The Real Wizard 31.07.2008 14:21 |
link So, in other words, unless people who were on the bus would have spoken up, the RCMP would have covered this one up too... ? We're getting more and more like the US every day. Thanks, Uncle Steve, I mean, PM Harper. |
Micrówave 31.07.2008 16:34 |
That's why I never ride the bus. Hey Treasure Moment: Does this kind of thing ever happen on the "short" bus? |
inu-liger 31.07.2008 17:33 |
"Caton said the victim boarded in Edmonton, was Aboriginal in appearance, was wearing hip-hop clothing and appeared to be around 20 years of age." Well FUCK yeah. That would explain a lot, knowing those jackass indians that live in this city, especially downtown (I am from Edmonton, so this does not surprise me one bit). Sorry if I sound racist, but I do not feel sorry for this guy or his family at all. |
john bodega 31.07.2008 22:37 |
Right. I guess some people just deserve beheadings then? *shrugs* That's what I call a world-view! |
Lester Burnham 31.07.2008 22:55 |
inu-liger wrote: "Caton said the victim boarded in Edmonton, was Aboriginal in appearance, was wearing hip-hop clothing and appeared to be around 20 years of age." Well FUCK yeah. That would explain a lot, knowing those jackass indians that live in this city, especially downtown (I am from Edmonton, so this does not surprise me one bit). Sorry if I sound racist, but I do not feel sorry for this guy or his family at all.So you think an unprovoked beheading is justified simply because of what he was wearing? What the hell is wrong with you? That's like me saying that an innocent black man who was beheaded in Philadelphia deserved it simply because he was wearing baggy jeans and a long white T-shirt. |
Sergei. 31.07.2008 23:19 |
Imagine the chaos there must have been on that bus, and the driver trying to calm them down. "All right ladies and gentlemen, have a seat, let's ALL not lose our heads.." D: [/Bad joke] On that note, that's pretty fucked. Goddamn baboons. |
inu-liger 01.08.2008 00:09 |
Well, perhaps I did take it too far with what I said. I was in a bit of a bad mood earlier. But SOMETHING must have made the guy attack and kill the aboriginal guy next to him, whether or not he did or didn't provoke him. It could not have just been THAT random that he decided on the spot that very second to pull out a weapon (Don't they check carry-ons for that kind of shit???). And I don't mean to say that the guy deserved it simply by being Native. For that, I'll apologize, since it did seem to be implied very much. But for all we know, the guy coulda said something to him at the bus station here prior to boarding the bus, or during one of the pit stops (breaks), cos the news reports DID say the victim boarded the bus in Edmonton, and Manitoba is only two provinces away from mine. I think if I read correctly, it didn't happen too long after they crossed the Saskatchewan-Manitoba provincial border, since this was very late at night when it did happen. I don't have anything against different races, mind you. I'm not a racist person by heart. I have lots of friends who are of various races. To be honest, I really shouldn't have anything against native people really. I've met a few very nice people that are Aboriginals. But honestly though, I think I really don't care for them much now, because when it comes to dealing with customers at work and co-workers sometimes, I find the rudest and most verbally violent (at least) are the Aboriginal people, especially the homeless and drunk ones that reside downtown (partly thanks to the shelters being right nearby) and also make up a good portion of the Aboriginal population downtown. So you COULD say I'm basing my biased opinion of them on a small portion of their own people on the drunk and homeless. Also, a lot of the native teenagers here (especially the males) have a huge preference for dressing up MTV gangster/50 Cent-style in order to look tough like they rule the town, and a lot of the girls dress up like sluts (though they're not the only ones who do that, needless to say....there are just as many caucasian girls who are also like that, but I find a lot of the native girls have a huge urge seeming that they HAVE to 'dress sexy', and look like they HAVE to get laid a lot.....or so I think when I seem them dressed like that in public). And I'm not the only one I think who feels the way I do about not caring for the Aboriginal population here, really. When I talk to some of my friends otherwise about the girls here and what types they would date, they often would say they would never date the native girls here cos, like I said, a lot of them dress up very slutty, and frankly for a good part of it, are not very attractive. The media here also tends to have a very indirectly implied bias against the natives. If you read a lot of the news articles here describing crimes and robberies where they're asking for any info on suspects, a lot of the time they usually make it a huge point to point out Aboriginals/Natives when they describe them, as opposed to other races (Caucasian, Asian, African, etc etc). I guess part of ir has to do with the huge surge in gang violence here in Edmonton the last few years that's becoming a very serious problem (to the point of making our city's unofficial nickname "Deadmonton" very literal). And most of those gangs are made up of Aboriginal members. You really don't hear of asian or black gangs in the news as much, if at all. It doesn't seem taboo at all in the print media to even call them Natives/Indian(s) despite its slight political incorrectness, as opposed to using Black (African) in the same derogatory manner they do with the former. I dunno, maybe I really should have kept my opinion to myself. But honestly though, I just honestly am so displeased with those people that I deal with here on a day-to-day basis and how they mistreat myself and other crew, that I just developed my biased attitude towards them over time. But I guess you could say too, they have just as huge a strong, if not much stronger bias against us whites cos of how we've screwed their ancestors over, and they can't seem to get over that even many generations later. Stupid really. |
inu-liger 01.08.2008 00:20 |
Imagine the chaos there must have been on that bus, and the driver trying to calm them down. "All right ladies and gentlemen, have a seat, let's ALL not lose our heads.." D: [/Bad joke] On that note, that's pretty fucked. Goddamn baboons.If I may build on that bad joke, do you suppose he had a certain Roger Taylor-written song from AKOM on his iPod? *runs* And yes that is fucked otherwise. Shocking actually. Never heard of a decapitation occurring on a bus (transit or Greyhound), car, train or any type of transportation here in recent times. Happens a few times at homes or apartments though. But had the passengers not described the beheading, the media would certainly not have reported it. Like GH said, that detail would have been as "well" hidden as the Vancouver airport taser murder last year. |
Dan C. 01.08.2008 00:59 |
o_O Sometimes that's all there is to say... |
john bodega 01.08.2008 01:20 |
inu-liger wrote: But SOMETHING must have made the guy attack and kill the aboriginal guy next to him, whether or not he did or didn't provoke him.Nope. Shit happens sometimes. You don't need to do anything out of the ordinary to get lynched these days. But that's wackos for you! |
inu-liger 01.08.2008 02:38 |
Zebonka12 wrote:Fair enough.inu-liger wrote: But SOMETHING must have made the guy attack and kill the aboriginal guy next to him, whether or not he did or didn't provoke him.Nope. Shit happens sometimes. You don't need to do anything out of the ordinary to get lynched these days. But that's wackos for you! I WAS attacked at a bus transit center randomly two years ago a month before I went to Vancouver to see Q+PR in concert (this was just past midnight when it happened, incidentally), and even had a knife put against my throat (no word of a lie!). But nothing serious happened to me (thank God I had my friends with me) However, I have been left emotionally scarred to this day, in that I get really uncomfortable and nervous when I hear & know people are walking behind me (other than when I'm in a crowd) that I either can't see or don't want to look behind. And no, it wasn't a native who attacked me (for those who think this would be reason for my bias) |
Holly2003 01.08.2008 04:22 |
inu-liger wrote: I dunno, maybe I really should have kept my opinion to myself.Put that on a post-it. |
john bodega 01.08.2008 04:26 |
inu-liger wrote: Fair enough. I WAS attacked at a bus transit center randomly two years ago a month before I went to Vancouver to see Q+PR in concert (this was just past midnight when it happened, incidentally), and even had a knife put against my throat (no word of a lie!). But nothing serious happened to me (thank God I had my friends with me) However, I have been left emotionally scarred to this day, in that I get really uncomfortable and nervous when I hear & know people are walking behind me (other than when I'm in a crowd) that I either can't see or don't want to look behind. And no, it wasn't a native who attacked me (for those who think this would be reason for my bias)Oh there's a thousand tales of it... I've known plenty of people who've been mugged or mobbed or attacked by nutters in public. I knew a guy who was faced with being knifed by thugs, or jumping off an embankment. He got out of it with a broken arm, but I reckon that's a bargain! |
inu-liger 01.08.2008 04:47 |
Holly2003 wrote:Meh. Even if I bought them, it'll all clutter up and end up in the garbage like so many 'notes' I've written over time.inu-liger wrote: I dunno, maybe I really should have kept my opinion to myself.Put that on a post-it. |
thomasquinn 32989 01.08.2008 06:48 |
inu-liger wrote: "Caton said the victim boarded in Edmonton, was Aboriginal in appearance, was wearing hip-hop clothing and appeared to be around 20 years of age." Well FUCK yeah. That would explain a lot, knowing those jackass indians that live in this city, especially downtown (I am from Edmonton, so this does not surprise me one bit). Sorry if I sound racist, but I do not feel sorry for this guy or his family at all.Just goes to prove that you really are an insane motherfucker, like everyone on this planet already knows. Stick to your pathetic Pokémon and shut the fuck up, asshole. |
thomasquinn 32989 01.08.2008 06:50 |
Lester Burnham wrote:What the hell is wrong with him? Isn't it obvious? He wants attention, because he leads a completely useless life, has no friends, and can't get attention by normal means.inu-liger wrote: "Caton said the victim boarded in Edmonton, was Aboriginal in appearance, was wearing hip-hop clothing and appeared to be around 20 years of age." Well FUCK yeah. That would explain a lot, knowing those jackass indians that live in this city, especially downtown (I am from Edmonton, so this does not surprise me one bit). Sorry if I sound racist, but I do not feel sorry for this guy or his family at all.So you think an unprovoked beheading is justified simply because of what he was wearing? What the hell is wrong with you? That's like me saying that an innocent black man who was beheaded in Philadelphia deserved it simply because he was wearing baggy jeans and a long white T-shirt. |
thomasquinn 32989 01.08.2008 06:56 |
inu-liger wrote:I'd rather you had it tattooed on your forehead before having your mouth sewn shut and your fingers amputated. That way, you might still be an asshole, but at least you'd be an unobtrusive one.Holly2003 wrote:Meh. Even if I bought them, it'll all clutter up and end up in the garbage like so many 'notes' I've written over time.inu-liger wrote: I dunno, maybe I really should have kept my opinion to myself.Put that on a post-it. |
YourValentine 01.08.2008 07:06 |
This story gave me nightmares. |
thomasquinn 32989 01.08.2008 07:08 |
I'm still practically vomiting at the thought. And to think Inu approves of this kind of thing... |
Garfield I. Uberson 01.08.2008 07:24 |
Does the attacker have any clinical history? :-S Geezz... No wonder the world is going so good, we're so kind to each other and we wouldn't do anything to hurt the ones near us... Such a pity spirituality is so last Thursday... |
Sergei. 01.08.2008 09:34 |
inu-liger wrote:Maybe he had it up too loud and that was why the other guy got pissed. XPPImagine the chaos there must have been on that bus, and the driver trying to calm them down. "All right ladies and gentlemen, have a seat, let's ALL not lose our heads.." D: [/Bad joke] On that note, that's pretty fucked. Goddamn baboons.If I may build on that bad joke, do you suppose he had a certain Roger Taylor-written song from AKOM on his iPod? *runs* And yes that is fucked otherwise. Shocking actually. Never heard of a decapitation occurring on a bus (transit or Greyhound), car, train or any type of transportation here in recent times. Happens a few times at homes or apartments though. But had the passengers not described the beheading, the media would certainly not have reported it. Like GH said, that detail would have been as "well" hidden as the Vancouver airport taser murder last year. On a more serious note (again), Zebonka is right... There was most likely absolutely no reason for that man to CUT OFF THE GUY'S HEAD. It's weird just saying it, because it's so positively fucking twisted and bizarre! There were unprovoked lynchings and assaults all the time during and before the African American civil rights movement. Fuck, a black man could get the shit beat out of him for looking a white woman in the eye! Because it could mean that he was having "impure thoughts" about her and might plan on raping her, or something stupid. I don't know. |
thomasquinn 32989 02.08.2008 06:55 |
There are plenty of examples of vigilantes lynching black folks because some woman pointed the finger at them...or even for being a *potential* danger to the 'virtue' of white women. Of course, white men could do whatever they wished to black women in the Jim Crow era. I remember discussing a case from the 1890s in Louisiana with my American History professor, where four white men raped a woman and her daughter, still a child. In the end, the only charge held admissible by the court was against the woman's husband, for allegedly beating one of the assailants. Violence is not often premeditated, but sick folks have been enjoying it for centuries, not just in the US, but all over the world. We wouldn't watch violent films if we didn't enjoy it. |
inu-liger 02.08.2008 07:33 |
Casper the Friendly Ghost wrote: I'm still practically vomiting at the thought. And to think Inu approves of this kind of thing...Not quite, really. You know what I would LOVE to approve? Beheading everyone in the George Bush Administration. Now THAT would be a welcome shocker there. |
inu-liger 02.08.2008 07:38 |
Jasper Avenue wrote: Just goes to prove that you really are an insane motherfucker, like everyone on this planet already knows. Stick to your pathetic Pokémon and shut the fuck up, asshole.Seems certain people still can't let go of the Pokemon factor. Grow up. And I'll say what I want, bitch. Even if I am a bitter motherfucker. |
thomasquinn 32989 02.08.2008 11:35 |
Oh, Inu, you're not bitter. The cheap puns prove you're not. Bitterness and cynicism have few merits, but they are at the least mature emotions. I'd classify you under "sad and angry". |
magicalfreddiemercury 02.08.2008 11:40 |
They're charging the suspect in this case with second, not first, degree murder... because they don't believe the crime was premeditated. That begs the question... does the average joe carry a hunting knife around with him these days? |
Garfield I. Uberson 02.08.2008 12:21 |
magicalfreddiemercury wrote: They're charging the suspect in this case with second, not first, degree murder... because they don't believe the crime was premeditated. That begs the question... does the average joe carry a hunting knife around with him these days?They just might, it's dangerous out there and they need to protect themselves. Same excuse with guns... That psycho should be hanged, imo... |
Garfield I. Uberson 02.08.2008 12:22 |
sorry, double post |
thomasquinn 32989 02.08.2008 12:46 |
Great, another barbarian. Institutionalizing killing lowers the threshold. Don't forget that the US is the only western country with the death penalty, and has by far the highest homicide rate of that same west. And now, apparently, it's begun infecting Canada. |
john bodega 02.08.2008 15:58 |
I dunno, there's times on the bus where I feel like getting some hours in on the Highlander machine. |
inu-liger 02.08.2008 16:54 |
ThomasQuill wrote: Oh, Inu, you're not bitter. The cheap puns prove you're not. Bitterness and cynicism have few merits, but they are at the least mature emotions. I'd classify you under "sad and angry".Believe me, I'm definitely not a sad person. Angry and bitter yes. I've had a very rough year, and things are starting to pick up a bit finally, but my attitude and personality has changed a bit cos of certain events over the year. |
AspiringPhilosophe 02.08.2008 18:36 |
Hey Hey Hey now, I don't normally feel the need to defend the US, but saying that you guys are "getting more and more like the US every day" because some random psycho stabbed a guy on the bus is a bit insulting. Psychos aren't limited to the US you know. Believe it or not there are redeeming qualities to the US (though I admit it's hard to believe that a lot of the time, especially after listening to anything that comes out of the current administration's press office). Anyway...I hope the people on the bus get the support they will need to deal with this. A lot of these people may wind up with PTSD because of this. It sounds like this was a pretty random attack, so it's hard to see how they could pull off a pre-meditated murder charge. As horrible as the story is, it's nothing that can be prevented. Some people simply snap and do crazy shit like this. Unless they have signs before hand, you can't predict or prevent it. That is, unless you want WAY more government intrusion in your lives than you already have. |
john bodega 03.08.2008 05:42 |
Well it's one thing to cut someone's head off. It's another to wave it at your fellow commuters afterwards. Wouldn't surprise me if he'd been on some form of Ice or whatever you guys call it over there. |
AspiringPhilosophe 03.08.2008 11:23 |
Zebonka12 wrote: Well it's one thing to cut someone's head off. It's another to wave it at your fellow commuters afterwards. Wouldn't surprise me if he'd been on some form of Ice or whatever you guys call it over there.Exactly what I was thinking; if he wasn't completely chemically psychotic from some kind of psychiatric disorder, he was tripping off his ass on something. |
thomasquinn 32989 03.08.2008 11:28 |
MasterHistoryGirl wrote: Hey Hey Hey now, I don't normally feel the need to defend the US, but saying that you guys are "getting more and more like the US every day" because some random psycho stabbed a guy on the bus is a bit insulting. Psychos aren't limited to the US you know. Believe it or not there are redeeming qualities to the US (though I admit it's hard to believe that a lot of the time, especially after listening to anything that comes out of the current administration's press office). Anyway...I hope the people on the bus get the support they will need to deal with this. A lot of these people may wind up with PTSD because of this. It sounds like this was a pretty random attack, so it's hard to see how they could pull off a pre-meditated murder charge. As horrible as the story is, it's nothing that can be prevented. Some people simply snap and do crazy shit like this. Unless they have signs before hand, you can't predict or prevent it. That is, unless you want WAY more government intrusion in your lives than you already have.As you read in my post, I was referring to the fact that you have by far the highest homicide rate in the Western world. And I'd be completely willing to cite you sources aplenty for that. Sure there are redeeming qualities. Lots of them. Low levels of violence aren't among them, though. |
AspiringPhilosophe 03.08.2008 15:33 |
Cite away TQ...but you completely miss my point. The first step to hatred is to simplify what something is by associating it with only something bad. That is my point. Anytime something bad happens anywhere in the world, we get blamed for it. The kid who shot up his school in Finland? Must be the American music and culture he bought into. This guy beheading someone else on a bus. Also the fault of the US. The same types of arguments were used against Germany and Japan in WWII. The same class of arguments are used to promote racist views. My point is that such statements are dangerous and entirely false. Nothing is ever as simple as a classic point of view that doesn't take the complexity of definitions and perspective into account. Yes, the US has faults, and I'll be the first one to admit that. But that's not all we are, and believe it or not it's not our fault when someone goes nuts and beheads someone on a bus in Canada. I count point out MANY flaws in European countries, African countries, Eastern countries, and if I felt the urge I could classify you by them completely and blame anything that happened ever on their influence. But I don't. Events are multi-faceted, and contrary to Ockham's Razor the simplest answer is not always the best one. I give others the respect of not making judgments on their country based only on bad reports; I simply expect the same courtesy to be returned. |
inu-liger 03.08.2008 17:22 |
MHG, Sir GH also meant by our becoming more like the US every day bit, in that our gov't is hiding more shocking news from the media until certain people pipe up about it, like the taser killing of the Polish guy at Vancouver International Airport in B.C. that very few people were aware of (literally, a handful of people) until weeks later when someone put up their cellphone video recording of the events on YouTube, and only THEN did a nation-wide spark of huge outrage and controversy erupt then. If people on the bus didn't mention the beheading, we certainly wouldn't know that bit, as (last I read) they haven't confirmed it yet, though it might have been by now. Our gov't in other words again is becoming like the US gov't in terms of pre-censorship. Although both our formerly major parties the Conservatives (current head of Canada) and the Liberals both have controversial leaders, I think I will be voting Liberals in the next election. The Conservatives turned out to be FAR from what we were led to believe they would be when we elected them, and I'm sad about it, cos I was HAPPY to be rid of the Liberal leading Canada cos we all felt we were getting screwed big time. Unfortunately, I was proven wrong as has everyone else. At least we had a lot more freedom under the Liberals. Anyways, that's enough about that. |
Winter Land Man 03.08.2008 17:59 |
inu-liger wrote: "Caton said the victim boarded in Edmonton, was Aboriginal in appearance, was wearing hip-hop clothing and appeared to be around 20 years of age." Well FUCK yeah. That would explain a lot, knowing those jackass indians that live in this city, especially downtown (I am from Edmonton, so this does not surprise me one bit). Sorry if I sound racist, but I do not feel sorry for this guy or his family at all.No offence dude, but that's a post that a sweaty dink with std's would say. |
Lady Nyx 03.08.2008 19:08 |
theres so many things wrong with this picture: 1. why didnt the guy fight back? its natural to have a fight or flight response to an injury! yes they were on a bus, but one would think the guy would try to fight back. 2. that being said, if the victim was so horribly injured, why did they sit back adn watch instead of trying to save the man (even if it seemed hopeless?) its not like there was 2 kids, a lil old woman and a homeless guy, there were MANY people on that bus, you would think someone would have stepped up to the plate instead of waiting til the guy stopped screaming!? 3. didnt they say the bus driver was stuck on there as well? again, why didnt he take some kind of control? dont they have radios? they couldnt try to subdue the guy on the bus til police got there? i understand traumatizing events, but you dont just sit back adn watch something that can be stopped. maybe i missed a couple things but hearing about something like that that could have been easily prevented just happen like that. correct me if im wrong or if i missed some details. |
Crazy LittleThing 03.08.2008 22:11 |
Sir GH wrote: link So, in other words, unless people who were on the bus would have spoken up, the RCMP would have covered this one up too... ? We're getting more and more like the US every day. Thanks, Uncle Steve, I mean, PM Harper.Wow. Greece is becoming more and more like Canada every day. link |
inu-liger 03.08.2008 22:26 |
Lady Nyx wrote: theres so many things wrong with this picture: 1. why didnt the guy fight back? its natural to have a fight or flight response to an injury! yes they were on a bus, but one would think the guy would try to fight back.He was asleep, they said. If he had been waking during a stabbing, he would have not recovered from sleep fully in time to realize and see who was stabbing him. Plus, this was during night time, and Greyhound buses do not have lights on during nighttime. I've taken the Greyhound cross-country before, so I can tell you from experience that riding the Greyhound at night, especially through the prairies and mountainous regions that have no streetlights, it is VERY dark on those buses at night, especially in the backseats. The bus driver sometimes uses a dimmed light, but not often. 2. that being said, if the victim was so horribly injured, why did they sit back adn watch instead of trying to save the man (even if it seemed hopeless?) its not like there was 2 kids, a lil old woman and a homeless guy, there were MANY people on that bus, you would think someone would have stepped up to the plate instead of waiting til the guy stopped screaming!?They could have tried to stop him, I agree. But the aisles on those buses are not very wide, so it is easy to get cramped, and if loads of people rushed at once to stop him, there could have been even more chaos. Plus, I don't think they wanted to get stabbed themselves. It must have been scarier than they're letting on, when it was happening. 3. didnt they say the bus driver was stuck on there as well? again, why didnt he take some kind of control? dont they have radios? they couldnt try to subdue the guy on the bus til police got there?He was not stuck, I don't think. He DID get out and when he was told the murderer was attempting to get on the driver's seat and drive away, he disabled the bus from the rear (which honestly I did not think they had such a control in the panel there, but that's smart they have that enabled! Must have been installed with potential hijacking scenarios in mind however) As for radios, I would think they have radios yes, but not one that would automatically link to a nearby station that could send out the police or RCMP immediately. I'm not sure how their radio system works, but I would assume they connect to satellites as there would be no chance of a radio transmitter & receiver every few kilometers in the wide prairies, let alone the regions with surrounding mountains (B.C. and Ontario) There is one question I feel needs to be added here: 4. WHY was the attacker carrying a knife on his person to begin with?? Obviously, he could not have just procured one out of thin air, nor could he have bought one at any of the pit stops, which leads me to believe this was premeditated. Whether he planned to kill the eventual victim in advance, or whether he had a criteria or something in mind, is something only he can answer, that is if he chooses to, or if they can somehow force the answer out of him. I hope Greyhound will install airport-style security (including metal detectors) at the departure gates following this, to prevent future murders as well as attacks on bus drivers. |
Lady Nyx 03.08.2008 22:59 |
thank you for not putting me down inu-liger for not knowing some of the details :) the other thing i was thinking was: the guy jsut had a KNIFE. if it were a gun, it would have been that much harder to stop the guy, but its a knife, compared to other weapons he could have used, that really is not as difficult to stop. i know in traumatic times people might think 'fend for yourself!' and save your own ass, but i still wonder why a couple people didnt try to get the guy, and/or take the knife out of his hand? its just baffling. |
Sergei. 03.08.2008 23:05 |
Lady Nyx wrote: thank you for not putting me down inu-liger for not knowing some of the details :) the other thing i was thinking was: the guy jsut had a KNIFE. if it were a gun, it would have been that much harder to stop the guy, but its a knife, compared to other weapons he could have used, that really is not as difficult to stop. i know in traumatic times people might think 'fend for yourself!' and save your own ass, but i still wonder why a couple people didnt try to get the guy, and/or take the knife out of his hand? its just baffling.Agreed. D: Seems to me like there are a hell of a lot of holes in this story... It just sounds so... Bizarre, which I know I said earlier. Hah. I mean, I know inu-liger said the bus was dark and all, but cutting off a guy's head on public transportation? He doesn't at least scream? No motive at all, or so it seems? Something isn't freaking right about all this. xD |
inu-liger 03.08.2008 23:18 |
Lady Nyx wrote: thank you for not putting me down inu-liger for not knowing some of the details :)No problem. Having used the Greyhound before, I wanted to explain some things from first-hand experience. the other thing i was thinking was: the guy jsut had a KNIFE. if it were a gun, it would have been that much harder to stop the guy, but its a knife, compared to other weapons he could have used, that really is not as difficult to stop. i know in traumatic times people might think 'fend for yourself!' and save your own ass, but i still wonder why a couple people didnt try to get the guy, and/or take the knife out of his hand? its just baffling.Thing is, things like this RARELY happen in Canada. We all know shit like this can be expected to happen in the States, but it almost never happens here. And cos of that, I think the people were scared shitless and didn't have a clue what do do. The man must have had some sort of mental illness like schizophrenia. A normal person doesn't go out pulling random shit like this out of the blue. |
magicalfreddiemercury 04.08.2008 07:39 |
inu-liger wrote: We all know shit like this can be expected to happen in the States, but it almost never happens here.Yeah, because, you know, beheadings happen in the states on a regular basis. |
thomasquinn 32989 04.08.2008 08:15 |
Lady Nyx wrote: theres so many things wrong with this picture: 1. why didnt the guy fight back? its natural to have a fight or flight response to an injury! yes they were on a bus, but one would think the guy would try to fight back.He may have died very swiftly, or have been too surprised and injured to act. 2. that being said, if the victim was so horribly injured, why did they sit back adn watch instead of trying to save the man (even if it seemed hopeless?) its not like there was 2 kids, a lil old woman and a homeless guy, there were MANY people on that bus, you would think someone would have stepped up to the plate instead of waiting til the guy stopped screaming!?Panic? 3. didnt they say the bus driver was stuck on there as well? again, why didnt he take some kind of control? dont they have radios? they couldnt try to subdue the guy on the bus til police got there?He sabotaged the bus so the killer couldn't get away, didn't he? i understand traumatizing events, but you dont just sit back adn watch something that can be stopped.People don't act rationally in traumatic events. My father and I were held hostage once, several years ago, in the Refugee center where he works. Believe me, reason goes out the window. maybe i missed a couple things but hearing about something like that that could have been easily prevented just happen like that. correct me if im wrong or if i missed some details.It's like what they say about war, really: simple things suddenly become grievously difficult. |
thomasquinn 32989 04.08.2008 08:17 |
MasterHistoryGirl wrote: Cite away TQ...but you completely miss my point. The first step to hatred is to simplify what something is by associating it with only something bad. That is my point. Anytime something bad happens anywhere in the world, we get blamed for it. The kid who shot up his school in Finland? Must be the American music and culture he bought into. This guy beheading someone else on a bus. Also the fault of the US. The same types of arguments were used against Germany and Japan in WWII. The same class of arguments are used to promote racist views. My point is that such statements are dangerous and entirely false. Nothing is ever as simple as a classic point of view that doesn't take the complexity of definitions and perspective into account. Yes, the US has faults, and I'll be the first one to admit that. But that's not all we are, and believe it or not it's not our fault when someone goes nuts and beheads someone on a bus in Canada. I count point out MANY flaws in European countries, African countries, Eastern countries, and if I felt the urge I could classify you by them completely and blame anything that happened ever on their influence. But I don't. Events are multi-faceted, and contrary to Ockham's Razor the simplest answer is not always the best one. I give others the respect of not making judgments on their country based only on bad reports; I simply expect the same courtesy to be returned.I never stated or suggested any of the above. I merely pointed out that the US has the highest homicide rate in the Western world, and that it has been spreading throughout North America for the last few years, and I will stand by that. Now, does that mean that every American is a homicidal maniac? Hell no! Does it mean Americans are crazier than Europeans? Hell no! Does it mean the threshold for violence is lower in the US? Possibly. Does it mean that the US is, on average, more violent than Europe? Yes. |
Yara 04.08.2008 09:49 |
Maybe I'm simple-minded but I just don't understand what does this have to do with the U.S!? Blaming "the U.S" is starting to become an automatic and irrational reaction to almost any wrongdoing. And a device for shifting away the responsibility from those who are in fact to blame. First, the guy blames the victim for wearing the wrong clothes. Then, he suggests that every member of the Bush administration should be beheaded. I mean, there's something wrong. That's becoming weird. I mean, pretty soon, if I'm in a rush and happen to roll down the stairway all the way to the floor and crush my head against the wall, I'll be saying, after being taken to the hospital: "Well, you know, that was Bush's fault, I wouldn't be in a hurry if it were not for the capitalist economy which demands me to wake up early for work...". Like, come on. |
thomasquinn 32989 04.08.2008 11:38 |
Anyone who reads "blaming the US" into my post is seeing things. I am merely remarking how the homicide rate is so much higher there than any place else that passes itself off as civilized with any degree of success. What I blame is accessibility of effective weapons. |
magicalfreddiemercury 05.08.2008 08:11 |
ThomasQuinn wrote: Anyone who reads "blaming the US" into my post is seeing things.I don't think it's your post in which "blaming the US" is being read, TQ, but rather in posts such as this - inu-liger wrote: We all know shit like this can be expected to happen in the States... |
thomasquinn 32989 05.08.2008 10:49 |
Wow. This may actually have been the first time that accusations of bashing the US in a topic I posted in weren't addressed to me. That's a whole new sensation! |
Yara 05.08.2008 12:38 |
ThomasQuinn, no need to get defensive, it wasn't addressed to you, really. I get your point about homicide rate in the U.S. My country doesn't fare that well in this regard either and it's mostly because of drug-trafficking unrelated to the U.S and provided by left-wing terrorist organizations such as FARC. |
john bodega 05.08.2008 13:10 |
I don't suppose the words "shit happens" still carry any meaning? If you look at the instances of firearm violence in the US vs. Australia, and then remember that we had the Port Arthur shootings in 1996 (which narrowly beat Virginia Tech in the body count, I believe??) I mean really... it can happen any old where. You only need one nutter. |