QueenZone discussion #1123961

Obama CHANGE and the Chicago Machine

Saint Jiub
19.08.2008 23:36		 I am so proud that I have been quoted as anti-Obama. ;)
Here is the link with the quote:
link
Obama's hypocracy about "Change" has not been pointed out by the liberal USA media, and the local Chicago media have barely mentioned it.
Obama has shrewdly endorsed the Chicago Democratic Machine as well as corrupt and inept Ilinois politics.
YourValentine
20.08.2008 06:33		 You have changed, Mike ;)
thomasquinn 32989
20.08.2008 12:56		 Apart from the fact that the above is total bullshit (his *STAFF* might have endorsed the above, he has not), what do you choose? A no-strings-attached politician who may or may not have some very weak links with a political machine, or a veteran politician of whom we *KNOW* that he is attached to dozens of institutions, lobbyists and political machines?
Anyone voting Republican in the coming elections is sufficiently stupid to run for office him/herself.
Music Man
20.08.2008 14:18
ThomasQuinn wrote: Anyone voting Republican in the coming elections is sufficiently stupid to run for office him/herself.
It's not like you can say any better for someone who votes Democratic...
Mr.Jingles
20.08.2008 15:28		 Here's what I think about the upcoming elections.
THE GOOD NEWS: Either candidate would be a much president than Bush (because just about anyone can)
THE BAD NEWS: Neither one will be capable of cleaning up the mess left from the past 8 years.
Saint Jiub
20.08.2008 19:42		 link
Keep laughing, Caspar.
Obama's currently undefined "change" will only be good for the politically connected.
thomasquinn 32989
21.08.2008 11:36		 Bullshit. This is just the standard Republican campaign of subversive fear mongering. They do it every time they feel threatened: leak some dirt to appropriate places, true or false, as long as it's damaging, it doesn't matter.
There is much more dirt in the Republican party of this day and age than in the Democracy, which is itself far from clean, but still better than the Grand Old Party.
Polls worldwide show that a very large majority (usually between 70%-80% of the national population) of most countries' populations strongly favor a Democratic candidate. Voting for warhawk McCain will alienate the rest of the world, especially with economic recession brewing as it is right now.
Music Man
21.08.2008 11:53
ThomasQuinn wrote: Bullshit. This is just the standard Republican campaign of subversive fear mongering. They do it every time they feel threatened: leak some dirt to appropriate places, true or false, as long as it's damaging, it doesn't matter. There is much more dirt in the Republican party of this day and age than in the Democracy, which is itself far from clean, but still better than the Grand Old Party. Polls worldwide show that a very large majority (usually between 70%-80% of the national population) of most countries' populations strongly favor a Democratic candidate. Voting for warhawk McCain will alienate the rest of the world, especially with economic recession brewing as it is right now.
Yes, McCain kinda sucks. Like, a lot. However, why is it "leaking questionable dirt" when it's against a Democratic candidate, but it's "true" when it's against a Republican candidate?
AspiringPhilosophe
21.08.2008 12:41
Mr.Jingles wrote: Here's what I think about the upcoming elections. THE GOOD NEWS: Either candidate would be a much president than Bush (because just about anyone can) THE BAD NEWS: Neither one will be capable of cleaning up the mess left from the past 8 years.
AMEN Danny! I'm totally with you on this one.
Is there anyone who really thinks that any politician is above the system? I suppose that people who are that naive still exist. Despite messages of "Change" and what not, politics is still politics. I'm not saying Obama couldn't clean it up a bit from the inside if he was in a position to do so, but you can't get onto the inside without playing the game. Where do all the political idealists wind up? Political oblivion. Like it or not, you can't win elections without playing the game. That can only be changed from the inside, and so far we haven't had a candidate with enough guts to do that. Too many backs to scratch after they've helped you get to the inside.
Besides, all Obama's message of "Change" refers to is if he's elected. If he's inside, he'll change things. Sure enough he's paid lip service to running a clean campaign, but all Presidential candidates have promised that since the 19th Century, and NO ONE has yet done it.
@ndy38
21.08.2008 14:02
Music Man wrote:
ThomasQuinn wrote: Anyone voting Republican in the coming elections is sufficiently stupid to run for office him/herself.
It's not like you can say any better for someone who votes Democratic...
I partially agree with this, although i have just lost faith in everything.
Micrówave
21.08.2008 15:44
ThomasQuinn wrote: A no-strings-attached politician
You are really in your own little world, aren't you?
inu-liger
21.08.2008 18:37
ThomasQuinn wrote: Bullshit. This is just the standard Republican campaign of subversive fear mongering. They do it every time they feel threatened: leak some dirt to appropriate places, true or false, as long as it's damaging, it doesn't matter. There is much more dirt in the Republican party of this day and age than in the Democracy, which is itself far from clean, but still better than the Grand Old Party. Polls worldwide show that a very large majority (usually between 70%-80% of the national population) of most countries' populations strongly favor a Democratic candidate. Voting for warhawk McCain will alienate the rest of the world, especially with economic recession brewing as it is right now.
For once, I'll agree with you.
I feel the same way about this bullshit that Gym Showerstall Bitch is trying to spread.
inu-liger
21.08.2008 18:38
Microhwave wrote:
ThomasQuinn wrote: A no-strings-attached politician
You are really in your own little world, aren't you?
Since when do politicians ever enter the politics game for nothing?
That's a contradiction in terms there, almost like 'an honest politician'.
Saint Jiub
21.08.2008 20:21		 As a Chicago suburban resident for most of my life, I have known of Durbin's (the other US senator from Illinois) and Obama's nepotism endorsement of Stroger Jr for over two years.
As indicated in two of my links, both of Chicago's major newspapers have reported on this slimy endorsement. It is no secret in the Chicago area. The authors of both of these Chicago newspaper links are left-leaning.
These links were easy to Goooogle: Stroger endorsement Durbin Obama
... and thanks to Stroger Jr ... Chicago now has the highest sales tax rate (10%) of any largish US city.
space cow
22.08.2008 06:25		 an honest politician doesn't exist, those are two opposite terms. Living in a part of the world that's not USA I beg you, please, do not vote for that senile McCain - every time there's a republican president leading your country, the rest of the world ends up in a total mess.
The republican foreign policy is a total disaster, and I've had it for these 8 years. So think of us non-US-citizens when you vote, it effect us more than you think.. at least your democrat presidents don't try to rule our lives at such a large scale as the republicans do. thank you!
Music Man
22.08.2008 10:57		 That's right...Democratic Presidents just try to rule OUR lives instead...
But hey, we'll take one for the team this election.