| Saint Jiub 08.11.2007 11:07 |
|
| The Real Wizard 08.11.2007 11:16 |
I worked for YEARS to accumulate this material and weeks to create this compilation. You are one disgusting human being. For everyone else, here is the lossless copy: link Barbara, please ban this bastard. This isn't sharing with good intent. This is backstabbing at its worst, as he has gone out of his way to destroy a recording, purely to upset people. He has contributed nothing to this community, and now he is taking away from it. Enough is enough. He has crossed the line. Needless to say, unless this topic is removed, and/or the topic starter is banned, the Liverpool 73 recording is the VERY LAST thing that will be shared on this website by me. Everyone, be vocal. We need dozens of posts in this topic, saying how wrong this is, and that we need action taken by the moderators, if they care enough to help and do what's best for this community. |
| Serry... 08.11.2007 11:25 |
What's happened? I love stories about bastards. |
| pittrek 08.11.2007 11:35 |
Rip van Winkle, or Mike Van, or Gym Bitch or whatever - I hope this is a compilation that YOU spent a lot of time creating, is it ? Because if you simply downloaded the flac version Bob shared here and converted it to an inferrior format simply because you want to see Bob angry, you're an idiot. |
| Harry_queenrecordings 08.11.2007 12:29 |
This is really a very low move of ''Gym Bitch''. It is sad that these kind of people are ruining the quality standards.. |
| on my way up 08.11.2007 12:51 |
Sir GH<br><h6>ah yeah</h6> wrote: I worked for YEARS to accumulate this material and weeks to create this compilation. You are one disgusting human being. For everyone else, here is the lossless copy: link Barbara, please ban this bastard. This isn't sharing with good intent. This is backstabbing at its worst, as he has gone out of his way to destroy a recording, purely to upset people. He has contributed nothing to this community, and now he is taking away from it. Enough is enough. He has crossed the line.The info attached to every share you do is that it may not be shared in lossy format. This is clearly a violation of your request. Indeed, he crossed the line and he should be banned. |
| The Real Wizard 08.11.2007 12:54 |
Let's see if the need to respect Mike's "freedom of sharing" is bigger than the hope for new recordings to emerge in a pro-lossless community. Or... let's see if these words will continue to fly over so many heads. |
| FriedChicken 08.11.2007 13:07 |
We should transport those kind of people to Siberia or concentration camps like in the good ol' days |
| onevsion 08.11.2007 13:46 |
Gym Bitch wrote: linkSad childish behaviour. Nobody is waiting for this kinda crap. Find yourself another hobby tosser. |
| thunderbolt 31742 08.11.2007 13:54 |
This is a clear shot across Sir GH's bow. Delete this post and ban the idiot that posted the compilation in MP3. |
| Gr8 King Rat 08.11.2007 14:04 |
Gym, dont you live somewhere in northern Illinois? you guys want me to kick his ass? ;) |
| MDNA 08.11.2007 14:10 |
I never saw anithing like this before. what a child. If you chck his past posts you will find that he downloaded everything that was shared here by Bob and others. If he wants people to hate him, this is definately the way to go. Bob, please don't stop sharing your recordings because of morons like this guy. Most people here are getting your point, but I beliave there will always be a black shep in the herd. FLAC FOR SHARING/TRADING, MP3 FOR PERSONAL USE ONLY! Is that so dificult to understand? |
| dogwithabone 08.11.2007 14:44 |
Bob I'm with you totally. I can't believe what is happening to this forum recently. It should be about sharing wonderful recordings of Queen and discussing the why's, where's and what for's. Politics and childishness should definitely not be a part of it but yet is growing on a daily basis. Prats like Gym Bitch should be banned immediately for deliberately invoking this whiplash and turning this place into like it is now. Welcome to the New Dark Ages!! |
| The Real Wizard 08.11.2007 14:49 |
dogwithabone... can you please send me an email? bob at queenlive.ca Thanks! |
| fernandosales 08.11.2007 14:59 |
Sir GH, i´m with you. |
| Queenrockyou 08.11.2007 15:06 |
One new Mp3 attack lol. No, seriously, this time the fact that it is a show that does exist on a loosless form is known, and still we find anew the same concert shared here, on the same board, on a lossy format. It was once again said that it should not be converted in lossy format for a share activity, and... that's it, I think everybody understands me. How could the queenzoners who have material to share be motivated to do so after that ? Is Queenzone willing to be a sort of anti-sharing place ? Truely, the material offered will probably decrease dramatically after that sort of behaviour, it was quite often the case before, and this week I think that's very common to see that sort of behaviour. It can be disgusting to see people ruining someone's efforts just for fun, I'm talking about efforts to make everybldy benefit from the best show available, in the best form, and a form made for keeping its shape a long time. Until... that. Sorry, now this IS truely disgusting. Once again, in my own opinion, feel free to think your way. This is pollution. Call Greenpeace to the rescue. Olivier, France. |
| Richy Mercury 08.11.2007 15:12 |
This only makes your lossless copy more valuable. |
| josedequeso 08.11.2007 15:12 |
Again, Mike Van fuck you!!! If you ever come to Myrtle Beach, I will make god damn sure you won't leave on your own two feet. Yes, that's a threat. I am officialy done with QZ. I will not share another fucking thing on this site as long as stupid immature asswholes like mike van are allowed to pull stupid shit like this. |
| The Real Wizard 08.11.2007 15:26 |
Richy Mercury wrote: This only makes your lossless copy more valuable.Haha... I suppose that's a more optimistic way of looking at it! fernandosales wrote: Sir GH, i´m with you.Can you please send me an email as well? Thanks! |
| josedequeso 08.11.2007 15:30 |
edit. |
| djcamper 08.11.2007 15:40 |
I guess Gym Bitch is Usama Ben Laden with Saddam's soul posssed in him. Please execute him, if he'll rest alive, execute repeatedly. Sir GH for president! for life ;) |
| Cebe 08.11.2007 16:03 |
It looks that some people will never get the point. Please use mp3 only for your own use, and share files lossless. Cheers Bob. |
| RoyThomasBaker 08.11.2007 16:04 |
djcamper wrote: I guess Gym Bitch is Usama Ben Laden with Saddam's soul posssed in him. Please execute him, if he'll rest alive, execute repeatedly. Sir GH for president! for life ;)Not at all. I guess a bright mind like Bin Laden would post it in Flac format! |
| Queenrockyou 08.11.2007 16:18 |
???? Was he listening to Queen ? Tsssssss.... Once again, let's be prudent with these images... Well, what about this mp3 ? Have someone here listened to it ? Was it good ? ;o) I think the starter of this thread, whatever his name his, we don't care, I think he is the one in lossy format. Just have to fix some things up there in his head, to undestand lines such as "PLEASE DO NOT CONVERT IT TO MP3 THEN SHARE". Maybe that is something that should have been fixed here on Queenzone some time ago now. And please do not continue to share those things when not allowed, or some of the Queenzoners here will try to write their own "Death On Two Legs", at least there will be enough material to do this !!! Some have good ideas for that !! I will only say that sharing this was a real stupid idea, that's true. That's the world. Stupid. Olivier, France. |
| vlatko 08.11.2007 17:29 |
I support you , Sir GH and thank you again for your effort. |
| Smitty 08.11.2007 17:37 |
Ugh, this is completely disgusting, not only because of the defiling of what was a great compilation by Sir GH (whom I back up fully), but you know that Gym Bitch or Mike Van or whatever won't be banned. He did not technically break any forum rules, and if a rule against lossy sharing were to be made, it'd be unfair to ban Gym Bitch after the rule was made. I hate to say it, but there's nothing you can do. Even if you post the same thing on a quality bootleg download site, there will always be some random idiot to run along and mess it up. I wish there was something we could do. |
| Marknow 08.11.2007 17:53 |
TERRORIST! |
| runner70 08.11.2007 18:39 |
Soooo funny! You think you hear ANY difference between a (mostly crap sounding) audience bootleg show in FALC or mp3? Forget it! Sounds shitty in FLAC and Mp3 guys! I hate FLAC recording because before you can burn em you have to convert that whole crap. Mp3 in a decent frequency theres absolutely NO difference for the human ear!!!!! Anythin else is wishful thinking! |
| Tim June 08.11.2007 19:26 |
" Sir GH, i´m with you. " I'm too! |
| Bobby_brown 08.11.2007 19:30 |
It´s time to see some moderation in Queenzone, at least in the Announce forum. Let´s try to have quality standarts like other sites. I enjoy the lack of moderation in Queenzone in the discussion forums, but in the announce section i think it´s about time to have some rules, and respect the hard work, time and energy that some collectors spend collecting and compiling the better sources only to be shared here in mp3, polluting the market. If people don´t have time to moderate, then delegate that task to a respected Queenzoner who´s whiling to do that. I know it´s time consuming but i´m shure someone would like to do it! I don´t have any doubt that if we had an announce forum like Jamtothis.com (Van Halen) or the tradersdern, we would atract great coollectors to this comunity too. I know Queen are more eclectic and appealing to youngsters, who might don´t understand torrents. It could be created an announce for rapidshare, mediafire or other site and one only for torrents. Take care |
| brian-harold-may 26643 08.11.2007 19:32 |
im with you 100%. This kind if disrespectful move shows just how far down the pan this website is going. I'm completely behind you. |
| forroch 08.11.2007 20:16 |
Now this is sick I agree with Sir GH. I think who ever uploads mp3 should be kicked out no questions asked its time the uploading(mp3) become more strict around here |
| Hippolyte 08.11.2007 20:19 |
It says a lot about the quality of this place when morons like Gym Bitch can not only thumb their noses at everyone, but also carry out personal attacks against respected members like Sir GH. Bob, without you, I know my Queen collection would be sadly lacking. It may not always feel like it (especially today), but I, along with some others here, DO greatly appreciate the years you've put into collecting, restoring, and sharing these concerts. You are the best of the best. :) |
| Mustapha_Ibrahim 08.11.2007 20:26 |
For countless times I had a go with mp3 sharing but the Queen community was too narrow-minded back then... It's good to see that the people have changed. This is indeed pollution and the fact that Bob asked for sharing this recording only in lossless format, just makes this worse... Never forget LOSSY = CRAP |
| Saint Jiub 08.11.2007 21:08 |
Richy Mercury wrote: This only makes your lossless copy more valuable.The lossless copy has the same value that it did 24 hours ago. The fact that I posted it in mp3 does not change that. The flac files still have exactly the same unaltered content even though I posted a lower quality version on this site. As far as I know ... the thousands of lossless copies that thousands of people downloaded and still have did not instantly vanish when I posted the mp3 version. |
| FriedChicken 08.11.2007 22:54 |
I tell ya Bob, If you ever get president. I'll be your Dr Goebbels! |
| Serry... 09.11.2007 00:32 |
"Siberia or concentration camps" Nice comparison - Siberia and concentration camps - thanks, Niek! |
| The Real Wizard 09.11.2007 00:47 |
Gym Bitch wrote: As far as I know ... the thousands of lossless copies that thousands of people downloaded and still have did not instantly vanish when I posted the mp3 version.That's true. But someone could have downloaded your lossy version, burned it to CD, and may trade it to someone, as if it were the lossless copy. That's the kind of thing we're trying to avoid. The community has made it clear that supporters of lossy audio are now in the minority. I couldn't be happier. |
| Cygnus X-1 09.11.2007 01:44 |
been away a few days just to come back and see this....how sad. Bob's shares are truly outstanding. I don't know how many hours he spend to create his fantastic compilations and now some arrogant c*nt ruíns everything. get a life, do you call yourself a true Queen Fan? Freddie would kick you ass if he would still be alive!!! |
| Double-U 09.11.2007 03:32 |
It´s so sad that we have to waste our time with stuff like this. Shame on you Gym Bitch! @Fried Chicken: Could you please stop writing such senceless coments? Thank you very much! |
| thunderbolt 31742 09.11.2007 03:41 |
Bobby_brown wrote: It´s time to see some moderation in Queenzone, at least in the Announce forum. Let´s try to have quality standarts like other sites.We've been down this road before. Several times, actually, we've asked for moderation in QZ and a stop to lossy sharing. Each time, we've been met with "we don't want to place limits on what people can share," and similar responses that forfeit the good of the many so that a few can save some time downloading. Enough, I say. QZ is a great site for discussion, but it's time to leave the sharing to the grown-ups. What is so insanely difficult about "Share in FLAC, then convert to MP3 for personal use"? Why the wait in enforcing a no-lossy sharing rule here? It would serve the greater good of the community by getting more music out there, and keeping the music that is out there in higher quality. So please, someone in a position of power, enlighten us on exactly how MP3 benefits the QZ community, and why it absolutely must remain shared here when it's clearly inferior to lossless formats? |
| Serry... 09.11.2007 04:27 |
"How MP3 benefits the QZ community, and why it absolutely must remain shared here when it's clearly inferior to lossless formats?" Why do we always come back to that question? Guys, could you please write on the wall near your bed or in any other places where you spend a lot of the time - a lot of Queen fans won't download 5 Gbs of any show for personal use (time, money, slow Internet connection etc. etc. etc.)? I won't for sure. Why do we always have to think about interests of Queen fans who're gonna trade those recordings? Is this forum for traders or for listeners of Queen music? I have never complained about shows in FLAC, but FLAC lovers can't miss any single thread with one file in mp3 inside. Roger didn't stop the nazis in 1994... By the way, let's close Picture Gallery on QZ that is full of damned jpegs instead of wonderful tiffs and Corel Draw images! |
| Nummer2 09.11.2007 06:19 |
Serry ... ? If someone has a never published photo of Queen he for sure won't say: "Oh no, I won't upload my precious photo at QZ, because they aren't capable of displaying in Uncompressed Lab Color TIFF format." But if someone has an uncirculated Queen show on tape, the possibility is huge, that he will keep it for himself just because he doesn't want it to end up as a multiple times converted MP3 file. It's like with good whiskey: Dilute it to your taste (I'd suggest some ice cubes, no soda, but anyway), but give it to a friend in it's original package and without water added. Imagine what could happen, if it was watered down and handed on several times ... yuck! |
| Serry... 09.11.2007 06:56 |
Nummer2, My reply was not about this case, it was about the whole attitude "go and die the mp3-lovers, ha-ha-ha, I'm so happy that you guys can't download shows in mp3, ha-ha-ha, if you can't download it in FLAC - you don't have the right to listen the show, ha-ha-ha!". |
| Ale Solan 09.11.2007 08:02 |
Bob, I'm 100% with you ;-) |
| Nummer2 09.11.2007 08:07 |
Hi Serry, I understand your view, and I didn't want to offend you. I once was one of those "mp3 lovers", too. In fact, my collection of Queen shows consists of about 30% MP3, 70% FLAC files (the FLAC portion growing continuously). But I'd never ever give away MP3 files, not online and not on CD. I even stopped downloading MP3s, except when the sharer states, that there's no lossless version available anywhere. I find it important to restore the reputation of the Queen collector/trader scene, because that's the only way to reveal unknown or uncirculated shows. And there must be quite a few! But I doubt if that is possible as long as Queenzone exists as a contact point for hit-and-run downloaders without any grasp or respect for the "natural laws" of bootleg trading. |
| pittrek 09.11.2007 08:18 |
Did somebody of you noticed that the thread title changed and the mp3 link is gone ? |
| Mr Mercury 09.11.2007 09:17 |
pittrek wrote: Did somebody of you noticed that the thread title changed and the mp3 link is gone ?Technically the link hasnt gone as Ducksoup hasnt altered his post on the first page (at the time of posting this) which quotes Gym Bitch's original post. For the record Im on the side of Sir GH. All that hard work in putting a perfect package has been spoiled by Gym Bastards stupidity. |
| The Real Wizard 09.11.2007 10:35 |
<font color=FF9900>Mr Mercury</font> wrote: Technically the link hasnt gone as Ducksoup hasnt altered his post on the first page (at the time of posting this) which quotes Gym Bitch's original post.Nope, it's gone. I guess enough of us complained to megaupload, saying it was "copyright infringement". :) |
| bohemian 11513 09.11.2007 11:42 |
runner70 wrote: Soooo funny! You think you hear ANY difference between a (mostly crap sounding) audience bootleg show in FALC or mp3? Forget it! Sounds shitty in FLAC and Mp3 guys! I hate FLAC recording because before you can burn em you have to convert that whole crap. Mp3 in a decent frequency theres absolutely NO difference for the human ear!!!!! Anythin else is wishful thinking!I support you , roger70!!! Very well said... ...and sorry Bob, but in this case I´m, in contrast to Alex, approximately 3.5% with you. |
| Holly2003 09.11.2007 11:48 |
I downloaded the mp3s. I don't do torrents and I'm grateful to MikeVM for allowing me to have this concert. However, if someone was to post the original link to mediafire with the flac files I would've downloaded from there instead. As for banning him, Mike was here a long time before most of you. I like him: he's a loose cannon and a grumpy fucker. He just needs a good tickling ;) |
| MDNA 09.11.2007 12:06 |
Bohemian<font size="1"></f! wrote:Some people just don't get the point do they?runner70 wrote: Soooo funny! You think you hear ANY difference between a (mostly crap sounding) audience bootleg show in FALC or mp3? Forget it! Sounds shitty in FLAC and Mp3 guys! I hate FLAC recording because before you can burn em you have to convert that whole crap. Mp3 in a decent frequency theres absolutely NO difference for the human ear!!!!! Anythin else is wishful thinking!I support you , roger70!!! Very well said... There IS a difference in keeping the files lossless as the original tape and keeping them in MP3. If it is more convenient to you to convert to MP3 for your storage/listenig purposes, that is perfectly fine. What we are saying is that for purposes of future distribution the files should be kept in their original format, and not spread arround in an inferior form. if this happens what you will get is the following FLAC>MP3>CD>WAV>MP3>internet share>CD>WAV>MP3>internet share>.... do this a few times and I guarantee the files wil suffer a noticeble quality degradation. and remember that not everibody uses 192 Kbps MP3 encoding, many people use inferior bit rates. Take that into account and the degradation in sound quality will be even quicker. True, many recordings don't sound that good in the first place, but put them thru the process described above and they become much worse. Isn't it better to preserve them in the best quality possible? If the original lossless files are kept this way, then anyone can produce MP3 files at any time that are guaranteed to be the best possible quality available in this format, for thir own personal use (or even give them to someone that you know wont pass them to others). Get this straight, we are not telling anyone they can't convert to MP3, we are just asking people not to spread these files, because it will hurt everibody in the long run. If people can't download FLAC files because they are to large, there are other ways to obtain the shows. Try and see if anyone is willing to mail you a copy (yes I mean postal mail, not e-mail). This is how recordings where spread in the past, and it is still being done. I know for a fact that Rush fans often organize a SUPER VINE in wich several DVD's containing various shows are sent arround the globe person to person. (I sugested this to Bob already) Don't criticise the people who want to preserve these recordings in the best possible quality because you're to lazy to take the time to convert a file or set up a mail trade and just want everithing to fall in your lap in the format that most suits your needs. Remember, you can ALWAYS make a good MP3 from a lossless file, you can NEVER make a lossless file from MP3 no mater how good it sounds or how high the bitrate is. Keep up the good work people. |
| Cygnus X-1 09.11.2007 12:25 |
Bohemian<font size="1"></f! wrote:WTF is wrong with you people?????? You're too lazy to convert Flac's before burning? I can burn Flac's direct to CD, without converting, thanks to nero...oh, I forgot, you need to download flash plugin for that, too much work for you,eh?runner70 wrote: Soooo funny! You think you hear ANY difference between a (mostly crap sounding) audience bootleg show in FALC or mp3? Forget it! Sounds shitty in FLAC and Mp3 guys! I hate FLAC recording because before you can burn em you have to convert that whole crap. Mp3 in a decent frequency theres absolutely NO difference for the human ear!!!!! Anythin else is wishful thinking!I support you , roger70!!! Very well said... Just think a second about the time Bob and other sharers spend to provide us upgrades and unearthed recordings. I don't know how long it took to get Cologne'79 together, but it must be a damn long time; getting three sources and mix them up... And you complain about a couple of minutes to convert your files? Pathetic! Let me ask you: how old are you people here who complain about respecting wishes from the original uploaders? I'm 28, so ten years ago there wasn't any webside where you can download Queen shows (Hell, I even haven't internet at that time). So there where only two ways to collect records: Dive into the world of hardcore collecting,snail trading and make contacts around the globe to get some tapes - cost you a lot of time and effort. Or, what I did, go to record fairs (or make a holiday in japan ;-) and buy bootleg silvers - cost you a lot of money. Here, today, you can easily download all the shows for free, minimun time effort - what a luxury. And than some idiots not even respect simple wishes from the ones who give us all these great recordings. And that's really sad...... oh, please STOP calling Flac supporters "Nazis" - I don't call you careless people "Nihilists" |
| Serry... 09.11.2007 12:29 |
"If people can't download FLAC files because they are to large, there are other ways to obtain the shows. Try and see if anyone is willing to mail you a copy (yes I mean postal mail, not e-mail)." MDNA, with all my respect to you, but now and again it's not the Queen traders' site - "if you can't download FLAC, get out of here and find other ways to get the show", you have to be more tolerant towards other QZers, in my opinion. "Get this straight, we are not telling anyone they can't convert to MP3, we are just asking people not to spread these files, because it will hurt everibody in the long run." If I can't download mp3 because some guys are afraid of sharing files of that format (however I see why GH is angry and can understand him, though can't totally agree) and on other hand I can't download flac because of other reasons - how can I get the show then? Can't download FLAC -> can't convert it for my personal purposes and what? Well, except "research of other ways to obtain the shows" :-) "oh, please STOP calling Flac supporters "Nazis"" "Nazis" is not about FLAC supporters, "nazis" is about the recent attitude towards mp3 supporters. If I'd ever control any of your steps and will tell you what you should do and what you shouldn't - you may call me "nazi" too. |
| MDNA 09.11.2007 13:11 |
Serry... wrote: "oh, please STOP calling Flac supporters "Nazis"" "Nazis" is not about FLAC supporters, "nazis" is about the recent attitude towards mp3 supporters. If I'd ever control any of your steps and will tell you what you should do and what you shouldn't - you may call me "nazi" too.sorry, didn't see the post below mine. Totaly agree with what he says though. By the way you shouldn't throw yourself in a well, call me a nazi. |
| tilomagnet 09.11.2007 14:18 |
runner70 wrote: Soooo funny! You think you hear ANY difference between a (mostly crap sounding) audience bootleg show in FALC or mp3? Forget it! Sounds shitty in FLAC and Mp3 guys! I hate FLAC recording because before you can burn em you have to convert that whole crap. Mp3 in a decent frequency theres absolutely NO difference for the human ear!!!!! Anythin else is wishful thinking!Ouch. What an idiot. |
| Serry... 09.11.2007 14:28 |
MDNA, you didn't answer my question (that becomes common habit): how can I get any track in mp3 for my personal use if I can't download it in flac and others can't share it in mp3 in "sharing the music" forum? Because of few bad traders, thousands of Queen fans are not allowed to download songs in the format which they want to. Okay. What should they do? No abstract or fantastic answers, please (like about mail, funny thing about mp3s - they're quick to be downloaded, so it would be strange if I'll ask someone to send me mp3-sourced CD over mail that will take few weeks). |
| tonimau 09.11.2007 14:32 |
Anybody with ears can see the difference between MP3 and FLAC. You just can´t see that difference in the beggining, but once you are "trained" you get hear the difference (considering you compare one MP3 and one FLAC from the same source). In the beggining you´ll say "no difference", conclusion: FLAC is crap, MP3 is small, so it rules. By the middle of the way (where I am), i´ll say (it makes a small diference), and when I can I hear the FLAC instead of the MP3. I guess that by the end of a few years of careful listening, you get to hate MP3, and love the FLAC. My point is: not everybody is in the final stage of "avoid MP3 at all costs". Much people still get satisfied with MP3 and avoid FLAC because it is too big, it takes more time to download and "the sound difference is small or none" (this can be a lie, most of the times). We could all get along. Setup a space for MP3, setup a space for FLAC. Each person decides what to download. Everybody has it´s reasons. Also think of those people with poor internet connections and strict download limits. They almost can´t download a FLAC. P.S. Try to be constructive, everybody. It is bad to read tons of answers which totally consist of "you suck, I rule". That is not good for anybody |
| bohemian 11513 09.11.2007 14:39 |
tonimau wrote: Anybody with ears can see the difference between MP3 and FLAC...But it´s so much harder for somebody with eyes to hear any difference, isn´t it? ;-) |
| MDNA 09.11.2007 15:27 |
Serry... wrote: MDNA, you didn't answer my question (that becomes common habit): how can I get any track in mp3 for my personal use if I can't download it in flac and others can't share it in mp3 in "sharing the music" forum? Because of few bad traders, thousands of Queen fans are not allowed to download songs in the format which they want to. Okay. What should they do? No abstract or fantastic answers, please (like about mail, funny thing about mp3s - they're quick to be downloaded, so it would be strange if I'll ask someone to send me mp3-sourced CD over mail that will take few weeks).I don't think it's abstract or fantastic to consider spreeding a recording by post mail for people who can't download them. how do you think Bob and others came to have these recording in the first place? And of course you would never spread an MP3 sourced CD this way when you can simply send the original FLAC files on a CD or DVD. Many traders are adopting FLAC (or any other lossless format) as a trade format as oposed to audio CD's already. Once you get the FLAC files you can now convert them to whatever format suits you best and even pass them to other people. And it doesn't take weeks, unless you're in the middle of Africa or the Amazon Jungle or some other place like that. I have traded with some people by mail, and it shouldn't take more than a few days even if you're sending overseas. A vine was started months ago in Pieter's Trading forum for a Cross DVD, and that already went arround the globe. I was one of the people who got it. this proves it is not impossible to share in other ways other than the internet thus preserving the quality of the recordings for others to enjoy as well. If other fan comunities can do it why not us, that is all that I'm saying. |
| Serry... 09.11.2007 15:49 |
Russia or middle of Africa... For the post there's no big difference in these cases, I tell ya. Anyway, few days or one hour - there's still difference. Richard may send Queenzone Newsletter not over e-mails, but over the post too - there are no such important news recently for Queen fans which can't wait for few days, but we all prefer to have it as quick as it's possible, that's why we use e-mail. Same here - for my own personal purposes I want to download the damned show (which maybe I won't like even, but I'll pay for my traffic anyway - 100 Mbs or 2 Gbs, there's a difference as well, not for me though) as fast as it's possible and as I used to do on QZ for the last 5 years. So in the end - you can't offer any other answers to my question, except the post mail which makes QZ useless for many fans. I can't see why both formats can't be spreading here (in the same thread by the same uploader, for instance) as it always was. I can't see why we have to start these wars against mp3s for the interests of traders/die-hard collectors only. We were uploading and downloading mp3s on QZ not for the one day nor for the one week, but for the some years - and there wasn't so many complaints and that "go and die mp3-lovers" shoutings, that's all what I'm saying. |
| thunderbolt 31742 09.11.2007 16:22 |
Serry... wrote: We were uploading and downloading mp3s on QZ not for the one day nor for the one week, but for the some years - and there wasn't so many complaints and that "go and die mp3-lovers" shoutings, that's all what I'm saying.You really are overdramatizing this, aren't you? Calling FLAC supporters "Nazis," and suggesting that we're telling MP3 supporters to die? I'll take you much more seriously when you quit taking the basic issue here (quality of shared files) and turning it into baseless, personal attacks against those of us who want some kind of quality standards here. MP3 was embraced years ago because high-speed internet did not exist. Everyone thought that 14.4 was the BOMB, then 28.8 came along, and suddenly it was the BOMB-DIGGITY! Hey, here's 56K, we can share actual music now? You mean, not just MIDIs, but actual music? MP3, here we come! Now, though, high-speed internet has spread worldwide. There are some corners that don't have it yet, yes. But for those corners of the world, there are countless Queen "blogs" that contain little more than MP3s of shows, interviews, and even official material like the studio albums. I bet you can find one within ten minutes of searching--I know of at least five (ok, check that, four...the "Blog de Innuendo" was shut down due to QZers getting Brian's webmaster involved). It's not like this stuff isn't out there in crappy MP3 format already, so why should QZ continue to cater to those who don't care about preserving the file quality for future generations, just so long as they get it all, and they get it now? |
| Mr. Scully 09.11.2007 17:02 |
Most of you don't get the main point. There is no problem with MP3's and there is no problem with sharing MP3's on this forum either. The ONLY problem is people who burn MP3 to audioCD's. As long as there are two versions of the same recording (MP3 and FLAC) which are basically equal to each other (at least for us who don't hear any difference), nobody has any right to complain. Only when the MP3s get converted again and again, it becomes a real problem. Don't fight against people who share MP3. Fight against those who have MP3's and burn them on audioCD's or convert into FLAC. |
| The Real Wizard 09.11.2007 17:08 |
Mr. Scully wrote: Don't fight against people who share MP3. Fight against those who have MP3's and burn them on audioCD's or convert into FLAC.Of course, nothing is stopping anyone from creating mp3 from FLAC. But there's a better chance that someone will burn shared mp3s to CD, rather than convert FLAC to mp3 and then burn to CD. Most of you don't get the main point. There is no problem with MP3's and there is no problem with sharing MP3's on this forum either.No... the main point is to spread the best and ONLY the best version of each recording. I really don't understand why this is such a hard concept for some people to grasp. If it is known that the best version of a recording is circulating, then there should be no reason to have an inferior one thrown into the mix. |
| Ale Solan 09.11.2007 18:19 |
Burn FLAC straight to Audio CD using Nero by installing this: Cole2k Media Nero Audio Plugin Pack 1.5.3 link |
| Bobby_brown 09.11.2007 20:34 |
edit |
| Serry... 10.11.2007 03:07 |
Thunderbolt<br><h6>Courtesy of God wrote: You really are overdramatizing this, aren't you? Calling FLAC supporters "Nazis," and suggesting that we're telling MP3 supporters to die? I'll take you much more seriously when you quit taking the basic issue here (quality of shared files) and turning it into baseless, personal attacks against those of us who want some kind of quality standards here.I've already answered about "nazis" = "FLAC supporters", just open the previous page. And no - I'm not overdramatizing - there were plenty of "ban him", "you're in the minority, I'm happy", "we've [who the fuck is "we"? I wasn't in that commission who made new standards for QZ, so it's not "we"] got the new standards of the quality to QZ" in this thread. Again - just open the previous pages and read! Thunderbolt<br><h6>Courtesy of God wrote: I bet you can find one within ten minutes of searching--I know of at least five (ok, check that, four...the "Blog de Innuendo" was shut down due to QZers getting Brian's webmaster involved). It's not like this stuff isn't out there in crappy MP3 format already, so why should QZ continue to cater to those who don't care about preserving the file quality for future generations, just so long as they get it all, and they get it now?Some of the people who complains here about mp3s - I can't see them in other forums even (except very few). I have never seen them in General, Serious forums. In Request sometimes they appears though. They come to QZ to download shows in FLAC, trade them and have a good time. I'm not that kind of the QZer, but now those guys tell me that I should leave this forum and find another place for me, because they got another standards for the quality of what should be on QZ and what shouldn't. Brilliant! I'm awaiting for the new orders, Sir! |
| Mr. Scully 10.11.2007 05:33 |
Sir GH<br><h6>ah yeah</h6> wrote: Of course, nothing is stopping anyone from creating mp3 from FLAC. But there's a better chance that someone will burn shared mp3s to CD, rather than convert FLAC to mp3 and then burn to CD.Yeah but with the same logic there's a better chance that people with CD burners will burn MP3 to audioCD :-) Surely we can't ban people with CD burners? I do get your point and I understand why you are angry about those x-th generations of MP3 files. But as long as the MP3's are made from the best available recording, it should be okay - people with slow internet connections usually don't want FLAC. And yes, separating this forum into two (DVD+FLAC versus VCD+MP3) might perhaps help. |
| Fat Lizzy 10.11.2007 08:27 |
Mr. Scully wrote: And yes, separating this forum into two (DVD+FLAC versus VCD+MP3) might perhaps help.We all know that won't happen... Finally there is someone who wants to stand up against the crap that is being posted here (crap = LOSSY FILES). Especially when someone ignores requests of posters of good files I think it is time to take action. There is no use in time-waisting discussions about this subject. There needs to be a solution and it needs to come soon. Bob, you know I'm on your side... We'll talk on msn cus I'm kinda like wasting my time here with these discussions. |
| The Real Wizard 10.11.2007 10:20 |
Mr. Scully wrote: Yeah but with the same logic there's a better chance that people with CD burners will burn MP3 to audioCD :-) Surely we can't ban people with CD burners?Hahaha... yes, yes... this is true. But it's just a question of courtesy. Most people will happily comply out of respect for the people who went through the trouble to make the recording available. There will always be an ignorant few. I do get your point and I understand why you are angry about those x-th generations of MP3 files. But as long as the MP3's are made from the best available recording, it should be okay - people with slow internet connections usually don't want FLAC.Have a look at this lineage for a second... Master video > TV > DVD (x) > WAV > 128kbps mp3 > WAV > 128 kbps mp3 > WAV > 128kbps mp3 Here is a short file with 4 versions of the same few seconds from the Munich 78 video: link The first one is unaltered WAV, the next bit is one generation of mp3, then two generations, and finally three. Everyone should be able to hear the difference, even in the first generation of mp3, never mind the third one! If there are people who can't hear the difference, all I can say is, those who notice and care about the difference shouldn't have to cater to those who don't. The point is to preserve the quality, not to take away from it. If someone has a slow connection, then the recordings shouldn't have to be destroyed suit their needs. If they want to hear the music, then they can make some contacts (on your website, even!) and trade through the mail. That's how I did it for many years, so other people can do it too. |
| Serry... 10.11.2007 10:42 |
"If someone has a slow connection, then the recordings shouldn't have to be destroyed suit their needs." Their needs should be destroyed to suit your fears, needs and needs of other traders/collectors, we all got that point. "If they want to hear the music, then they can make some contacts (on your website, even!) and trade through the mail" If they want to hear the music in mp3 whom I must ask about it on Martin's site? Give me some names of the persons who'll send everything what a newbie fan might ask (not for trade, just for personal listening). Isn't it obvious that when you'll hide mp3s from the most popular Queen forum - it'll help to spread more of the mp3-sourced CDs? If everyone can download the show in mp3 (first copy from flac) - what's the need for someone to trade home-burned CDs when the show is available on the site? "That's how I did it for many years, so other people can do it too." I have downloaded and uploaded mp3s on QZ for many years, so other people can do it too. Wouldn't it be easier to ask Richard to add "AND CRAPPY MP3S" to "DO NOT POST OFFICIAL MATERIAL OR LINKS TO OFFICIAL MATERIAL HERE" instead of bitching with each other? Most of the discussions will be over, it's his site in the end... |
| The Real Wizard 10.11.2007 10:49 |
Serry... wrote: "If someone has a slow connection, then the recordings shouldn't have to be destroyed suit their needs." Their needs should be destroyed to suit your fears, needs and needs of other traders/collectors, we all got that point.Nice try, twisting the words like that. After you spend years searching for recordings and sharing them, maybe you understand why I'm saying the things I say. People who support mp3 have one thing in common: They ignore all the logic, and only reply to things where there are any possible loopholes. You can't possibly deny the fact that the file I shared has been damaged with each mp3 generation, and that's why you didn't reply to it. You're fighting a losing battle. It's over. Stop wasting your time and mine. Technology wins... antiquated views lose. Most communities finished having this debate years ago... it's about time the Queen community caught up. We're getting there! |
| Serry... 10.11.2007 11:03 |
"Nice try, twisting the words like that. After you spend years searching for recordings and sharing them, maybe you understand why I'm saying the things I say." So many "I"s, that it proves that I wasn't twisting words. You spent many years - so now we should change our views and habits. "You can't possibly deny the fact that the file I shared has been damaged with each mp3 generation, and that's why you didn't reply to it." I can't deny, but I replied. There's no need in the chain WAV->mp3->WAV->mp3-> etc. if the first mp3 copy is available for everyone. "Stop wasting your time and mine." A little bit arrogant, but okay. You spent many years on researching, so I'm not good enough to discuss with you, shit, I had to realise it before I started to post here. By the way, I'm sorry - once I sent you mp3 file (not over the post mail, I'm sorry about it too), I hope on one day you'll forgive me for that. There was not any bad intentions from me, just my stupidity. And for other QZers - I'm sorry guys, after the Moscow performance of Bri and Rog I've upload it on QZ in mp3 (and as I know that my recording is still circulating in the Hub). I'm sorry. You may hang me. I'll bring the rope. |
| The Real Wizard 10.11.2007 11:17 |
Serry... wrote: I can't deny, but I replied. There's no need in the chain WAV->mp3->WAV->mp3-> etc. if the first mp3 copy is available for everyone.But how do you know if it's the first copy? Who would moderate that? Even so, the first gen of mp3 still sounds bad anyway. "Stop wasting your time and mine." A little bit arrogant, but okay.It's not arrogant. I'm simply stating facts which technology has provided for us. This discussion is definitely a waste of everyone's time. Lossless audio was introduced years ago as a replacement for lossy audio. It's only now that most people here are finally catching on. Come on... let's not make this personal, playing the defeatist card and all. I and the many others here are speaking with everyone's best interests in mind. I've said it a million times before, and I'll say it again... mp3 is necessary ONLY if the lossless version isn't available. There is NO point in spreading a lossy version when the better version is readily available. ONE copy should circulate... the best one! I'll never understand how anyone could be happy with an inferior copy if they know a better one exists. If some people are satisfied with a worse version, then they are free to create a worse version for their own use. This is the way that EVERY thriving trading community works. I don't understand why it's only some Queen collectors who somehow feel different. The Royal Orleans and Yeeshkul forums aren't doing well because they share mp3s... that's for sure. I'm out. I've spent way too much time discussing this. |
| Serry... 10.11.2007 11:33 |
"But how do you know if it's the first copy? Who would moderate that?" You. "Hey, guys, here's Cologne '79 in FLAC, and especially for you old fool Serry - here's mp3, first copy by me!". I already wrote about it before. If you think that after downloading I'll start to re-convert it 27 times for re-upload on QZ, you're wrong. And if I'll do so even, I'll be wrong if someone will ever download it since your copy is available on the same site. (you don't have to upload the show in all available formats, but since it's uploaded - you can't stop people to convert it, they'll upload mp3 version on other sites, trade it, whatever else, only way to save the quality, IMHO - to make mp3 version by yourself and upload it) "Come on... let's not make this personal, playing the defeatist card and all." Why not? You've asked to ban Mike, wasn't it personal? I agree with you, Bob, you have all rights on your upload - if you ask people to not convert it into mp3, they should respect your wish. But this is not about the quality. "I and the many others here are speaking with everyone's best interests in mind." Yours. Yours best interests. And many many many other guys too. But there is that 'minority' whose interests are different to yours and since we're not in the nazi or communistic land (where I was by the way!) - let's respect that 'minority' too, and their interests. "I'll never understand how anyone could be happy with an inferior copy if they know a better one exists." Because you're a collector, some of the guys on QZ - are not. They wanna hear/share damned show and that's it. We all know why there are so many requests of Hannover '84 - is it because of fabulous performance? Is it because of their collectors' needs? No, man! Let's face the truth - there are not only collectors on the board and they don't need in FLAC. Maybe it's bad, maybe - who I am to judge? - but it is how it is. You have to deal with that. |
| The Real Wizard 10.11.2007 12:19 |
If some people's best interests are hearing a show in worse quality, then that's up to them. They can create the worse version on their own. Sharing lossy files is a dated method of file sharing. Chemists no longer practice alchemy, racism is no longer a good idea, and doctors no longer insist that illnesses are caused by demons. Simply put, some things become obsolete over time. Mp3 is one of them. It's time to accept it, and move on like every other decent trading community has. |
| Serry... 10.11.2007 12:32 |
"If some people's best interests are hearing a show in worse quality, then that's up to them. They can create the worse version on their own and do whatever else they'd like with them." They can't, because they can't download FLAC. C'mon, how many times should I repeat that? I won't buy the truck for making sedan out of it. But idea is right - if someone wants to smoke, let him do it whatever will happened with his health. It's not your business. Neither your business if I can't download FLAC - that's my problem, but that doesn't mean that I should be blamed by agressive FLAC supporters for my love towards small media formats. "It's time to accept it" Okay. Your suggestions? No newbies ("Oh! Cologne was already shared in FLAC?! I didn't know it! I thought it was one of those rare recordings which can be shared in mp3!")? Bans of old QZers who'd be involved in that mp3 sin? Private VIP-club "Queenzone"? Neuro-surgery of Queen fans' heads from other sites too? Instead of making a compromise between mp3 and FLAC supporters - you want radical changes. Doctors stopped to blame demons not in one day... |
| The Real Wizard 10.11.2007 12:33 |
If people can't download FLAC, then they can always trade through the post. I've already stated that.
Radical changes? Now you're getting a tad over-dramatic.
Serry... wrote: but that doesn't mean that I should be blamed by agressive FLAC supporters for my love towards small media formats.I see mp3 supporters as being aggressive, because they're the ones who are fighting the losing battle, not people who have accepted that we're in the year 2007. It's like calling a scientist aggressive for being vocal against someone who practices alchemy. |
| Serry... 10.11.2007 12:39 |
"If they can't download FLAC, then they can always trade through the post. I've already stated that." And you told me about modern technologies? How about carrier-pigeons? "Radical changes? Now you're getting a tad over-dramatic." For the last few years mp3 was okay for QZ, now it's not - because during a couple of months there were more of FLAC uploads than mp3 uploads, so we must ban mp3. If it's not radical, then I'm afraid for what is really radical for you. And you didn't answer my question about your suggestions. |
| Serry... 10.11.2007 12:42 |
"see mp3 supporters as being aggressive" FLAC supporters complains in every single thread with mp3 file inside, not vice versa... |
| The Real Wizard 10.11.2007 12:42 |
Serry... wrote: FLAC supporters complains in every single thread with mp3 file inside, not vice versa...Okay, do you have a point there. But it doesn't somehow make them wrong. If anything, it should indicate how much the change is needed, because more and more people are accepting its necessity. Serry... wrote: For the last few years mp3 was okay for QZ, now it's not - because during a couple of months there were more of FLAC uploads than mp3 uploads, so we must ban mp3. If it's not radical, then I'm afraid for what is really radical for you. And you didn't answer my question about your suggestions.Indeed, change does take time. But there have been more FLAC than mp3 uploads for the last year, not just the last couple months. Over that time, the majority of people have come to see the difference. Just look at all the people posting their support in this topic and beyond! Even if you insist on calling it a "radical change", so be it. Sometimes radical changes are the best ones. :) |
| Serry... 10.11.2007 12:59 |
So suggest something to the whole board and to Richard and Barb then. Not to your friends from the traders' circle, but to the whole board - "we should make this as a rule and make that as a rule". You're one of the veterans of the board and you probably remember that few years ago there were a lot of official uploads on QZ (I remember even that single version of It's A Beautiful Day was the last upload after which Richard came with that rule of not sharing official stuff here), but now it's prohibited. So if you really don't want mp3s here - you have to do something more than just statements and desires. And there won't be problems like that one with Mike then. And like this one with Serry. |
| The Real Wizard 10.11.2007 13:13 |
Serry... wrote: So if you really don't want mp3s here - you have to do something more than just statements and desires.Action is already being taken. We'll all know what's happening soon enough! |
| PROGTROL 10.11.2007 13:14 |
wtf... I completely agree 100% with Bob/Sr GH. As I stated before in a similair thread, trading lossless roio's is all about preserving Queen's live legacy for many generations to come and to honour and treasure the tapers efforts who gave us a 'glimpse' of what a great live-band Queen was. To trade lossy copies is IMHO a direct insult to the tapers/seeders wishes. Beside that, just because someone cannot hear (or understand) the difference between lossless or lossy music, doesn't mean that isn't any difference!!! just my 2 cents |
| Serry... 10.11.2007 13:26 |
Sir GH<br><h6>ah yeah</h6> wrote: Action is already being taken. We'll all know what's happening soon enough!So be patient, Bob, and wait for that moment. Let the sinners and Serry enjoy the last days of their mp3-paradise. |
| on my way up 10.11.2007 13:42 |
Sir GH<br><h6>ah yeah</h6> wrote:Listening to that sample was a horrible experience! I can hear the quality get worse every generation and I have bad ears:-) so everyone must hear it!Mr. Scully wrote: Yeah but with the same logic there's a better chance that people with CD burners will burn MP3 to audioCD :-) Surely we can't ban people with CD burners?Hahaha... yes, yes... this is true. But it's just a question of courtesy. Most people will happily comply out of respect for the people who went through the trouble to make the recording available. There will always be an ignorant few.I do get your point and I understand why you are angry about those x-th generations of MP3 files. But as long as the MP3's are made from the best available recording, it should be okay - people with slow internet connections usually don't want FLAC.Have a look at this lineage for a second... Master video > TV > DVD (x) > WAV > 128kbps mp3 > WAV > 128 kbps mp3 > WAV > 128kbps mp3 Here is a short file with 4 versions of the same few seconds from the Munich 78 video: link The first one is unaltered WAV, the next bit is one generation of mp3, then two generations, and finally three. Everyone should be able to hear the difference, even in the first generation of mp3, never mind the third one! If there are people who can't hear the difference, all I can say is, those who notice and care about the difference shouldn't have to cater to those who don't. The point is to preserve the quality, not to take away from it. If someone has a slow connection, then the recordings shouldn't have to be destroyed suit their needs. If they want to hear the music, then they can make some contacts (on your website, even!) and trade through the mail. That's how I did it for many years, so other people can do it too. |
| FriedChicken 11.11.2007 19:47 |
Double-U wrote: It´s so sad that we have to waste our time with stuff like this. Shame on you Gym Bitch! @Fried Chicken: Could you please stop writing such senceless coments? Thank you very much!I'm very serious! Anyone who who is kind enough to take time to convert big and not very userfriendly flac files to mp3 files, which are a slightly worse quality, but are smaller so even people with a slower connection can download them, and are userfriendlier so you can play them in iTunes or on your mp3 play, are really terrible people and should be hurt in the worst kind of way. I still don't see the problem. I understand that lossless files should be used for trading. But I don't understand why people without very fast connections should suffer. People who want to download mp3files because they have a slow connection obviously aren't hardcore collectors, and most likely not even traders. Cause if they were traders, I guess they want the best kind of quality. For me, when everything started to be in flac, the whole bootleg thing started to because less and less interesting. Because it took 5 times as long to download, and because if I wanted to play the songs on a cd player or mp3 player I had to convert ythem to Wave, and then back to Mp3. And i'm not a very big fan of Queen live, so I also didn't care that the quality was slightly better in flac. |
| FriedChicken 11.11.2007 19:50 |
I understand your point of view, but I hope you also understand mine. I also don't approve of mp3 files being trade (Cause if i was a collector I wanted the best kind of quality. You also don't send scratched cd's to someone) But I don't see why mp3 files can't be shared for people who don't have fast connections and for people who want to listen to these live recordings on their i pods |
| Queenrockyou 12.11.2007 03:40 |
Why mp3 can't be traded ? In my opinion, I would say because in the end only mp3 could be easily available, and so only lossy music. And also because the collectors won't share anymore their recordings if they are circulating in a lossy format... That is I think a good reason to care more about the Flac thing, which is the best way today to preserve music, and to share it and still be able to attract more Queen collectors, be they sharers or downloaders. Of course it is not that interesting for those who aren't fans, but Queenzone is a fan zone, so.. Of it is less interesting for those who, like me some months ago, weren't interested in Queen live, but hey, let's play the game of preserving music ! I converted my Flac files to Mp3 in the first days, as I was more used to use mp3, but then I quickly learned how to play them on my computer and so on, I bought an external drive (that was in my budget for 2007 anyway ;o)) and started to fully enjoy Queen live. I now know why mp3 is lesser quality than Flac, so I carefully choose the Flac downloads and contribute, at my small place, to preserve the music. I don't share for the moment, but if I plan to do so in the future then I'll be able to share my Flac files, that I kept aside. I burned them to CD-audio, and I can say you that I can listen to Queen live music without any problem, it never takes more minutes to burn them on Cd-audio because Nero is OK for Flac format (we just have to download a small and free add-on), and even if I can't easily hear the difference, I know I have made this with good quality lossless files, and i haven't contributed to destroy someone else's work : the band firstly, but also the tapers, the uploaders, the other fans... and I won't give to someone else mp3 files, who could themselves contribute to alter the sound , etc etc etc... I know I am not doing that without conscience. A sort of "maybe not that useful on the spot, but vital on a long-term point of view" also. Regards, Olivier. |
| The Real Wizard 26.11.2007 18:42 |