you might celebrate. This thread does not discriminate against non-Christmas holidays. I was only trying to take my mind away from my winter break due to the fact that I've had the worst vacation ever. It's nothing but grief, sorrow, drama, and trouble in my house. You know what? I'm not even gonna post today anymore. I should just log off now. Good day.Silly you, you missed my point. I was simply opposing to the fact that instead of saying "Happy Christmas" people now say "Happy Holidays" so's not to offend non-Christian types. I say offend 'em. "Happy Holidays" sounds stupid, and is just overly politically correct. I'm not Christian, I do not follow any kind of religion, I don't believe there's a God and I think you Christians are hypocrites. Unless you stop wasting food and money on Christmas, donate all the excessive food to those who really need it and use the money to help them, the whole meaning of Christmas is bullshit. It's just a holiday made for us to stop working for a couple of days in order to spend lots of money with presents and then eat like pigs. Your religion (I didn't even know you were a Christian...) tells you to always spread love to your brothers and sisters, especially on this occasion - and you use this occasion to offend them...? Sometimes I feel I'm more "Christian" than most Christians I know, and I'm a fucking atheist. |
| Freya is quietly judging you. 26.12.2008 20:13 |
I'm an atheist Raf, you prune. You've missed my point. Nothing to do with beliefs or religion, it's just the political corrrect-ness of it all that annoys me. I suppose you could just say people saying "Happy Holidays" instead of "Merry Christmas" really grinds my gears. It's just a pet hate of mine. |
| Raf 26.12.2008 20:53 |
Being politically correct isn't wrong (as the name suggests). I do get your point if we're talking about hypocrisy. If we're talking about people who speak publically against the use of the word "nigger" in songs, but wouldn't hire a black person, for example. Unless you really care about the whole meaning behind Christmas, maybe it's more sincere to simply say "Happy Holidays", and people will understand you want them to enjoy their late December/early January break no matter if they're gonna actually celebrate Christmas following Christian traditions or if they'll just party all day and night and not even think about the whole meaning behind these holidays. |
| Charlie Brown 27.12.2008 01:28 |
StoneColdClassicQueen wrote: Oh come on now! Here I am trying to make a silly thread so that you guys can share bad holiday experiences and no, when I refer to holidays, it means any holiday you might celebrate. This thread does not discriminate against non-Christmas holidays. I was only trying to take my mind away from my winter break due to the fact that I've had the worst vacation ever. It's nothing but grief, sorrow, drama, and trouble in my house. Hi Lizvette! It stinks that you didn't enjoy Christmas vacation. I and i'm sure many other people have had to endure frustrating relatives and friends during holiday seasons. So you are a member of a pretty big club if thats any consolation. Persevere and overcome. And that blowing out the candles on a menorah is bad! Hanukkah Harry ( the jewish santa) refuses to bring even a single gift to a kid who extinguishes the menorah. |
| Ms. Rebel 27.12.2008 06:48 |
Raf, please shut up. Thank you. :) |
| Raf 27.12.2008 07:17 |
Ms. Rebel wrote: Raf, please shut up. Thank you. :) How did that comment contribute to the discussion? |
| Ms. Rebel 27.12.2008 08:13 |
Raf wrote:Ms. Rebel wrote: Raf, please shut up. Thank you. :)How did that comment contribute to the discussion? What you wrote about Christians and Christmas is total bullshit. I respect other religions, I even respect you atheist, although 80% of you are stupid airheads which want to look "different" than others. |
| Raf 27.12.2008 08:23 |
Ms. Rebel wrote:Raf wrote:What you wrote about Christians and Christmas is total bullshit. I respect other religions, I even respect you atheist, although 80% of you are stupid airheads which want to look "different" than others.Ms. Rebel wrote: Raf, please shut up. Thank you. :)How did that comment contribute to the discussion? And where did you get that fact from? I know a few other atheists - and all of them are rather clever people, and they do NOT brag about being atheists, neither try to look cool, different or rebel. They simply believe there's no God out there. Treasure Moment is an exception. I wouldn't call him an airhead, though. Most likely vacuumhead. ;) |
| Poo, again 27.12.2008 08:45 |
I'm with Freya on this one. I don't believe in Jesus (or anything else like that), but still I like to wish people a merry Christmas. Hey, I even celebrate Christmas. Happy Holidays is very annoying to hear. What about people who don't celebrate anything during this time of year? Atheists? Muslims? Buddhists? Or adherents to any of the countless religions and/or philosophies out there? Go ahead and be presumptious and wish them happy holidays. So much for caring for minorities. |
| Ms. Rebel 27.12.2008 08:45 |
@ Raf: I know many, and trust me, they DO try to look different. They are acting like they are center of the universe and also like they are the smartest people on this freaking planet. They are are putting on some "tolerant" act but they are frustrated people full of prejudices and all they do is bark about how they don't believe in God and how Christians and people who belong to some other religion are hypocrites. Mind your own business, will you (I'm talking about the group of people, not you)? Are they helping other people, going to institutions for kids with special needs, bringing them toys and spending their time with people who TRULY need someone's help and company? I don't think so, they just BARK about it. Haven't seen any atheist turning his words into deeds. Every single person has right to believe in something, or like you in NOTHING. You have no right to say that Christians are hypocrites because they aren't. Saying this you are insulting many people on this forum and you don't seem like a person who likes to do that, you are acting more like some 'tolerant' guy as far as I know. Plus, many Christians are well known saints, they refused to live normal life for others sake and happiness. Mother Teresa for instance, ever heard of her? Won Nobel Prize for Peace in 1979 if that rings a bell. But prize is NOT important, that prize isn't making her what she was, her deeds are. Christians believe in God and are celebrating this Holiday with their families and friends, it is also time to think of other people, the ones who aren't that lucky, time to be generous and kind with each other. We didn't make out Christmas to spend our money on decorations or using it as an excuse, like you said; because we don't want to work. It is a TRADITION for CENTURIES. |
| Poo, again 27.12.2008 08:53 |
Jesus surely wouldn't approve of the Roman Catholic church of today, or any other church for that matter. The Christian faith is hypocritical in many ways, at least the way it is commonly interpreted today. There, am I insulting you now, Ms. Rebel? Am I not entitled to air my own opinion? P.S - Jesus was a communist. |
| Ms. Rebel 27.12.2008 09:18 |
Poo, again wrote: Jesus surely wouldn't approve of the Roman Catholic church of today, or any other church for that matter. The Christian faith is hypocritical in many ways, at least the way it is commonly interpreted today. There, am I insulting you now, Ms. Rebel? Am I not entitled to air my own opinion? P.S - Jesus was a communist. Jesus lived 2000 years before communism and you don't know what communism actually is. It is a most hypocritical political system in 20th century. Even more than Nazism. And you are talking about Roman Catholic church like it is equality of all it's followers. We all know that there are some faults made by the church but you can't compare those kind of things with people who belong in it. Even priests are sometimes in confrontation between themselves. And Pope John Paul II apologized for all the mistakes that have been made by church through whole history. In that way, you are only able to see things in black and white and you don't believe that there are so many people out there who consider themselves Christians and they are also very generous human beings. For you, anyone who considers himself as a religious person is someone with the "defect". In that way, you are as bad as people who you are judging in here. Being a true Christian is trying to be good person as more as it's possible. That is something that people like you simply cannot understand. |
| Raf 27.12.2008 09:45 |
"Are they helping other people, going to institutions for kids with special needs, bringing them toys and spending their time with people who TRULY need someone's help and company? I don't think so, they just BARK about it. Haven't seen any atheist turning his words into deeds." I've never been afraid to say what I do to help the world: Hardly anything at all. And I'm not ashamed to say why, either: Because I don't have to. That, and many other things often cause some so-called "left-wingies" and slightly more religious people to rage at me. But then, what do THEY do, other than BARK about how we should help our brothers and sisters, and blablabla...? I can safely say I do more than most people who bark at me. The difference between us is, I say there's very little I SHOULD do, but I DO it. They say there's a lot we should do, but they don't actually do anything. My words may be cold, but their actions are much colder. And that's why I insist they are hypocrites. "Every single person has right to believe in something, or like you in NOTHING. You have no right to say that Christians are hypocrites because they aren't. Saying this you are insulting many people on this forum and you don't seem like a person who likes to do that, you are acting more like some 'tolerant' guy as far as I know." Yes, I have the right to believe in nothing. Yet I have to follow laws made by Christians and for Christians. If all I had to put up with was a bunch of people saying "Merry Christmas", who would actually mind it? But you can't forget, for example, that abortion is still illegal in many places, and whenever the governments try to change it, several different Christian churches moan about it. Here in Brazil, the Catholic church is the biggest responsible for this kind of thing. The Pope criticized our anti-AIDS program, because the government gives us free condoms. When a law was made to set the rules for stem cell research back in 2005, the church moved a legal action against the government to stop it, and only THIS YEAR we managed to make the law valid and start our researches. Abortion has been discussed several times here too, and guess who has been making strong opposition...? If even Christians themselves say everyone should be free to follow whatever religion they want, why do they try to impose theirs through LAWS? My country (and many others) aren't made only of Christians. I don't see the crime behind having sex for pleasure, and I want to protect myself to avoid diseases and to avoid having a baby before I'm ready to be a father. My family is full of heart problems: a dead grandfather, 3 grandparents depending on medicines for the rest of their lives, and my mother already taking medicines to keep her blood pressure regular. If stem cells can make my heart younger and healthier by the time my bad genes start playing their role, I want the right to use them and have a better life without having to take expensive medicines with undesirable side effects. If in the future my lady and I decide to have a baby, and we find out the baby will die shortly after s/he is born, we might want to abort it, rather than carry it for 9 months just to watch our own son/daughter die at the hospital, to spare us from the pain. If I have kids, I want them to learn what Science says about how we were born, not what Christianism says about it. Some churches have fought in Brazil to force schools to teach Creationism instead of Evolutionism at school. I don't believe any of those things I want is wrong, but those who think so force me to act like it is. If Christian leaders want RESPECT and TOLERANCE, they should spread their own rules INSIDE their churches, to those who want to hear it, rather than try to impose them to everyone. I guess you wouldn't feel comfortable if my group had the power and we abolished all sorts of churches and religious books, claiming they spread lies to people. Christians HAVE already been chased, over a millenium ago. Are those memories still alive? Can any of you even imagine what it's like to have your own habits and beliefs forbidden? Do you remember how it feels to be a minority? "Plus, many Christians are well known saints, they refused to live normal life for others sake and happiness. Mother Teresa for instance, ever heard of her? Won Nobel Prize for Peace in 1979 if that rings a bell." What about the Age of Enlightenment? Many important people from their era were atheists, and without them, we could still be living in countries where kings can do whatever they want, aristocrats have privileges and the Catholic church itself would be supporting the whole system and ignoring the suffering of millions of people. "Christians believe in God and are celebrating this Holiday with their families and friends, it is also time to think of other people, the ones who aren't that lucky, time to be generous and kind with each other." And how many of you DO think about the ones who aren't that lucky and actually do something about it? "We didn't make out Christmas to spend our money on decorations or using it as an excuse, like you said; because we don't want to work. It is a TRADITION for CENTURIES." And being a tradition for centuries is a good thing...? How many revolutions did it take us to reach our current state of freedom, and how many traditions had to be destroyed in the process, since they were among the main causes of the problem...? Since this is a Queen forum... While we live according to race, colour or creed While we rule by blind madness and pure greed Our lives dictated by tradition, superstition, false religion Through the aeons, and on and on Oh yes we'll keep on trying We'll tread that fine line Oh oh we'll keep on trying Till the end of time Till the end of time Instead of making Christmas a holiday where we swap presents and eat lots, why can't the tradition tell us to help those who need it? It could be a holiday where, instead of not working, we work helping people for free for one day. Or discuss ideas to make the world a better place for everybody. Or you Christians could apologise once a year to a Muslim for the Crusades, to a Jew for the centuries of discrimination, or to Pagans and Atheists for the centuries of murder and tortures. |
| magicalfreddiemercury 27.12.2008 09:51 |
What's so ridiculous in this discussion is the idea that Atheists do not donate part of their lives to helping others. Charity, it's implied, is only a Christian thing. "Are they helping other people, going to institutions for kids with special needs, bringing them toys and spending their time with people who TRULY need someone's help and company? I don't think so, they just BARK about it. Haven't seen any atheist turning his words into deeds." I've never been at a charity event where I've charted how many people belonged to a religious or non-religious group. People are there to help - who cares what, if any, religion they have. Giving time, money and/or ideas to those in need is not something only those of one religious faith or another will do. And - having come at this from both sides during my life - I'd say more Atheists bring with them a genuine desire to help whereas many of those coming with the church do so out of a sense of some future reward. I'll take the genuine gesture over the other any time. I doubt these points will be accepted though, since, in my experience, there are more defenders of religion than actual and honest believers. EDIT: Brilliant post, Raf. |
| Ms. Rebel 27.12.2008 11:29 |
Both of you can't see the forest because there are too many trees, so I'm gonna stop wasting my time because you're not worth it. I hope someday you'll understand. |
| Freya is quietly judging you. 27.12.2008 17:17 |
I fear people read far too much into my post. *sigh* |
| Poo, again 27.12.2008 19:17 |
Ms. Rebel wrote:Poo, again wrote: Jesus surely wouldn't approve of the Roman Catholic church of today, or any other church for that matter. The Christian faith is hypocritical in many ways, at least the way it is commonly interpreted today. There, am I insulting you now, Ms. Rebel? Am I not entitled to air my own opinion? P.S - Jesus was a communist.Jesus lived 2000 years before communism and you don't know what communism actually is. It is a most hypocritical political system in 20th century. Even more than Nazism. And you are talking about Roman Catholic church like it is equality of all it's followers. We all know that there are some faults made by the church but you can't compare those kind of things with people who belong in it. Even priests are sometimes in confrontation between themselves. And Pope John Paul II apologized for all the mistakes that have been made by church through whole history. In that way, you are only able to see things in black and white and you don't believe that there are so many people out there who consider themselves Christians and they are also very generous human beings. For you, anyone who considers himself as a religious person is someone with the "defect". In that way, you are as bad as people who you are judging in here. Being a true Christian is trying to be good person as more as it's possible. That is something that people like you simply cannot understand. Ow, I think you read too much into that. I don't see how what I said equals to me believing that religious people are "defect". And let's not get into a political debate here, as we're already a bit off topic. I wouldn't think less of anyone personally because of their religious affiliation. That would be very ignorant. But I can't help but recall there being an interesting passage in the New Testament, and it goes something like this: "42 And they continued stedfastly in the apostles' doctrine and fellowship, and in breaking of bread, and in prayers. 44 And all that believed were together, and had all things in common; 45 And sold their possessions and goods, and parted them to all men, as every man had need. " Oh, I like that last part. From wikipedia, on Christian communism. |
| Ms. Rebel 28.12.2008 06:42 |
^You are probably talking about ideals that Karl Marx brought out which later have been used as pattern for communistic regimes. There is a big difference between those regimes and Marx's teachings. If you read it, you'll realize that communism was supposed to happen in countries like USA and not in the poor ones as Cuba or Czechoslovakia. So when you say that Jesus was a communist is as same as saying that Jesus was a dictator like Stalin. *laughs* Jesus and his apostles were talking about giving your possessions to the ones who need it more than you do; that's not called "communism". Communism used promotion of social cares and needs as excuse for totalitarianism and establishment of terror. Jesus is something quite opposite to that. |
| Raf 28.12.2008 07:50 |
It's amazing how Beata often doesn't understand what's been said, and always acts like she understands it better than all of us. Beata, Poo was just pointing out that some parts of the Bible paint Jesus as someone who had certain ideas about sharing stuff and ensuring everyone has the basic stuff they need to live, which are quite similar to some of Karl Marx's ideas. Just like on the Jazz thread, you're talking without doing a bit of research. Poo mentioned his source, but did you even bother taking a look at it before saying he was wrong? link "If you read it, you'll realize that communism was supposed to happen in countries like USA and not in the poor ones as Cuba or Czechoslovakia" Where the hell did that come from? True, ideal, marxist communism should happen more urgently on POOR countries, not rich ones. When a country is poor, it doesn't mean EVERYONE in the country is poor. In pretty much all of them there a few extremely rich groups, and a very large group of extremely poor people. In countries like the USA, like most of Europe, money and resources in general are better distributed. Most citizens have access to decent, comfortable lives. Where is it more urgent to redistribute the money: In a country where, let's say, 0.5% of the population owns more than half the money available and over 70% of the population starves, or in a country where nearly everyone belongs to the middle class? Besides that, Marx himself wanted the revolution to take over the whole world. He NEVER mentioned it should happen on this country, or that country. Just read the final bit of the Communist Manifesto: The Communists disdain to conceal their views and aims. They openly declare that their ends can be attained only by the forcible overthrow of all existing social conditions. Let the ruling classes tremble at a Communistic revolution. The proletarians have nothing to lose but their chains. They have a world to win. Workers of the world, Unite! "Communism used promotion of social cares and needs as excuse for totalitarianism and establishment of terror." And Christianity uses promotion of God for the same reasons, then. Right? Communism doesn't defend totalitarianism. Communism governments did so. Communism is, in fact, the FINAL stage of Marx's socialism: First, there's a revolution, to get rid of the government. Then, a socialist dictatorship takes over, performs radical changes in the whole system in order to make all farms, factories etc property of everyone, ensure everyone will have a job and get everything they need. And finally, once everything's working fine, the dictatorship goes away, and the whole nation works without any sort of government. This final stage is what Marx called Communism. Anarchism basically is a communist revolution that skips the socialist dictatorship. Communism has never existed in our world. Just like Marx, Jesus (no matter if he existed or not, if he really was the son of God or just some crazy hippie) had some interesting ideas to make the world a better place for everyone, and some bastards distorted those ideas and used them in order to earn lots of power and spread terror for years, centuries. I don't mean to insult anyone, but true Christianism and true Communism are dead. All we have lived are heavily distorted versions of both, that have very little to do with what the original "creators" had imagined. Marx would've probably been disappointed to see what people did with his ideas. And what about poor Jesus, then...? I doubt he'd accept to be a "Christian" nowadays. Both ideas are very beautiful written in books, but simply dangerous in real life. |
| Poo, again 28.12.2008 07:57 |
Yes, communism must be an evil monster masquerading as a loving ideology. And the church is in no way a mere tool for supressing the masses. An impoverished African farmer having to feed a starving family may endure a lifetime of backbreaking hard work. But it's all good. God loves him, right? As long as he's being a good person he'll go to heaven. Right? |
| Ms. Rebel 28.12.2008 10:05 |
Raf, everything that you wrote is wrong. Please, read some of the Marx's work and them come here to criticize me. You don't have any knowledge about basic principles of his doctrines. So, it's completely waste of time for me to explain you everything or should I say anything. For instance, when i say that communism supposed to happen in countries like USA I didn't deny the fact that Marx said that revolution must include whole world. I mentioned USA just to describe how that world of revolution supposed to look like. As I see, you don't have any idea about Marx's dialectic materialism since he accentuated capitalization and economic prosperity as the final faze before revolution takes it's place. I'm not saying that America is the right country for something like that but it is more closer to that than any post communistic country. Please try to understand that you don't know shit and I'm tired of trying to convince you on that and then to teach you something new. :) |
| Raf 28.12.2008 11:15 |
"As I see, you don't have any idea about Marx's dialectic materialism since he accentuated capitalization and economic prosperity as the final faze before revolution takes it's place." You were right at one point: I had never read much about dialectical materialism. So, I read about it before coming back here, and you're talking bollocks. Marx's dialectical materialism is a philosophical concept, it's his way to try to explain something, not an ideal we're supposed to pursuit. Karl Marx did NOT defend capitalization, neither economic prosperity (not the way we see it in Capitalism, at least): "Karl Marx posited that socialism would be achieved via class struggle and a proletarian revolution which represents the transitional stage between capitalism and communism". To him, the world is capitalist now. We make a revolution, go through a transitional stage to prepare society for communism, then we reach communism. LENIN was the one who used capitalism in the whole process. Since Russia's economy had been completely ruined, he came up with the New Economic Policy, a set of capitalist policies to save Russia from a huge economical collapse, to then start preparing it for communism. But it wasn't necessarily part of his ideology. Neither Lenin nor Marx believed it was necessary to make a set of capitalist decisions before moving on to communism. Lenin did it to avoid a major collapse. See link "Please try to understand that you don't know shit and I'm tired of trying to convince you on that and then to teach you something new." Like I didn't know shit about jazz and ragtime and you were trying to teach me something new? |
| Poo, again 28.12.2008 16:18 |
Meh, I don't agree with any of you. I'll just send you both off to any available random concentration camp in the wilderness as soon as the revolution's over. |
| StoneColdClassicQueen 29.12.2008 00:02 |
well my holidays sucked because someone died.... now the family is in crisis. i hate being stuck in this house. it's bull.... |
| Ms. Rebel 29.12.2008 11:04 |
Poo, again wrote: Meh, I don't agree with any of you. I'll just send you both off to any available random concentration camp in the wilderness as soon as the revolution's over. Hahahaha. |
| Ms. Rebel 29.12.2008 11:04 |
StoneColdClassicQueen wrote: well my holidays sucked because someone died.... now the family is in crisis. i hate being stuck in this house. it's bull.... [img=/images/smiley/msn/sad_smile.gif][/img] |
| littlekillerham 04.01.2009 14:17 |
StoneColdClassicQueen wrote: well my holidays sucked because someone died.... now the family is in crisis. i hate being stuck in this house. it's bull.... who died |